2018 NFC North/NFL thread

[GGGG]

I don't have time to look up the stats, but would it be fair to say Packer fans are skewed because he played worse against us than other teams? I seem to remember hearing a lot of how Cutler could never figure out the Capers defense (one of the few it seems) and that it always caused him problems.

I don't think this has been updated for the past couple years but...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZWrf6kgs7Q

[Shaka Shart]

I don't have time to look up the stats, but would it be fair to say Packer fans are skewed because he played worse against us than other teams? I seem to remember hearing a lot of how Cutler could never figure out the Capers defense (one of the few it seems) and that it always caused him problems.

I think he's an average QB. Didn't he have a ton of different coordinators early on and with Chicago? He didn't help his cause with dumb throws and his demeanor, but he's not nearly as bad as many Packer fans make him out to be. It's just more fun to talk about him like he is that bad. I know I enjoy the running jokes.

The sullen attitude never helped. He had Martz who gave away a top 5 tight end and wouldn't allow him to audible, and trestman who couldn't draw up a game plan if he had a gun held to his head and blew up the locker room. Then Fox came along which is 3 different offensive strategies right there. Combine that with an aging defense that always caused pressure to play catch-up on the scoreboard, you have a recipe for many turnovers. He will always be average to slightly above average depending on what Cutler era you are looking at. I was told last season that the bears would be better off with Osweiler than Cutler at QB. I'm not sure I have ever been visibly upset over a sports take until then. I will never defend Jay as being truly good, but to throw him in with the likes of Osweiler, Weeden, and Gabbert is just pure ignorance or homerism.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I don't think this has been updated for the past couple years but...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZWrf6kgs7Q

I remember think the interception by Jolly was the funniest thing ever.

[wadesworld]

In no way, shape or form does pulling a couple stats make me "very wrong" about Cutler being better than many believe.

In fact, if you want to cherry-pick stats then I can counter with Cutler's QB Rating, which is higher than Eli Manning, Donovan McNabb, Alex Smith, Joe Flacco, Steve McNair, Marc Bulger, Jim Kelly, Matt Hasselbeck...the list goes on. Oh, and it's higher than Brett Favre's QB Rating while in GB.

We can continue to pull stats like this all day or we can simply agree that you think Cutler was horrible and sane, rational people who understand football will disagree with that assessment.

Out of a job at 34. 1 Playoff win in his life. Call me insane or irrational or having no football knowledge all you want. He ain't (I guess we can change tenses to wasn't now that he isn't employed in that profession anymore) very good.

[barfolomew]

I don't think this has been updated for the past couple years but...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZWrf6kgs7Q

As a Bears fan, the only thing more depressing than that video is this list:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/chi/career-receiving.htm

The Cleveland Browns have six players ahead of the Bears first.
The Jacksonville Jaguars, IN EXISTENCE SINCE 1995 MIND YOU, have two.

[MerrittsMustache]

Out of a job at 34. 1 Playoff win in his life. Call me insane or irrational or having no football knowledge all you want. He ain't (I guess we can change tenses to wasn't now that he isn't employed in that profession anymore) very good.

I don't have to call you any of those things. You prove it yourself just about every time you post about Cutler.

Lynn Dickey had 1 playoff win yet he's somehow in the Packers HOF. Was he not very good?

Tony Romo only had 2 playoffs wins. Was he not very good?

Carson Palmer has 1. Is he not very good?

Andy Dalton and Matthew Stafford have 0. Are they not very good?

[Hards Alumni]

Packer fan here.

I loved Jay Cutler when he was a Bronco.  He was a good QB with a great arm and decent accuracy.  Was he sort of full of himself?  Sure, but that is fine... he was backing it up.  When he came to Chicago a ton of expectations were put on his shoulders.  He seemed ready for the challenge.  But in all honesty, Jay was never given a fair deal in Chicago.  He was surrounded by awful teams and his coaching staff was constantly changing.  He walked into a dumpster fire of an organization and nothing changed for the positive the entire time he was there.  Did he have some good WRs to throw it to?  Sure, but the OL couldn't stop anything.  The game was rigged against Jay from the start.  Did he do himself any favors with his attitude?  Absolutely not, but it was likely the first time in his life that he wasn't winning almost every game and he did not handle it well.

Jay was definitely an above average QB that was a victim of circumstance.

[GB Warrior]

Packer fan here.

I loved Jay Cutler when he was a Bronco.  He was a good QB with a great arm and decent accuracy.  Was he sort of full of himself?  Sure, but that is fine... he was backing it up.  When he came to Chicago a ton of expectations were put on his shoulders.  He seemed ready for the challenge.  But in all honesty, Jay was never given a fair deal in Chicago.  He was surrounded by awful teams and his coaching staff was constantly changing.  He walked into a dumpster fire of an organization and nothing changed for the positive the entire time he was there.  Did he have some good WRs to throw it to?  Sure, but the OL couldn't stop anything.  The game was rigged against Jay from the start.  Did he do himself any favors with his attitude?  Absolutely not, but it was likely the first time in his life that he wasn't winning almost every game and he did not handle it well.

Jay was definitely an above average QB that was a victim of circumstance.

It doesn't help that he played in systems that either A.) Hated tight ends, so they traded their All-Pro one or B.) Hated headstrong WRs, so they traded their All-Pro one.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I 100% believe that Jay Cutler was the best QB to suit up for the Chicago Bears since Jim McMahon.

Unfortunately, that's not saying much.

[MerrittsMustache]

Packer fan here.

I loved Jay Cutler when he was a Bronco.  He was a good QB with a great arm and decent accuracy.  Was he sort of full of himself?  Sure, but that is fine... he was backing it up.  When he came to Chicago a ton of expectations were put on his shoulders.  He seemed ready for the challenge.  But in all honesty, Jay was never given a fair deal in Chicago.  He was surrounded by awful teams and his coaching staff was constantly changing.  He walked into a dumpster fire of an organization and nothing changed for the positive the entire time he was there.  Did he have some good WRs to throw it to?  Sure, but the OL couldn't stop anything.  The game was rigged against Jay from the start.  Did he do himself any favors with his attitude?  Absolutely not, but it was likely the first time in his life that he wasn't winning almost every game and he did not handle it well.

Jay was definitely an above average QB that was a victim of circumstance.

This post is very well put.

Just for a "circumstances" comparison...

Jay Cutler and Joe Flacco have put up incredibly similar numbers in their careers.

Flacco: 138 GS, 61.5% comp, 236.5 yd/gm, 182 TD, 117 INT, 84.5 QB Rat

Cutler: 139 GS, 61.9% comp, 233.6 yd/gm, 208 TD, 146 INT, 85.7 QB Rat

However, Flacco is 83-55 as a starter, compared to Cutler's 68-71. Flacco has made the playoffs 6 times and won a SB. Cutler made the playoffs once.

Moral of the story: There are a lot of outside factors at play when looking at a QB's career.

[Hards Alumni]

This post is very well put.

Just for a "circumstances" comparison...

Jay Cutler and Joe Flacco have put up incredibly similar numbers in their careers.

Flacco: 138 GS, 61.5% comp, 236.5 yd/gm, 182 TD, 117 INT, 84.5 QB Rat

Cutler: 139 GS, 61.9% comp, 233.6 yd/gm, 208 TD, 146 INT, 85.7 QB Rat

However, Flacco is 83-55 as a starter, compared to Cutler's 68-71. Flacco has made the playoffs 6 times and won a SB. Cutler made the playoffs once.

Moral of the story: There are a lot of outside factors at play when looking at a QB's career.

Also, Joe Flacco is actually a mediocre QB.  When he got that contract I laughed... but then I cried because I knew Rodgers was going to get more.

[🏀]

Cutler is an above average quarterback that played for a terrible organization that consistently failed to build a team.

The fact that wades is calling out 'one playoff win' as a negative, in the modern NFL, tells you there isn't much left on the bone.

For the record, Packers fan that was glad Angelo, Emery and to a lesser known extent Pace have all sucked at rebuilding a charter franchise.

Aaron Rodgers has only won a single super bowl,...

[wadesworld]

Cutler is an above average quarterback that played for a terrible organization that consistently failed to build a team.

The fact that wades is calling out 'one playoff win' as a negative, in the modern NFL, tells you there isn't much left on the bone.

For the record, Packers fan that was glad Angelo, Emery and to a lesser known extent Pace have all sucked at rebuilding a charter franchise.

Aaron Rodgers has only won a single super bowl,...

Yup. So in a single season Aaron Rodgers had 4x the amount of Playoff wins as Jay Cutler had in his career.

The guy had almost as many turnovers as he had touchdowns for his CAREER! Some people consider that an above average quarterback. The same 34 year old who was told by 32 football teams, "Thanks, but we have our starting quarterback." A guy who couldn't get $14M from his own team because they wanted Mike Glennon over him. Yeah. That guy. Above average. At least I get a good chuckle.

[Jockey]

Yup. So in a single season Aaron Rodgers had 4x the amount of Playoff wins as Jay Cutler had in his career.

The guy had almost as many turnovers as he had touchdowns for his CAREER! Some people consider that an above average quarterback. The same 34 year old who was told by 32 football teams, "Thanks, but we have our starting quarterback." A guy who couldn't get $14M from his own team because they wanted Mike Glennon over him. Yeah. That guy. Above average. At least I get a good chuckle.

C'mon, Wades. it's the coach's fault.


All of them

[Hards Alumni]

Yup. So in a single season Aaron Rodgers had 4x the amount of Playoff wins as Jay Cutler had in his career.

The guy had almost as many turnovers as he had touchdowns for his CAREER! Some people consider that an above average quarterback. The same 34 year old who was told by 32 football teams, "Thanks, but we have our starting quarterback." A guy who couldn't get $14M from his own team because they wanted Mike Glennon over him. Yeah. That guy. Above average. At least I get a good chuckle.

As a Packer fan, I am absolutely upset that we allow Mike McCarthy to coach a team.

Back to back HOF QBs and two tap dancing super bowl wins?

AWFUL.

[Dish]

I've said it before on here, in my time at Soldier Field (and on this board), there hasn't been a more knowledgeable and respectful fan base than Packer fans. I know it gets heated sometimes, but I enjoy talking football here because there's (usually) good back/forth, and a lot of good discussion (including non Bears/Packer fans).

[hairy worthen]

Cutler is an above average quarterback that played for a terrible organization that consistently failed to build a team.

The fact that wades is calling out 'one playoff win' as a negative, in the modern NFL, tells you there isn't much left on the bone.

For the record, Packers fan that was glad Angelo, Emery and to a lesser known extent Pace have all sucked at rebuilding a charter franchise.

Aaron Rodgers has only won a single super bowl,...

Above average? Yikes. The fact that no team in a quarterback hungry league was willing to sign him tells you all you need to know.  Look at some of the crappy quarterbacks playing in the league, gms are basically saying they are all better options than cutler.

Don't listen to bear or packer fans, listen to what everyone else thinks of the guy and you have your answer.

[GGGG]

Above average? Yikes. The fact that no team in a quarterback hungry league was willing to sign him tells you all you need to know.

I think he had teams willing to sign him...just not at his asking price.

[hairy worthen]

I think he had teams willing to sign him...just not at his asking price.

Kind of my point, but do we know all those details?

[Vander Blue Man Group]

I'm just a meatball Packer fan with my green and gold shades on.

Agreed!!

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Cutler was a solid QB that had to deal with a lot of factors that hindered him. Lack of skill players around him for a lot of his tenure, multiple offensive coordinators, etc. Thats not an excuse but to say it didn't have an impact is silly.

Now he was not the type of player that was going to lift a team on his own and carry it to the playoffs.  And the production and decision making didn't always match the talent, arm strength, mobility, and athleticism. He gets a bad rap for his "attitude" but personally I think that's overblown.  I believe a team could win with Cutler consistently if the team as a whole was good. Unfortunately, that was not the case most of his years in Chicago.

In my opinion, he doesn't get enough credit for his toughness. He missed games but he also took many a beating and kept going. I respect that.

And I believe if he was still playing he'd be a top 20 QB. It's hard for me to say one of the best 20 QBs in the world stinks.

[JWags85]

By contrast, I think Cutler would be a terrible studio guy. I don't think he'll be into fluff, and with the amount of coaches he's worked with, he'll have good perspective. I'll definitely be interested to hear him.

His interview on Waddle and Silvy was great this week.  I think he's gonna do a great job and I think his dry humor could play really well in the booth.

He mentioned his wife was gone so he had the kids for the week.  They asked "how are the kids"...his response "alive".

They also asked if he filed retirement papers, and he said "not sure what that even means. do you get a medal or a prize or something?"  Which i found funny.  But people immediately jumped to him being an ass who doesn't respect the game 

[wadesworld]

Agreed!!

Says the only guy on the board, Packers fan, Bears fan, or otherwise, who thinks the Bears needed to trade away 4 draft picks to move up 1 spot to draft a guy who started 1 year at a bad football program at a position they paid $14M to a free agent this same offseason for, despite even a guy that worked in the Bears FO and still has a number of inside contacts saying it was a horrible and unnecessary move.

[GGGG]

Says the only guy on the board, Packers fan, Bears fan, or otherwise, who thinks the Bears needed to trade away 4 draft picks to move up 1 spot to draft a guy who started 1 year at a bad football program at a position they paid $14M to a free agent this same offseason for, despite even a guy that worked in the Bears FO and still has a number of inside contacts saying it was a horrible and unnecessary move.

There are at least two on this board who don't think it was as big a deal as people are making it out to be.  If he turns out to be the QB the Bears have needed, I think the trade was fine.

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Says the only guy on the board, Packers fan, Bears fan, or otherwise, who thinks the Bears needed to trade away 4 draft picks to move up 1 spot to draft a guy who started 1 year at a bad football program at a position they paid $14M to a free agent this same offseason for, despite even a guy that worked in the Bears FO and still has a number of inside contacts saying it was a horrible and unnecessary move.

Relax, Francis.