Marquette University honors ’70s cop-killer Assata Shakur with mural

[warriorchick]

I wonder how long a Confederate Flag would remain hanging in a less traveled area of the student union. Two months before it came to the administrations attention? I think not.

Everyone knows what a Confederate Flag represents.  How many people knew who Assata Shakur was last  Friday?

[Dr. Blackheart]

Everyone knows what a Confederate Flag represents.  How many people knew who Assata Shakur was last  Friday?

A club, a sorority, an academic adjudication, and MU social media were involved in this.  The club has a sponsor.  The sorority is overseen by the Office of Greek Life.  The suspended faculty member with a voice and an academic and civil case.  MU has oversight to its public message. A simple Wike search reveals a long rap sheet.  Fail

For a small yet influential donor segment, MU's first lay president's bubble has popped. I hope his administration has some awareness of the damage control needed here beyond this screwing of the pooch. His administration has bungled this badly, and pretending this has gone away or its McAdams fault isn't going to help him. This is not a national press issue as it will die down.  This is an alumni and donor perception issue that will spread and build.  Words matter.  (Note:  I am not speaking for myself)

[mu03eng]

A club, a sorority, an academic adjudication, and MU social media were involved in this.  The club has a sponsor.  The sorority is overseen by the Office of Greek Life.  The suspended faculty member with a voice and an academic and civil case.  MU has oversight to its public message. A simple Wike search reveals a long rap sheet.  Fail

For a small yet influential donor segment, MU's first lay president's bubble has popped. I hope his administration has some awareness of the damage control needed here beyond this screwing of the pooch. His administration has bungled this badly, and pretending this has gone away or its McAdams fault isn't going to help him. This is not a national press issue as it will die down.  This is an alumni and donor perception issue that will spread and build.  Words matter.  (Note:  I am not speaking for myself)

So let me see if I understand this.  There are influential donors that are pissed at Lovell because he didn't know every minutiae of what was going on on campus and are willing to redirect their money within 48 hours of this story surfacing without giving the administration opportunity to act?

He is now launching an investigation as to how such an offensive and stupid display got put up.  We'll see how he reacts to that investigation.  I find it very hard to believe that donors (as successful as they must be to be so critical to MU) would react so quickly and definitively with so limited knowledge of what actually transpired.

Other than this and the McAdams situation, what other issues do these donors have with the administration?

Lastly, I think it needs to be reiterated that the people involved in this mural more than likely weren't even born when the Shakur murder occurred.  Not excusing them not doing research, but it's not like this person is very well known and something somebody just knows.  I think who ever in the administration that approved this needs to be fired, but let's apply Hanlon's Razor to this.

[Galway Eagle]

A club, a sorority, an academic adjudication, and MU social media were involved in this.  The club has a sponsor.  The sorority is overseen by the Office of Greek Life.  The suspended faculty member with a voice and an academic and civil case.  MU has oversight to its public message. A simple Wike search reveals a long rap sheet.  Fail

For a small yet influential donor segment, MU's first lay president's bubble has popped. I hope his administration has some awareness of the damage control needed here beyond this screwing of the pooch. His administration has bungled this badly, and pretending this has gone away or its McAdams fault isn't going to help him. This is not a national press issue as it will die down.  This is an alumni and donor perception issue that will spread and build.  Words matter.  (Note:  I am not speaking for myself)

At what age do adults become so reactionary convinced that the slightest misstep will have extreme ramifications and begin to think that all the people in power evidently have never made a mistake when they were young so the youth must be held to that same standard.  I'm just curious so that I can prepare myself.

[muwarrior69]

So let me see if I understand this.  There are influential donors that are pissed at Lovell because he didn't know every minutiae of what was going on on campus and are willing to redirect their money within 48 hours of this story surfacing without giving the administration opportunity to act?

He is now launching an investigation as to how such an offensive and stupid display got put up.  We'll see how he reacts to that investigation.  I find it very hard to believe that donors (as successful as they must be to be so critical to MU) would react so quickly and definitively with so limited knowledge of what actually transpired.

Other than this and the McAdams situation, what other issues do these donors have with the administration?

Lastly, I think it needs to be reiterated that the people involved in this mural more than likely weren't even born when the Shakur murder occurred.  Not excusing them not doing research, but it's not like this person is very well known and something somebody just knows.  I think who ever in the administration that approved this needs to be fired, but let's apply Hanlon's Razor to this.

Does MU have a Men studies program? If not, why not? What is the ratio of men/women students at MU?
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/education/09men-t.html?_r=0

[ChicosBailBonds]

At what age do adults become so reactionary convinced that the slightest misstep will have extreme ramifications and begin to think that all the people in power evidently have never made a mistake when they were young so the youth must be held to that same standard.  I'm just curious so that I can prepare myself.

LOL.....I thought this was taught in liberalism 101....so I'd put it at age 18, when the indoctrination really gets cranking.

Bush knew.....remember. 

[Galway Eagle]

LOL.....I thought this was taught in liberalism 101....so I'd put it at age 18, when the indoctrination really gets cranking.

Bush knew.....remember. 

Maybe I'm still really tired and not in the mood to read into things but want to elaborate?

[mu03eng]

Maybe I'm still really tired and not in the mood to read into things but want to elaborate?

Don't bother, typical Chico's partisanship.  The behavior you describe impacts all on the political spectrum and all adults in human life. 

I'll admit to having the same issue from time to time, we all do even if we can't admit it.  Humans have to process so much information that we can only process it from our point of view "effectively" therefore we are reacting within our personal experience which doesn't effectively translate to societal experience.

Side note, as society becomes more and more individualized I think it becomes much more difficult to identify areas of potential issue as well as predict what "outrage" will unite society in common frustration at an event/issue.

[GGGG]

At what age do adults become so reactionary convinced that the slightest misstep will have extreme ramifications and begin to think that all the people in power evidently have never made a mistake when they were young so the youth must be held to that same standard.  I'm just curious so that I can prepare myself.

This might be the wisest statement in this thread.

This has been said here before, but big donors aren't pulling donations over isolated incidents like this.  If the Lovell administration makes repeated mistakes, and in the process pisses off donors, then you have a problem.  But no one who was a significant donor on Friday is not one today because of this.  Lovell handled it about as well as he could have.

Look, universities are open environments where students oftentimes lead initiatives like this.  Students aren't the best decision makers, that is why they are supposed to be overseen by professionals who know better.  When that system breaks down, stuff like this happens.  It happens everywhere.  Seriously Google up any institution of significant size and you will see some controversial story that administrators have to weather.

If donors can't understand that, they really probably shouldn't be donating to higher education to begin with.

[GGGG]

Does MU have a Men studies program? If not, why not? What is the ratio of men/women students at MU?
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/education/09men-t.html?_r=0

They don't celebrate a White Pride Month either!!!

[GGGG]

A club, a sorority, an academic adjudication, and MU social media were involved in this.  The club has a sponsor.  The sorority is overseen by the Office of Greek Life.  The suspended faculty member with a voice and an academic and civil case.  MU has oversight to its public message. A simple Wike search reveals a long rap sheet.  Fail

For a small yet influential donor segment, MU's first lay president's bubble has popped. I hope his administration has some awareness of the damage control needed here beyond this screwing of the pooch. His administration has bungled this badly, and pretending this has gone away or its McAdams fault isn't going to help him. This is not a national press issue as it will die down.  This is an alumni and donor perception issue that will spread and build.  Words matter.  (Note:  I am not speaking for myself)

I don't know.  We will see.  I would be surprised.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Maybe I'm still really tired and not in the mood to read into things but want to elaborate?

Go back to the 1970's....what did he know and when did he know it.   

This has been gotcha style tactics for a long long time, now used by all sides.

Do I think President Lovell had any clue what was going on with some mural?  Hell no.  Do I think that some goofy university admin type did and thought it was great......I have my beliefs on this, but they are only a guess and supported by any evidence...yet.

He just needs to clean it up and quickly, put people on notice that just because SOMEONE think it is cool that people are wearing Che or whomever on a t-shirt doesn't pass off as something the university should be endorsing or honoring.  Whether that communication gets through to some of these people, is another story. 

[GGGG]

Do I think President Lovell had any clue what was going on with some mural?  Hell no.  Do I think that some goofy university admin type did and thought it was great......I have my beliefs on this, but they are only a guess and supported by any evidence...yet.

He just needs to clean it up and quickly, put people on notice that just because SOMEONE think it is cool that people are wearing Che or whomever on a t-shirt doesn't pass off as something the university should be endorsing or honoring.  Whether that communication gets through to some of these people, is another story. 

Bingo.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Everyone knows what a Confederate Flag represents.  How many people knew who Assata Shakur was last  Friday?

It's Tuesday and I still don't know.

Paint it over and lets move on.

[warriorchick]

Do I think President Lovell had any clue what was going on with some mural?  Hell no.  Do I think that some goofy university admin type did and thought it was great......I have my beliefs on this, but they are only a guess and supported by any evidence...yet.

 

Exactly.  Do you think the President of a company that has 5,000 employees knows what some goof in the IT department has pinned up in his cubicle? Even if he posted it on Facebook?

[Galway Eagle]

Go back to the 1970's....what did he know and when did he know it.   

This has been gotcha style tactics for a long long time, now used by all sides.

Do I think President Lovell had any clue what was going on with some mural?  Hell no.  Do I think that some goofy university admin type did and thought it was great......I have my beliefs on this, but they are only a guess and supported by any evidence...yet.

He just needs to clean it up and quickly, put people on notice that just because SOMEONE think it is cool that people are wearing Che or whomever on a t-shirt doesn't pass off as something the university should be endorsing or honoring.  Whether that communication gets through to some of these people, is another story. 

Bromigo I was directly saying blackheart was going a little crazy thinking big donors were going to pull their donations and are holding these kids to a standard that they never screwed up. I've already stated I think the mural was very poor taste. No donor a couple weeks ago is going to pull their donations now they know it was taken down and not in some front and center room where it would've been seen by everybody, and that it was likely a student mistake that got rubber stamped. My post wasn't trying to say anything other than blackheart was over reacting thinking all the donors were going to leave.

[mu03eng]

Bromigo I was directly saying blackheart was going a little crazy thinking big donors were going to pull their donations and are holding these kids to a standard that they never screwed up. I've already stated I think the mural was very poor taste. No donor a couple weeks ago is going to pull their donations now they know it was taken down and not in some front and center room where it would've been seen by everybody, and that it was likely a student mistake that got rubber stamped. My post wasn't trying to say anything other than blackheart was over reacting thinking all the donors were going to leave.

I don't doubt that some donors told Blackheart they were "considering" it.....that's called saber rattling and I'm sure if I was a big time donor I'd like to flex my muscle from time to time.  It's a leverage play if anything from the donors, the next time there is an issue and they want it to land in their direction they can bring up this instance to influence Lovell their way.

I think Chicos is right, students were either intentionally trying to be controversial or were ignorant and thought they were pretty statements.  Some mid to low level peon was either in on the pot stirring or was also ignorant/lazy and badaboom we have a very offensive mural on campus.  Once it came to the attention of leadership it was handled very swiftly(it's already covered over).

Side note, if McAdams had wanted to be helpful instead of inflammatory he could have brought this to Lovell's attention privately and I'm pretty sure it would have been handled just as swiftly.  Whatever sympathy I had for McAdam's plight has left me.

[Lennys Tap]

Side note, if McAdams had wanted to be helpful instead of inflammatory he could have brought this to Lovell's attention privately and I'm pretty sure it would have been handled just as swiftly.  Whatever sympathy I had for McAdam's plight has left me.

I usually agree with you, 03, but why would you expect McAdams to be "helpful" to the guy who just fired him?

[mu03eng]

I usually agree with you, 03, but why would you expect McAdams to be "helpful" to the guy who just fired him?

If McAdams was not a "firebrand" as he claimed and just someone who wanted to help the university, here was his opportunity to do so.

I get it from a human nature standpoint, he took a swing at the place that just cut him down, but it doesn't help with his reputation as a rabble rouser which is what got him in trouble in the first place.  He has created a prison of his own making.

[keefe]

you keep demeaning my Marquette degree.

Has your Marquette degree taken umbrage?

Personally, I find certain actions and behaviors by fellow alums cheapens or devalues my Marquette degree

[Lennys Tap]

If McAdams was not a "firebrand" as he claimed and just someone who wanted to help the university, here was his opportunity to do so.

I get it from a human nature standpoint, he took a swing at the place that just cut him down, but it doesn't help with his reputation as a rabble rouser which is what got him in trouble in the first place.  He has created a prison of his own making.

It was a "See?", "I told you so", "Exhibit A", "Eureka!" public moment for a public man who had been very publicly fired. What does he owe the people who have very publicly declared him the enemy?

[Galway Eagle]

Comrade:

Your defense of outgerous left-wing positions is maddening.  You were more worked up about McAdams than this.

This is why I said your earlier post was asinine because you've repeatedly insinuated that she is somehow associated with the entire left. I wonder how you, rocket surgeon, chicos or muwarrior69 would respond if the left posters spent half as much time as you guys do posting insulting claims from the extremists on your end of the political spectrum.

[keefe]

Quite frankly, all of this is moot until Marquette's most famous Gender & Sexuality studies graduate weighs in. Where are you Claire van Fossen?

Radical Feminist Lesbian. Gender and Sexuality Scholar. Community Activist. And Pin Up Vamp fueling the lascivious dreams of a thousand men.

Today's Renaissance Woman.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Leave it to Keefe to put the priorities back in order.

[Benny B]

At what age do adults become so reactionary convinced that the slightest misstep will have extreme ramifications and begin to think that all the people in power evidently have never made a mistake when they were young so the youth must be held to that same standard.  I'm just curious so that I can prepare myself.

Are you saying that Assata should be pardoned because we all made mistakes in our youth?