Final

[barfolomew]

It's all a matter of perspective... Hinkle was a cavern compared to their little gym back in Hickory, but the Huskers still pulled it off.  Perhaps every coach should carry a tape measure to the Final Four.

Yeah, but they had Jimmy F***in Chitwood.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

Impermisable benefits are, in part, benefits that athletes receive that other students cannot receive.

So for instance, if every student gets a free laptop provided as a freshman, an athlete can receive one as well.  It doesn't matter if the other 300+ schools don't provide athletes to their students.

.

Ok, that makes sense. But the NCAA should still have a case on academic fraud. If not, they need to establish a new rule setting minimum standards for what counts as a class in regards to athletes staying eligible. Call it the UNC rule.

[GGGG]

.

Ok, that makes sense. But the NCAA should still have a case on academic fraud. If not, they need to establish a new rule setting minimum standards for what counts as a class in regards to athletes staying eligible. Call it the UNC rule.

So the NCAA is going to review the course descriptions of every class offered to students to make sure it qualifies as a class?  The amount of resources that will take is enormous, and all this because of UNC?

How about this.  Member institutions need to provide academic programs rigorously overseen by accrediting bodies.  Not everything can be legislated by the NCAA.  The system will never be completely fair.  Sometimes negative outcomes are going to happen.

[MU82]

A few thoughts:

1. Given the number of plays refs review, it is astonishing that nobody thought to review the play leading to that jump ball. It was reviewable under the rules, the scrum happened right on the baseline, and in real-time I jumped out of my chair and said: "Meeks is out of bounds!" Really hard to fathom why such an important play and such an obvious review situation was ignored.

2. We probably will never again have a FF in a "regular arena." I second wades' reasons for wanting to abandon stadiums, but it simply is never gonna happen for obviou$$$$ rea$$$on$$$$. Wishing for it is like an old person wishing beer was still only 25 cents per glass - it's a nice thing to want, but it ain't gonna happen!

3. I agree the officiating was sub-par but the play in the game WAS overly physical right from the start. I think they felt early on that they had to try to clean things up so it didn't get out of hand, but the players didn't adjust to the way it was being called and then the refs had to keep calling it. I've been there as a ref myself, and it's really a no-win situation. But again, I think these 3 weren't very good, and I also agree that Collins had 2-3 really bad calls against him, which almost surely helped alter the course of the game.

4. A big issue in the UNC case is "Were athletes being actively funneled into these fake courses, sometimes even against their wishes?" A woman's basketball player and a football player sued the school and the NCAA over this; a judge ruled that there was no case against the NCAA but I haven't been able to discern if the case against the university is still out there.

http://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/judge-dismisses-ncaa-from-lawsuit-over-north-carolinas-academic-fraud/

5. As other Scoopers have said, those classes didn't represent "extra benefits" because they were available to non-jocks, and about 50% of those who took the classes weren't athletes. So the school probably will get away with it. But it's as slimy as it gets, and UNC - once considered one of the great public institutions in this country - should be effen ashamed.

6. The idea that Roy Williams - a total control freak who knows every single thing going on in his program - was blissfully unaware that these courses even existed ... what a freakin' joke. For that lie alone, he shouldn't be allowed to win the national title! Whenever he quits coaching, however, he obviously is qualified to be a politician - even POTUS!

7. I'd have mentioned Gonzaga going 17-26 from the line, including 4-8 for NWG, an 87% shooter, but everybody knows FTs no matta.

[StillAWarrior]

So the NCAA is going to review the course descriptions of every class offered to students to make sure it qualifies as a class?  The amount of resources that will take is enormous, and all this because of UNC?

How about this.  Member institutions need to provide academic programs rigorously overseen by accrediting bodies.  Not everything can be legislated by the NCAA.  The system will never be completely fair.  Sometimes negative outcomes are going to happen.

And therein lies the "beauty" of UNC's defense to the NCAA.  They couched it in terms of an area that the NCAA, with good reason, is loathe to oversee.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

So the NCAA is going to review the course descriptions of every class offered to students to make sure it qualifies as a class?  The amount of resources that will take is enormous, and all this because of UNC?

How about this.  Member institutions need to provide academic programs rigorously overseen by accrediting bodies.  Not everything can be legislated by the NCAA.  The system will never be completely fair.  Sometimes negative outcomes are going to happen.

1. I don't think it has to be actively monitored for every class. Set up an audit system where audits can be triggered when evidence of maleficence arises.

2. Shame on the accreditation agency being soft. They should have been much harsher.

3. Yes, life is not fair. But we should still strive to close loopholes and level the playing field. For the future if nothing else.

[Loose Cannon]

And all the other students. Don't forget that. UNC Athletics doesn't cheat; UNC offers bogus classes to all its students.

The second coming of Parson College.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

A few thoughts:

7. I'd have mentioned Gonzaga going 17-26 from the line, including 4-8 for NWG, an 87% shooter, but everybody knows FTs no matta.

Didn't NWG have a gash on his hand?  Before the game they showed a photo of his shooting hand like he sliced it on something.

[brewcity77]

Didn't NWG have a gash on his hand?  Before the game they showed a photo of his shooting hand like he sliced it on something.

It was from the South Carolina game. Near the end, he went sliding across the floor trying to save a loose ball and opened up a cut on his hand in the process.

[MU82]

Didn't NWG have a gash on his hand?  Before the game they showed a photo of his shooting hand like he sliced it on something.

gashes no matta.

BTW, now seeing word that the Meeks-hand-OB play was not reviewable. Why? I have no idea. The two short articles I read didn't go into detail, just said it wasn't reviewable. Outrageous.

[drewm88]

gashes no matta.

BTW, now seeing word that the Meeks-hand-OB play was not reviewable. Why? I have no idea. The two short articles I read didn't go into detail, just said it wasn't reviewable. Outrageous.

Pretty sure the way it works is that if you have an OOB call, you can review who it went off of, but in this case there was never an OOB call, so you can't review.

[wadesworld]

Pretty sure the way it works is that if you have an OOB call, you can review who it went off of, but in this case there was never an OOB call, so you can't review.

Yup.  It was a jump ball call, not out of bounds.

[Lennys Tap]

Bottom line, it was a very poorly played game. Air balls, horrid shooting (even free throws), players on both teams routinely playing out of control. When self identified basketball fans allow as to how they prefer the ball they saw last night to watching guys like Lebron, Steph, etc., it blows me away.

[warriorchick]

The classes existed. They were very easy classes. All school have the same thing. MU does a better job of hiding these type of classes in the various majors so they seem more legit.

Really?

Please share what special knowledge you have that allows you to speak with authority on this.

[Herman Cain]

Really?

Please share what special knowledge you have that allows you to speak with authority on this.

The same knowledge you have .

[wadesworld]

Really?

Please share what special knowledge you have that allows you to speak with authority on this.

He's MUFNY.  He knows everything about everyone and everything, especially MU basketball player (and their families) related.  Parents of players from every program in America have told him about these types of things, including Marquette and UNC.

[jsglow]

The same knowledge you have .

You're just a troll.  Live with that fella.

[warriorchick]

The same knowledge you have .

I doubt that.



When was the last time you spoke to the Provost?  I am good friends with someone who served in that position, and I can promise you it would be over that person's dead body that Marquette issue a worthless degree to anyone.

It is common knowledge that one of the main beefs Buzz had with the administration was that they would not let him skirt the academic requirements as much as he wanted. Why would Buzz need to do that if all he had to do was sign the players up for joke classes.

[Herman Cain]

You're just a troll.  Live with that fella.

I doubt that.



When was the last time you spoke to the Provost?  I am good friends with someone who served in that position, and I can promise you it would be over that person's dead body that Marquette issue a worthless degree to anyone.

It is common knowledge that one of the main beefs Buzz had with the administration was that they would not let him skirt the academic requirements as much as he wanted. Why would Buzz need to do that if all he had to do was sign the players up for joke classes.

Face the facts all schools have the same courses UNC did. How do you think we get kids through the core of common studies? For example, MU has a course were kids essentially post responses to a very simple topic once a week, a glorified academic MU Scoop. Open to all kids and widely known and I would not be surprised if your own kids took the course . How is that any different from the African Studies course which required a two page paper at UNC? UNC obviously had an overzealous administrator take liberties and that is clearly not a good thing, and that is the core of the assertion against them. But to think that every other school in the country are puritans is naive at best. Do You think every student at Stanford Football is a rocket scientist?

[wadesworld]

Face the facts all schools have the same courses UNC did. How do you think we get kids through the core of common studies? For example, MU has a course were kids essentially post responses to a very simple topic once a week, a glorified academic MU Scoop. Open to all kids and widely known and I would not be surprised if your own kids took the course . How is that any different from the African Studies course which required a two page paper at UNC? UNC obviously had an overzealous administrator take liberties and that is clearly not a good thing, and that is the core of the assertion against them. But to think that every other school in the country are puritans is naive at best. Do You think every student at Stanford Football is a rocket scientist?

Yes.  Lol.  Hilarious that out of all the outstanding schools that make exceptions for their student athletes, you choose one of the very few that require their student athletes to get admitted into the school as a student first in order to be an athlete there.

[warriorchick]

Face the facts all schools have the same courses UNC did. How do you think we get kids through the core of common studies? For example, MU has a course were kids essentially post responses to a very simple topic once a week, a glorified academic MU Scoop. Open to all kids and widely known and I would not be surprised if your own kids took the course . How is that any different from the African Studies course which required a two page paper at UNC? UNC obviously had an overzealous administrator take liberties and that is clearly not a good thing, and that is the core of the assertion against them. But to think that every other school in the country are puritans is naive at best. Do You think every student at Stanford Football is a rocket scientist?

So what exactly is that course number?

[Dr. Blackheart]

Impermisable benefits are, in part, benefits that athletes receive that other students cannot receive.

So for instance, if every student gets a free laptop lap dance provided as a freshman, an athlete can receive one as well.  It doesn't matter if the other 300+ schools don't provide athletes to their students.

So at Louisville on the hooker scandal, which occurred in a primarily athletic dorm...that skirts the rule of extra benefits by having a few academic student residents, Pitino was unjustly penalized by the NCAA?  Rim jobs for everyone!

[Herman Cain]

So what exactly is that course number?

Feel free to PM me and I will provide course number(s).

[warriorchick]

Feel free to PM me and I will provide course number(s).

Why does it have to be a PM?  If every school does it, it doesn't need to be a secret.

[wadesworld]

Why does it have to be a PM?  If every school does it, it doesn't need to be a secret.

He wants a different set of numbers in return.