[Paint Touches] Playing Hauser was dumb and dangerous

[PaintTouches]

I did not and do not have doctor creds, and never claimed as much. I work for a medical journal publisher, so I asked the publisher of our physical therapy journals for two publicly available sources regarding basketball or hip injuries and she suggested those two.

And no one is actually responding to the visual evidence. Everyone seems to agree he wasn't himself. The stats show that he was pretty poor coming off the hottest stretch of his career. Like I said in the post, if the stakes of the games were higher, it's worth the added risk. For the NIT, no way (even if it's minimal).

Oh and please don't disparage podcasters like that. They may have faces for radio, but I wish I had their dulcet tones. I'm just here hacking away in my attic.

[fjm]

I did not and do not have doctor creds, and never claimed as much. I work for a medical journal publisher, so I asked the publisher of our physical therapy journals for two publicly available sources regarding basketball or hip injuries and she suggested those two.

And no one is actually responding to the visual evidence. Everyone seems to agree he wasn't himself. The stats show that he was pretty poor coming off the hottest stretch of his career. Like I said in the post, if the stakes of the games were higher, it's worth the added risk. For the NIT, no way (even if it's minimal).

Oh and please don't disparage podcasters like that. They may have faces for radio, but I wish I had their dulcet tones. I'm just here hacking away in my attic.

Very valid point that the visual evidence certainly showed he was in pain and having troubles with his hip.

[GGGG]

I know exactly what the visual evidence showed.  He was clearly limited.  But that doesn't make it "dumb and dangerous" to play him.  If he wasn't risking long-term health, and he wanted to play, there was zero reason NOT to play him.

And I trust Marquette's doctors to make that determination long before I trust some dude who works for a medical journal publisher. 

[StillAWarrior]

This post has already gotten torn to shreds, and while I get it's an opinion piece, it's fairly wreckless.

I have no idea if it was intentional, but I absolutely love this.  What a great description of a post that is both a train wreck and reckless. 

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I have no idea if it was intentional, but I absolutely love this.  What a great description of a post that is both a train wreck and reckless.

If one was reckfull, would they be cautious and careful?

[We R Final Four]

For Sam, I thought/think the value of him playing in the NIT did not outweigh any microscopic chance of making his injury worse, or the slightly greater chance of incurring a separate, unrelated injury. I was saying as much before he even disclosed the injury required a 4-5 month recovery.

So your saying one of the reasons that Sam should not have played is that the possibility exists that he may have incurred a new, separate, unrelated injury?
Can't this be said of any athlete anywhere at anytime. Why not bench Theo, JC, Greg, Matty, Howard? They too may have been injured during that game. Sam could have stubbed his toe waking up that am, he could have tripped walking into the Al. There are all sorts of risks in this world, We can't sit Sam because he may have received an new unrelated injury.

[Pakuni]

I did not and do not have doctor creds, and never claimed as much. I work for a medical journal publisher, so I asked the publisher of our physical therapy journals for two publicly available sources regarding basketball or hip injuries and she suggested those two.

And no one is actually responding to the visual evidence. Everyone seems to agree he wasn't himself. The stats show that he was pretty poor coming off the hottest stretch of his career. Like I said in the post, if the stakes of the games were higher, it's worth the added risk. For the NIT, no way (even if it's minimal).

Again, you're claiming based on no actual medical knowledge or knowledge of Sam's injury that there was an "added risk." The evidence of this added risk exists only in your imagination. In fact, what we actually do know is indicative that there was no added risk. He's had this condition for months, and yet he - presumably with input from his doctors, trainers, family and coaching staff - continued to play, and at times played quite well.
Do you honestly believe you care more about Sam's health and long-term outlook than he, the coaching staff, the medical staff and his family do?

[Bocephys]

If one was reckfull, would they be cautious and careful?

[Eldon]

Again, you're claiming based on no actual medical knowledge or knowledge of Sam's injury that there was an "added risk." The evidence of this added risk exists only in your imagination. In fact, what we actually do know is indicative that there was no added risk. He's had this condition for months, and yet he - presumably with input from his doctors, trainers, family and coaching staff - continued to play, and at times played quite well.
Do you honestly believe you care more about Sam's health and long-term outlook than he, the coaching staff, the medical staff and his family do?

Would playing have helped his hip?

I'll spare you; the answer is no.

Best case scenario is his hip is just as injured as it was pre-NIT.  IMO, you get this kid on the operating table ASAP.

[GGGG]

Would playing have helped his hip?

I'll spare you; the answer is no.

Best case scenario is his hip is just as injured as it was pre-NIT.  IMO, you get this kid on the operating table ASAP.

So you are bitching about two weeks?  It's insignificant.

[Pakuni]

Would playing have helped his hip?

I'll spare you; the answer is no.

Best case scenario is his hip is just as injured as it was pre-NIT.  IMO, you get this kid on the operating table ASAP.

What difference does that make?
Obviously Sam believed the experience of playing in the NIT was more valuable to him than being ready for next season in early August instead of mid-August. I tend to agree.

[StillAWarrior]

Dumb and Dangerous.

Dumbgerous?

[MUDPT]

So you are bitching about two weeks?  It's insignificant.

I don't know how significant 2 weeks is. But it isn't significant. Ask any rehabilitation professional, you have a professional athlete who needs to be back in October. Can they wait two weeks? Probably. Would you rather then have the surgery ASAP? Absolutely, yes.

[Warrior2008]

So you are bitching about two weeks?  It's insignificant.

I trust the doctors and Wojo in making the call that Sam couldn't make the injury worse by playing, but two weeks isn't insignificant if its a 5 month rehab.  If he gets in the OR by April 1, that puts him back in September barring any setbacks.  Practice starts a month later with games two months later.  IMO the more time between surgery and the start of practice next year, the better.  Especially if the alternative is playing in some meaningless NIT games.

[Pakuni]

I trust the doctors and Wojo in making the call that Sam couldn't make the injury worse by playing, but two weeks isn't insignificant if its a 5 month rehab.  If he gets in the OR by April 1, that puts him back in September barring any setbacks.  Practice starts a month later with games two months later.  IMO the more time between surgery and the start of practice next year, the better.  Especially if the alternative is playing in some meaningless NIT games.

Sam and those around him knew all this. This is not breaking news to them. And with this knowledge, he decided that playing in these "meaningless" games was more important to him than being ready 10 weeks before Madness instead of 8 weeks before Madness.
I don't think that's wrong, by the way. Three games against quality opponents in a tournament setting is far more valuable to a player's development than two extra weeks of individual workouts.

[Warrior2008]

Sam and those around him knew all this. This is not breaking news to them. And with this knowledge, he decided that playing in these "meaningless" games was more important to him than being ready 10 weeks before Madness instead of 8 weeks before Madness.
I don't think that's wrong, by the way. Three games against quality opponents in a tournament setting is far more valuable to a player's development than two extra weeks of individual workouts.

I'm not shocked Sam wanted to play, he's an incredible competitor and an invaluable member of the team.  The reality is most athletes with Sam's makeup want to play if given the option. 

My point was that in a 5 month rehab, two weeks is not something to just dismiss when the season starts in 6 months.  Your timeline assumes everything goes great and if that's the case, then I would agree that playing in the NIT would have some value for Sam.  But if there are setbacks or the rehab takes longer, then that time would be better served post surgery.  Perhaps that's being overly cautious, but next year's team has the chance to be special and Sam is one of the key components to that happening.  Having him start the season less than 100% is a recipe for disaster.

[Its DJOver]

I'm not shocked Sam wanted to play, he's an incredible competitor and an invaluable member of the team.  The reality is most athletes with Sam's makeup want to play if given the option. 

My point was that in a 5 month rehab, two weeks is not something to just dismiss when the season starts in 6 months. Your timeline assumes everything goes great and if that's the case, then I would agree that playing in the NIT would have some value for Sam.  But if there are setbacks or the rehab takes longer, then that time would be better served post surgery.

The timeline assumes that everything goes normal.  He could end up taking longer to fully recover, he could also be back sooner.  As long as the timeline has him back by the beginning of next season, I don't think the extra two weeks is that large of a risk.

[Pakuni]

My point was that in a 5 month rehab, two weeks is not something to just dismiss when the season starts in 6 months.  Your timeline assumes everything goes great and if that's the case, then I would agree that playing in the NIT would have some value for Sam.  But if there are setbacks or the rehab takes longer, then that time would be better served post surgery.  Perhaps that's being overly cautious, but next year's team has the chance to be special and Sam is one of the key components to that happening.  Having him start the season less than 100% is a recipe for disaster.

First, the season doesn't start in six months. Practice doesn't even start in six months. The first team practice is seven months away. At earliest, the first game is about eight months away. There's already a 2-3 month cushion built into the rehab process, but you're worried about two weeks being a "100 percent recipe for disaster?"
C'mon. If Sam is still having problems by the time the season rolls around, I would suggest that the issue is far more severe than what two extra weeks of rehab could have addressed.

Ultimately, it comes down to what's more valuable: three real games against real opponents in a March tournament, or two weeks of individual workouts in August.

[brewcity77]

My point was that in a 5 month rehab, two weeks is not something to just dismiss when the season starts in 6 months.

Math not really a strong suit here? March is the third month of the year. The season starts in November, the eleventh month. That's 8 months. Even if you are counting Marquette Madness, that's 7 months away. I get things could go wrong, but we're hearing 4-5 months. So he's got about 2-3 extra months if something goes wrong.

[jesmu84]

For those that wanted Sam to get surgery earlier and skip the NIT...

Do you also support players of any sport skipping "meaningless" games so as to avoid injury or work toward optimal health for the next year? I'm specifically thinking of college fb players skipping non-playoff bowl games, but I'm sure there are other examples - the NIT being one.

It's an interesting dichotomy because there is a segment of people who think that skipping bowl games equates to being a bad teammate, etc.

[🏀]

Big Daddy?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

For those that wanted Sam to get surgery earlier and skip the NIT...

Do you also support players of any sport skipping "meaningless" games so as to avoid injury or work toward optimal health for the next year? I'm specifically thinking of college fb players skipping non-playoff bowl games, but I'm sure there are other examples - the NIT being one.

It's an interesting dichotomy because there is a segment of people who think that skipping bowl games equates to being a bad teammate, etc.

There is a difference between skipping a game because you are injured and it could get worse and skipping a game because there is a chance you might get injured.

I also think there's a difference between football and basketball because of the nature of the game.

If I was on a team, and my teammate said he wasn't playing because he might get injured, I would be pissed. I would understand his reasons but in my mind he made a commitment to the university and the team and is now going back on that.

[bilsu]

I do not consider the NIT meaningless games.

Potential injury did not stop Joey from playing football or playing AAU ball after concussions or ankle injury. It is in the Hausers' DNA to play no matter what.

[jesmu84]

There is a difference between skipping a game because you are injured and it could get worse and skipping a game because there is a chance you might get injured.

I also think there's a difference between football and basketball because of the nature of the game.

If I was on a team, and my teammate said he wasn't playing because he might get injured, I would be pissed. I would understand his reasons but in my mind he made a commitment to the university and the team and is now going back on that.

This keeps getting thrown around with zero evidence.

Understood on the rest of your post.

[Warrior Code]

If I started my account today, it would probably be called Dumb & Dangerous