Matta out at Ohio State--who's in?

[GGGG]

Ohio State, in basketball terms, isn't in the same zip code as Kansas. I'm not sure they're even in the same state.

First, that's not really the point.  The point is moving into better situations don't reflect poorly on the conference.  They are simply better situations.

Second, Ohio State is a better program than you are giving them credit for.

[brewcity77]

First, that's not really the point.  The point is moving into better situations don't reflect poorly on the conference.  They are simply better situations.

Second, Ohio State is a better program than you are giving them credit for.

Kansas is a top-5 program. Duke, Kentucky, UNC, maybe UCLA are their only comparables. That's not a knock at tOSU, they just aren't in that league nor even close to it. They're a top-25 or so program. Along with programs like Maryland, Villanova, Marquette, and Florida. Good enough to be excellent when the circumstance is right, but there's a clear divide between them and the true blue bloods.

[brewcity77]

And my money is on LaVall Jordan getting Butler. If so, it'll be very interesting to see what happens across town.

[fjm]

And my money is on LaVall Jordan getting Butler. If so, it'll be very interesting to see what happens across town.

Todd Townsend for HC at UWM.

[GoldenWarrior11]

And my money is on LaVall Jordan getting Butler. If so, it'll be very interesting to see what happens across town.

Nah.  Travis Steele from Xavier.  Top recruiter, Butler alum. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

And my money is on LaVall Jordan getting Butler. If so, it'll be very interesting to see what happens across town.

Will be interesting. Butler has shown a pattern of promoting from within. Matta, Lickliter, Stevens, and Holtmann were all promoted from Butler assistant to head coach. The only one who wasn't was Brandon Miller who was a bit of a train wreck (and a former assistant at Butler). Do they go with the former assistant Jordan, who finished last in the Horizon in his first season, but was win away from winning the conference tournament? Or do they go with one of their current assistants? Terry Johnson has spent 11 seasons at Butler. Mike Schrage has 10 years of experience as an assistant, plus 6 years as Director of Basketball Operations at blue blooded Duke. This late in the game I could see them going with the in house option.

[nyg]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19587102/ohio-state-buckeyes-hire-coach-chris-holtmann-away-butler-bulldogs

[brewcity77]

I recall Jordan being one of the names bandied about when they went for Miller. I don't think taking over Jeter's trainwreck would be held against him.

[GGGG]

Will be interesting. Butler has shown a pattern of promoting from within. Matta, Lickliter, Stevens, and Holtmann were all promoted from Butler assistant to head coach. The only one who wasn't was Brandon Miller who was a bit of a train wreck (and a former assistant at Butler). Do they go with the former assistant Jordan, who finished last in the Horizon in his first season, but was win away from winning the conference tournament? Or do they go with one of their current assistants? Terry Johnson has spent 11 seasons at Butler. Mike Schrage has 10 years of experience as an assistant, plus 6 years as Director of Basketball Operations at blue blooded Duke. This late in the game I could see them going with the in house option.

Brandon Miller was promoted from within.  He was hired as an assistant just a few months before Stevens left for the Celtics.

[Loose Cannon]

  Just for Fun.  Is it allowed for Shane Heirman to leave DePaul for HC at Butler? 

[Wade for President]

How bout a swap....Thad Matta back to coach Butler???

Naturally it's rather unlikely, but not totally out of the question. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

https://twitter.com/AdamZagoria/status/873170868364554242

Sources: Butler's list for interviews will include Ryan Pedon, Micah Shrewsberry, Matt Graves and LaVall Jordan.

All current and former Butler assistants.

[GGGG]

How bout a swap....Thad Matta back to coach Butler???

Naturally it's rather unlikely, but not totally out of the question. 

He was an assistant under current AD Barry Collier.  That would be something.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

F butler i greatly dislike that little s#it program. 

[The Thing]

Did anyone else notice Holtmann's written statement when he was talking about leaving Butler and stated "It's Butler". It sent a chill down my spine as it mirrored the famous Tom Crean "It's Indiana" statement.

[warriorchick]

F butler i greatly dislike that little s#it program.

Really?  I would have to say it is my second favorite team in the BEast.  All the Butler fans I know are pretty cool people, and the program appears to be both strong and squeaky clean.

[wadesworld]

Kansas is a top-5 program. Duke, Kentucky, UNC, maybe UCLA are their only comparables. That's not a knock at tOSU, they just aren't in that league nor even close to it. They're a top-25 or so program. Along with programs like Maryland, Villanova, Marquette, and Florida. Good enough to be excellent when the circumstance is right, but there's a clear divide between them and the true blue bloods.

OSU is unquestionably a top 15 program.

Marquette has 3 Final Four appearances and 1 National title with 4 conference titles.  2 of those 3 FFs and the only Title came 40 years ago.  Florida has 5 FFs and 2 Titles with 5 conference titles, Nova is the same with 11 conference titles.  Maryland has 2 FFs and 1 title with 6 conference titles.  Ohio State has been to 11 Final Fours and won 1 Title to go along with 22 conference titles.  Kansas has 14 FFs and 3 titles with a beserk amount of conference titles.  Ohio State is pretty clearly much closer to Kansas than Marquette or Maryland are to Ohio State, and I would pretty easily argue Ohio State is a step above all of Nova, Marquette, Florida, and Maryland.  Is OSU a true blue blood?  Debatable.  But I don't think it's even debatable that Marquette or Maryland are even close to on par with OSU, and I personally don't think FL or Nova are on that same level either.

[Silkk the Shaka]

Really?  I would have to say it is my second favorite team in the BEast.  All the Butler fans I know are pretty cool people, and the program appears to be both strong and squeaky clean.

Yeah... Butler is like the least hateable program ever.

[bradley center bat]

That's why Dayton should be in the Big East. Everyone would agree, the Flyers, the most hated team in the Big East. 

[We R Final Four]

Butler is in Indy.
Indy is relatively close to Bloomington.
Luke went to Bloomington for a semester.
MSK really dislikes Luke.
Therefore, due to proximity to Luke's old school........MSK dislikes Butler.

[brewcity77]

OSU is unquestionably a top 15 program.

Marquette has 3 Final Four appearances and 1 National title with 4 conference titles.  2 of those 3 FFs and the only Title came 40 years ago...

...Ohio State has been to 11 Final Fours and won 1 Title to go along with 22 conference titles.

Of which 8 Final Fours, the national title, and 13 conference titles were over 45 years ago. If this were the early 70s, you'd be right. But it's not. This isn't your grandfather's Ohio State, and they aren't close to being a blue blood anymore.

[MU82]

I am past worrying about rooting for all BE teams to do as well as they possibly can and the BE to show well to prove itself. The BE has proven itself. It has a national title. It's put 70% of its teams into the NCAA Tourney. It's had dominating non-conference seasons and wins. It has a huge TV contract. The BE does not need to prove anything anymore. The only people that think it needs to prove anything are the fans of the teams in the conference. Anybody who says it's a midmajor conference is just saying it to get those people riled up.

The fact of the matter is football schools will be more attractive even to basketball coaches a majority of the time. Football is where the money is. Football drives all NCAA decisions. Basketball only schools are going to lose good coaches to football schools. That's just the nature of NCAA athletics and it isn't changing. But the BE has no control of that and has proven itself to be anything but a midmajor. I'm not one bit worried about a coach leaving a BE school for the B1G and what it does to the reputation of the conference. Holtman leaving Butler for OSU changes nobody's opinion of the BE except for the chicken little BE fans. For anyone else it's just common sense. More money, better resources, better job. Simple. Just like if Jay Wright moved on and Nova hired Clemson's basketball coach to take his place it doesn't mean the ACC sucks and can't keep its coaches and is a stepping stone, midmajor conference. It means Villanova's basketball coaching job is a better job than Clemson's. Simple as that.

I agree with all of this, wades. Nicely stated.

A couple of asides ...

McDermott's decision underscores the point that not every coach aspires to reach the highest levels (or at least the perceived highest levels). Once upon a time, the only way a coach could get recognition and riches was to go to one of the top programs. That no longer is the case. McDermott likely already has more money than he can ever spend, and he is well-respected nationally. On top of that, he gets to live in a low-cost area that he has grown to love, he is liked by a fervent fanbase, and he faces much less pressure than coaches at places like Ohio State do. (There is always pressure, but it is far less for McCormick at CU than it would have been for McCormick at OSU.) The fit is right for him at Creighton, he has been recruiting pretty darn well, and he can compete for conference titles and NCAA bids most years. In the end, it probably was a pretty easy decision for him.

I am happy for Holtmann, and if this is what he wants he deserves the shot. I think he'll do well there, and Butler probably will hire a very good replacement for him.

If Self leaving Illinois for Kansas isn't a sign that Illinois is inferior, is Williams leaving for UNC a sign that Kansas is inferior? I know ... extenuating circumstances for the former Tar Heel, but still - a coach DID leave one of the 5 or 10 programs that is on everybody's list of all-time bluebloods. It happens. Something similar will happen again one day.

[🏀]

That's why Dayton should be in the Big East. Everyone would agree, the Flyers, the most hated team in the Big East. 

GTFO.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Butler is in Indy.
Indy is relatively close to Bloomington.
Luke went to Bloomington for a semester.
MSK really dislikes Luke.
Therefore, due to proximity to Luke's old school........MSK dislikes Butler.

Nah its the fact that 5 or so yrs ago they were in the horizon and now their fanbase sees them on par or above the otherBE programs. This will knock them down a peg or two.  I think they over achieved the last few years based on the coach who i think was really really good

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Yeah... Butler is like the least hateable program ever.

Meh. I personally had a run in with some nasty and vulgar Butler fans in Maui a few years back. Put a bad taste in my mouth for all things Butler. I enjoy watching them lose more than most of the Big East programs. To each their own!