[Paint Touches] Playing Hauser was dumb and dangerous

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barfolomew · March 23, 2018, 12:22:25 PM

Quote from: Its DJOver on March 23, 2018, 10:45:27 AM
Wojo probably knew the question was going to be asked so we'll never know.

Wait, so Wojo was playing mind games... WITH HIMSELF??
<head explodes>

murara1994 · March 23, 2018, 12:51:22 PM

Quote from: pux90mex on March 23, 2018, 10:54:35 AM
It is I, the dumb and dangerous one. Appreciate the feedback. I think the problem is the headline, not the actual article.

But the reaction to a post that has barely 1000 reads is pretty funny. I've been called out by the SID on Twitter, told by the Admin to change the headline, and talked about on the radio for 10 minutes. Again, for a column that got less clicks than a an average post. It makes no sense to me.

You all read my stuff, what agenda would you say I promote? (I am lazy in the offseason, so guilty as charged. But ya'll never click on anything but Ryan's transfer tracker anyways.)

You forgot "journalistically lazy."

Benny B · March 23, 2018, 12:58:53 PM

Andrei - Congratulations.... it took a few years, but you finally got your own 8-page thread along with all of the other "kudos" from the MU passionate.

You are now an elite journalist, and I say that with complete sincerity. Well done.

muballbuster · March 23, 2018, 01:10:41 PM

I think the reason the coach is a little pissed at the article or the headline is because he does not want a potential recruit or family member of a recruit or a school competing for a recruit that MU is recruiting to have that be a negative mark against us and may be a partial reason we loose out on a recruit. I personally think the coaching staff did a good job handling the injuries to the team this year.

GooooMarquette · March 23, 2018, 01:25:33 PM

Quote from: muballbuster on March 23, 2018, 01:10:41 PM
I think the reason the coach is a little pissed at the article or the headline is because he does not want a potential recruit or family member of a recruit or a school competing for a recruit that MU is recruiting to have that be a negative mark against us and may be a partial reason we loose out on a recruit. I personally think the coaching staff did a good job handling the injuries to the team this year.

Never thought of that angle, but it makes sense. There's plenty of negative recruiting these days, so the last thing he'd want is an opposing coach showing a recruit that headline from a pro-MU blog. I can just hear the spin: "Son, do you really want to play for a coach who would abuse his players like that?"

Marqevans · March 23, 2018, 02:00:05 PM

Someone referred to the last 3 games as exhibition games. These were played like tournament games and if playing Sam with the doctor's blessing got a young team 3 tournament games of experience, I'm all for it.

Jay Bee · March 23, 2018, 03:08:22 PM

Quote from: Pakuni on March 22, 2018, 11:57:33 AM
First, the season doesn't start in six months. Practice doesn't even start in six months. The first team practice is seven months away. At earliest, the first game is about eight months away.

#FakeNews
#Lies

You need a calendar, bub

WarriorDad · March 24, 2018, 12:04:23 PM

Quote from: skianth16 on March 23, 2018, 10:52:29 AM
PT is an amateur blog. They write for free. The write about the team because....they're fans. They have no impact on the MU program.

Can anyone from PT tell us how many views that page got? I can guarantee it's far fewer than 6,000.

Do you ever get up on the right side of the bed? You're always so angry when someone disagrees with you.

Doesn't matter if it is an amateur blog, so are the same types of blogs for every team in the country and they reflect an opinion by some of the fan base. PT is a good site, but this article and the title of it was impugning the integrity of many people.

It is one thing to write an article saying how dumb a substitution is, or why we scheduled certain teams, or blew a game. This article was calling out the character of Marquette's doctors, training staff, coaching staff and Hauser + Hauser family. All without any experts, but merely an opinion. Even if PT had gone to a doctor for their opinion, any medical professional worth their stuff would decline because Mr. Hauser isn't their patient and would not share that information publicly.

This one was over the line because of the subject and the accusation. Wojo and staff should be plenty upset. PT should apologize in a blog statement.

Silkk the Shaka · March 24, 2018, 12:32:56 PM

Quote from: WarriorDad on March 24, 2018, 12:04:23 PM
Doesn't matter if it is an amateur blog, so are the same types of blogs for every team in the country and they reflect an opinion by some of the fan base. PT is a good site, but this article and the title of it was impugning the integrity of many people.

It is one thing to write an article saying how dumb a substitution is, or why we scheduled certain teams, or blew a game. This article was calling out the character of Marquette's doctors, training staff, coaching staff and Hauser + Hauser family. All without any experts, but merely an opinion. Even if PT had gone to a doctor for their opinion, any medical professional worth their stuff would decline because Mr. Hauser isn't their patient and would not share that information publicly.

This one was over the line because of the subject and the accusation. Wojo and staff should be plenty upset. PT should apologize in a blog statement.

In this context, how would you classify calling the players "choking dogs who pee themselves"?

Marcus92 · March 24, 2018, 12:34:00 PM

Quote from: WarriorDad on March 24, 2018, 12:04:23 PM
Doesn't matter if it is an amateur blog, so are the same types of blogs for every team in the country and they reflect an opinion by some of the fan base. PT is a good site, but this article and the title of it was impugning the integrity of many people.

It is one thing to write an article saying how dumb a substitution is, or why we scheduled certain teams, or blew a game. This article was calling out the character of Marquette's doctors, training staff, coaching staff and Hauser + Hauser family. All without any experts, but merely an opinion. Even if PT had gone to a doctor for their opinion, any medical professional worth their stuff would decline because Mr. Hauser isn't their patient and would not share that information publicly.

This one was over the line because of the subject and the accusation. Wojo and staff should be plenty upset. PT should apologize in a blog statement.

Agreed. The article asserted that Wojo and his staff don't have Sam's best interests at heart, without any knowledge or evidence to support that assertion. That is misinformed and lazy at the very least. I think you could argue there's an agenda, as well. The article didn't simply raise a question; it stated total speculation as fact, and maligned the MU basketball program without cause.

Backpedaling at this point is inadequate. The size of the audience and whether Wojo declined an interview request are irrelevant. The article was dumb and dangerous. PT should take it off the website and issue a full retraction and apology.

GooooMarquette · March 24, 2018, 01:40:09 PM

I took another look at the article (which I just skimmed the first time), and there is an unforgivable error: a complete misinterpretation of both the substance and relevance of one of the key citations.

Misinterpretation of the Substance

He quotes an article from the Orthopaedic Journal of Sports Medicine, and then goes on to totally miss the boat on what you can (and can't) take away from the publication. The study was a "descriptive epidemiological" study...which basically means it only looked at historical data relating to pelvis, hip and thigh injuries. Specifically, the article looked at reported injuries in the NBA from the 1988-89 through 2011-12 seasons. Then he quoted this passage:

The actual amount of intra-articular hip disorders may be underestimated, as the awareness of these disorders has increased only in the past decade. With the awareness of the types of injuries that occur in this region, injury prevention strategies focused on these may be beneficial to players and teams at all levels of competition, not only professional-level athletes.

And drew this conclusion:

So hip injuries are commonly underestimated....

WRONG!!!

The excerpt from the article simply told us that the authors felt hip injuries may have been underreported in the early part of the study (back in the 80s and 90s), and they explicitly told us why: because the awareness of these disorders has increased only in the past decade.

In other words, doctors now likely do a much better job at diagnosing and reporting these injures than they did in the past. So Sam's case was clearly not from the "underreporting" era.

Misinterpretation of the Relevance

The quoted passage was essentially telling us that doctors probably didn't diagnose and report hip injuries as much in the 80s and 90s because they weren't looking for them as much, so we should probably assume that the actual incidence today is higher than their study would indicate.

That is totally irrelevant to Sam's case...because Sam's hip injury had already been diagnosed.

So yeah...Wojo has a right to be angry because of the inflammatory headline, and beyond the headline, the "scientific data" was badly misused.

I don't care if you're working for the New York Times or just freelancing for some blog. If you want to develop and maintain any journalistic integrity, you have to understand the authorities you cite, and cite them only when they are relevant to your premise. Disappointing to say the least.

WarriorDad · March 24, 2018, 03:06:19 PM

Quote from: Ellenson Family Reunion on March 24, 2018, 12:32:56 PM
In this context, how would you classify calling the players "choking dogs who pee themselves"?

Give me the context, what does the phrase mean?

WarriorDad · March 24, 2018, 03:09:09 PM

Quote from: Marqevans on March 23, 2018, 02:00:05 PM
Someone referred to the last 3 games as exhibition games. These were played like tournament games and if playing Sam with the doctor's blessing got a young team 3 tournament games of experience, I'm all for it.

If someone is saying the last three games were exhibition games, they have an agenda more than likely. Tell Al McGuire the NIT was an exhibition game. Tell those kids crying in the locker room. A dumb but not dangerous comment.

real chili 83 · March 24, 2018, 03:40:35 PM

Quote from: Goose on March 23, 2018, 09:38:00 AM
Buzz sure knew message boards and blogs. I had several email exchanges with him over posts on Scoop. He knew what was out there, probably too much so.

Mrs Buzz would scour the internet looking for stuff on Buzz. Someone in the AD referred to it is an obsession.

MU82 · March 24, 2018, 04:02:40 PM

I just googled Marquette Sam Hauser injury. The paint touches piece was 24th on the list. Easily findable for those who either want to read it or use it for "evil."

GooooMarquette · March 24, 2018, 04:24:16 PM

Quote from: real chili 83 on March 24, 2018, 03:40:35 PM
Mrs Buzz would scour the internet looking for stuff on Buzz. Someone in the AD referred to it is an obsession.

She was probably expected to give a daily briefing.

skianth16 · March 24, 2018, 05:17:24 PM

Quote from: MU82 on March 24, 2018, 04:02:40 PM
I just googled Marquette Sam Hauser injury. The paint touches piece was 24th on the list. Easily findable for those who either want to read it or use it for "evil."

Is this part serious or tongue in cheek?

real chili 83 · March 24, 2018, 06:03:29 PM

Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 24, 2018, 04:24:16 PM
She was probably expected to give a daily briefing.

So that's what the William's called it.

GooooMarquette · March 24, 2018, 06:04:46 PM

Quote from: skianth16 on March 24, 2018, 05:17:24 PM
Is this part serious or tongue in cheek?

Might be a reference to the possibility that coaches might use it as a negative recruiting tactic. "Even their own fans think they endanger their players just for an extra win or two."

Silkk the Shaka · March 24, 2018, 06:32:44 PM

Quote from: WarriorDad on March 24, 2018, 03:06:19 PM
Give me the context, what does the phrase mean?

LOL @ Chicos playing dumb

You've publicly maligned players on a well-read MU blog before. It was disgusting, embarrassing, and completely agenda driven. Now you're on a high horse lecturing another blog. High comedy!

Jockey · March 24, 2018, 06:44:58 PM

Quote from: pux90mex on March 23, 2018, 10:54:35 AM
It is I, the dumb and dangerous one. Appreciate the feedback. I think the problem is the headline, not the actual article.

But the reaction to a post that has barely 1000 reads is pretty funny. I've been called out by the SID on Twitter, told by the Admin to change the headline, and talked about on the radio for 10 minutes. Again, for a column that got less clicks than a an average post. It makes no sense to me.

You all read my stuff, what agenda would you say I promote? (I am lazy in the offseason, so guilty as charged. But ya'll never click on anything but Ryan's transfer tracker anyways.)

I disagree with your point at the start of the thread, but that in no way means you are absolutely wrong.

I appreciate the opinion, even if it isn't what I believe. The last thing we want here is people posting what they want other people to like.

skianth16 · March 24, 2018, 08:23:25 PM

Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 24, 2018, 06:04:46 PM
Might be a reference to the possibility that coaches might use it as a negative recruiting tactic. "Even their own fans think they endanger their players just for an extra win or two."

This is ranging in tin foil hat territory. Anyone who sees that post as more than a single fan's view is crazy. They should definitely stay away from twitter. If recruits buy into the garbage online, they'd never be able to pick a school. Fans aren't reliable sources of information. I would assume recruits are fully aware of that.

WarriorDad · March 24, 2018, 10:40:56 PM

Quote from: skianth16 on March 24, 2018, 08:23:25 PM
This is ranging in tin foil hat territory. Anyone who sees that post as more than a single fan's view is crazy. They should definitely stay away from twitter. If recruits buy into the garbage online, they'd never be able to pick a school. Fans aren't reliable sources of information. I would assume recruits are fully aware of that.

17 year old boys will believe a lot of things.

It goes beyond that, without any professional backing the medical staff, the player, the coach, the staff were called not only into question, but accused of putting him at risk. That goes beyond having an opinion, that goes over the line. It is not as if they were ripping the staff for substitution patterns, the schedule, the plays drawn up, blowing a lead, playing man on man vs a zone. This was much more. PT is a good site, we should all have opinions, but when one is implying that a staff was putting a players well being in question without any proof or medical opinion to back it up, that is a different level.

MU82 · March 24, 2018, 11:13:23 PM

Quote from: skianth16 on March 24, 2018, 05:17:24 PM
Is this part serious or tongue in cheek?

Yes

skianth16 · March 24, 2018, 11:23:46 PM

Quote from: MU82 on March 24, 2018, 11:13:23 PM
Yes

I'm good with this.

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