NBA '17

[wadesworld]

Westbrook shot 26% from 3 on TEN attempts per game.  Absolutely absurd.

Westbrook shot 38% from the field in against the Rockets while the rest of the Thunder shot 47%.  Yet Westbrook took 35% of the Thunder's total shots.

[MU82]

I have an acquaintance from Boston who, of course, idolizes Larry Bird. His main defense of Bird being better than LeBron is that "LeBron simply isn't a leader." I told him how absurd this statement was, considering all the leading LeBron has done and continues doing, but he was sticking by it. LeBron is better at pretty much everything than Bird was, but Bird ranks ahead of LeBron based solely on leadership. Hmmm.

I didn't say this to him, and maybe I'm just a hypersensitive type seeing a bogeyman, but this smacked of thinly veiled racism.

[GGGG]

What were his arguments that defined Bird as a better leader than Lebron?

And it is very likely more homerism than racism.

[MU82]

What were his arguments that defined Bird as a better leader than Lebron?

And it is very likely more homerism than racism.

He had no arguments. He simply stated it as a fact. When I'd present evidence of LeBron's leadership, he would simply say, "I don't care. I don't think he's a leader."

You very well might be correct about it being homerism rather than racism. When he'd go on to talk about LeBron being a cocky trash-talker - and rejecting the facts that Bird's trash-talking was legendary and Bird also was extremely cocky, it made me wonder more, though.

Again, I fully allow that I might be seeing things, but I usually do have pretty decent race-dar.

[Jockey]

He had no arguments. He simply stated it as a fact. When I'd present evidence of LeBron's leadership, he would simply say, "I don't care. I don't think he's a leader."

You very well might be correct about it being homerism rather than racism. When he'd go on to talk about LeBron being a cocky trash-talker - and rejecting the facts that Bird's trash-talking was legendary and Bird also was extremely cocky, it made me wonder more, though.

Again, I fully allow that I might be seeing things, but I usually do have pretty decent race-dar.

Racism in Boston? Adam Jones says that is ludicrous.

[wadesworld]

Racism in Boston? Adam Jones says that is ludicrous.

There's racism everywhere.

[4everwarriors]

Taught dat ended wit BO's election, hey?

[wadesworld]

Taught dat ended wit BO's election, hey?

Restarted with D Trump's.  No Muslims, no Hispanics, didn't you hear?

[ATL MU Warrior]

Taught dat ended wit BO's election, hey?

That really ramped it up again.

[Plaque Lives Matter!]

Let's wait until after then NBA finals to lock this thread.

[GGGG]

Copied from Twitter:

LBJ's last 10 playoff games, all wins:
41-16-7-3
41-8-11-4
27-11-11-2
36-6-13-3
25-10-7-4
41-13-12-1
33-10-4-4
35-10-4-1
39-6-4-3
35-8-7-1

But he's not a leader.

[MU82]

Copied from Twitter:

LBJ's last 10 playoff games, all wins:
41-16-7-3
41-8-11-4
27-11-11-2
36-6-13-3
25-10-7-4
41-13-12-1
33-10-4-4
35-10-4-1
39-6-4-3
35-8-7-1

But he's not a leader.

Yeah, amazing.

By the time he is through, most who truly follow pro basketball will be talking about him as the second-best player of all time. At worst.

[jmayer1]

Yeah, amazing.

By the time he is through, most who truly follow pro basketball will be talking about him as the second-best player of all time. At worst.

False. He cannot possibly pass Jordan or Wilt.

[GGGG]

Wilt?  Gimme a break...

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Career Averages:

MPG: 38.3 (MJ) 38.9 (LJ)
PPG: 30.1-27.1
RPG: 6.3-7.3
APG: 6.2-7.0
SPG: 2.3-1.6
BPG: 0.8-0.8
TPG: 2.7-3.4
FG%: .497-.501
3P%: .327-.342
eFG%: .509-.536

Jordan has his 2 years with the Wizards weighing him down and has way more hardware in the case than Lebron so I definitely give the edge to him. But if Lebron somehow wins three more championships and keeps playing at this level? Could see an argument for him taking the number 1 spot. I think he is already a comfortable #2.

Through this process I learned a fun trivia question. There is one player who has won more championships than Jordan who was not a member of the 1950s/1960s Celtics. Who is it?

[reinko]

False. He cannot possibly pass Jordan or Wilt.

Wilt?!?

[GGGG]

Career Averages:

MPG: 38.3 (MJ) 38.9 (LJ)
PPG: 30.1-27.1
RPG: 6.3-7.3
APG: 6.2-7.0
SPG: 2.3-1.6
BPG: 0.8-0.8
TPG: 2.7-3.4
FG%: .497-.501
3P%: .327-.342
eFG%: .509-.536

Jordan has his 2 years with the Wizards weighing him down and has way more hardware in the case than Lebron so I definitely give the edge to him. But if Lebron somehow wins three more championships and keeps playing at this level? Could see an argument for him taking the number 1 spot. I think he is already a comfortable #2.

Through this process I learned a fun trivia question. There is one player who has won more championships than Jordan who was not a member of the 1950s/1960s Celtics. Who is it?

Robert Horry.

Two with the Rockets, three with the Lakers, two with the Spurs

[wadesworld]

Career Averages:

MPG: 38.3 (MJ) 38.9 (LJ)
PPG: 30.1-27.1
RPG: 6.3-7.3
APG: 6.2-7.0
SPG: 2.3-1.6
BPG: 0.8-0.8
TPG: 2.7-3.4
FG%: .497-.501
3P%: .327-.342
eFG%: .509-.536

Jordan has his 2 years with the Wizards weighing him down and has way more hardware in the case than Lebron so I definitely give the edge to him. But if Lebron somehow wins three more championships and keeps playing at this level? Could see an argument for him taking the number 1 spot. I think he is already a comfortable #2.

Through this process I learned a fun trivia question. There is one player who has won more championships than Jordan who was not a member of the 1950s/1960s Celtics. Who is it?

Get some tougher trivia TAMU. I'm probably the worst trivia "player" on the planet and even I knew it was Robert Horry immediately (unless they have it wrong and there's more than 1, because I know Big Shot Bob has more than MJ).

Edit: Sultan just beat me to it.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

I also thought of Robert Horry pretty quickly. But I am a hoops junkie, so I am sure the general sports fan would struggle to answer it that easily.

[Jockey]

Career Averages:

MPG: 38.3 (MJ) 38.9 (LJ)
PPG: 30.1-27.1
RPG: 6.3-7.3
APG: 6.2-7.0
SPG: 2.3-1.6
BPG: 0.8-0.8
TPG: 2.7-3.4
FG%: .497-.501
3P%: .327-.342
eFG%: .509-.536

Jordan has his 2 years with the Wizards weighing him down and has way more hardware in the case than Lebron so I definitely give the edge to him. But if Lebron somehow wins three more championships and keeps playing at this level? Could see an argument for him taking the number 1 spot. I think he is already a comfortable #2.

Through this process I learned a fun trivia question. There is one player who has won more championships than Jordan who was not a member of the 1950s/1960s Celtics. Who is it?

I always had Jordan and Kareem as a clear .#1 and #2 and didn't see anyone who could challenge either spot.

But Lebron is now in the conversation for #2 and could soon be in the convo for #1

[4everwarriors]

Maybe he beets Wilt in da bedroom stat, hey?

[MU82]

False. He cannot possibly pass Jordan or Wilt.

I'm a big Wilt fan, and I do think he is too casually dismissed in the greatest-ever conversation. However, LeBron already has him beat.

LeBron is 32 and he still has pretty much the perfect athletic physique. He is fanatical about taking care of himself. There is every reason to believe he can continue to play at a superduperstar level for another 3-4 years, and then still be very good for a couple/few years beyond that. If he wins another couple of championships, only a fan of the Lakers would argue Magic or Kareem were better, only a fan of the Celtics would argue Bird or Russell were better, etc.

LeBron is an all-time freak. And the fact that he doesn't just live off of his freakishness - he really, really works at his game, which is why, like Jordan, he has gotten better with age - makes him all the more special.

As for Jordan's stats being affected by his two years with the Wizards ... that was his choice. He doesn't get special dispensation for it. Nor does he get special dispensation for sitting out twice, once when he was in his absolute prime and once when he was still the best player on the planet. They were his choice.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

As for Jordan's stats being affected by his two years with the Wizards ... that was his choice. He doesn't get special dispensation for it. Nor does he get special dispensation for sitting out twice, once when he was in his absolute prime and once when he was still the best player on the planet. They were his choice.

Agreed. I just pointed it out because Lebron hasn't had his couple seasons as an aging superstar yet. I imagine his career averages will go down as well.

[wadesworld]

I did have to laugh at Tyrone Lue's comments about how LeBron is like MJ in that in the 90's players weren't able to get rings because MJ was winning them all and today it's the same with LeBron.  MJ essentially won 6 straight Titles when he was actually playing in the NBA.  LeBron has won 3 total, and 2 of those came when he convinced 2 other top 20 players in the NBA (at the time) to take less money so that they could all be on the same team.

As far as where he stands in the greatest of all time, I'm pretty confident in saying MJ is one but beyond that it's really hard to "rank" these guys.  The game was so different back in the 70s than it is today and the players aren't playing against the same players.  To me it's pretty hard to rank all time.  What I can say is that LeBron is the best player of this generation.

[reinko]

I did have to laugh at Tyrone Lue's comments about how LeBron is like MJ in that in the 90's players weren't able to get rings because MJ was winning them all and today it's the same with LeBron.  MJ essentially won 6 straight Titles when he was actually playing in the NBA.  LeBron has won 3 total, and 2 of those came when he convinced 2 other top 20 players in the NBA (at the time) to take less money so that they could all be on the same team.

As far as where he stands in the greatest of all time, I'm pretty confident in saying MJ is one but beyond that it's really hard to "rank" these guys.  The game was so different back in the 70s than it is today and the players aren't playing against the same players.  To me it's pretty hard to rank all time.  What I can say is that LeBron is the best player of this generation.

They all left $ on the table, not just Wade and Bosh.

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2010/07/10/lebron-james-dwyane-wade-chris-bosh-each-leave-15-million-on-the-table/

C'mon, take the hate glasses off Wades...they were all friends, and had the unique opportunity to make this happen, not sure about the "knock" that he somehow connived or tricked his buddies into taking less money...