Update on prof McAdams

[Lennys Tap]

Nicely put. Your overall point is spot on.

Although, I have to add that a conservative is being marginalized on a college campus, he or she can presumably find another career.

If minorities are marginalized by law enforcement, the stakes are much higher.

I agree. A citizenry's relationship with law enforcement is more fundamental. It's also more complicated - cops are scared and mistrustful and so are the minorities they are supposed to serve. There's more real crime and violence in minority communities so there's naturally a larger police presence. A larger police presence also results in arrests for "crimes" (drug possession, e.g.) mostly ignored in low crime areas. Lots of meat to chew on that bone, and as long as people resort to talking points in lieu of really talking progress will be painfully slow.

By contrast, the imbalance of power on college campuses is an easy problem. I'm not for quotas, and I think that academia as a career may always be one that appeals more to liberals. So be it. But the majority has the obligation to not be tyrannical. Encouraging diversity of thought/opinion should be everyone's goal in academia but when I see our best universities cancelling even mainstream center right speakers like Condi Rice it gives me pause. Are those in charge interested in the education of their students or in reinforcing their own power?

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I agree. A citizenry's relationship with law enforcement is more fundamental. It's also more complicated - cops are scared and mistrustful and so are the minorities they are supposed to serve. There's more real crime and violence in minority communities so there's naturally a larger police presence. A larger police presence also results in arrests for "crimes" (drug possession, e.g.) mostly ignored in low crime areas. Lots of meat to chew on that bone, and as long as people resort to talking points in lieu of really talking progress will be painfully slow.

By contrast, the imbalance of power on college campuses is an easy problem. I'm not for quotas, and I think that academia as a career may always be one that appeals more to liberals. So be it. But the majority has the obligation to not be tyrannical. Encouraging diversity of thought/opinion should be everyone's goal in academia but when I see our best universities cancelling even mainstream center right speakers like Condi Rice it gives me pause. Are those in charge interested in the education of their students or in reinforcing their own power?

Agree 100% with everything you've said.

[mu-rara]

I agree. A citizenry's relationship with law enforcement is more fundamental. It's also more complicated - cops are scared and mistrustful and so are the minorities they are supposed to serve. There's more real crime and violence in minority communities so there's naturally a larger police presence. A larger police presence also results in arrests for "crimes" (drug possession, e.g.) mostly ignored in low crime areas. Lots of meat to chew on that bone, and as long as people resort to talking points in lieu of really talking progress will be painfully slow.

By contrast, the imbalance of power on college campuses is an easy problem. I'm not for quotas, and I think that academia as a career may always be one that appeals more to liberals. So be it. But the majority has the obligation to not be tyrannical. Encouraging diversity of thought/opinion should be everyone's goal in academia but when I see our best universities cancelling even mainstream center right speakers like Condi Rice it gives me pause. Are those in charge interested in the education of their students or in reinforcing their own power?

Spot on Lenny.  Liberals on campus use their power in the same way that they claim conservatives use power against "the weak".  Power corrupts, no matter who holds it.

[GGGG]

I agree. A citizenry's relationship with law enforcement is more fundamental. It's also more complicated - cops are scared and mistrustful and so are the minorities they are supposed to serve. There's more real crime and violence in minority communities so there's naturally a larger police presence. A larger police presence also results in arrests for "crimes" (drug possession, e.g.) mostly ignored in low crime areas. Lots of meat to chew on that bone, and as long as people resort to talking points in lieu of really talking progress will be painfully slow.

By contrast, the imbalance of power on college campuses is an easy problem. I'm not for quotas, and I think that academia as a career may always be one that appeals more to liberals. So be it. But the majority has the obligation to not be tyrannical. Encouraging diversity of thought/opinion should be everyone's goal in academia but when I see our best universities cancelling even mainstream center right speakers like Condi Rice it gives me pause. Are those in charge interested in the education of their students or in reinforcing their own power?

I agree with this.

Spot on Lenny.  Liberals on campus use their power in the same way that they claim conservatives use power against "the weak".  Power corrupts, no matter who holds it.

*Some* liberals on *some* campuses.  Let's not make it a blanket statement.  And no...power doesn't always corrupt.

[mu-rara]

Nicely put. Your overall point is spot on.

Although, I have to add that a conservative is being marginalized on a college campus, he or she can presumably find another career.

Presumably, than, women, minorities, LGBT, any other oppressed group could find another career too?

[Jay Bee]

Presumably, than, women, minorities, LGBT, any other oppressed group could find another career too?

Where is the other part? Isn't there a Q on that acronym now too?

[rocket surgeon]

I agree. A citizenry's relationship with law enforcement is more fundamental. It's also more complicated - cops are scared and mistrustful and so are the minorities they are supposed to serve. There's more real crime and violence in minority communities so there's naturally a larger police presence. A larger police presence also results in arrests for "crimes" (drug possession, e.g.) mostly ignored in low crime areas. Lots of meat to chew on that bone, and as long as people resort to talking points in lieu of really talking progress will be painfully slow.

By contrast, the imbalance of power on college campuses is an easy problem. I'm not for quotas, and I think that academia as a career may always be one that appeals more to liberals. So be it. But the majority has the obligation to not be tyrannical. Encouraging diversity of thought/opinion should be everyone's goal in academia but when I see our best universities cancelling even mainstream center right speakers like Condi Rice it gives me pause. Are those in charge interested in the education of their students or in reinforcing their own power?

dynamite!  lenny's quote here should be used as a reference and focal point to any argument regarding the liberal vs. conservative imbalance on college campuses.  i had the good fortune of seeing/hearing condi rice speak at a convention.  wow!  she has so much to offer to people of ALL walks.  her talk wasn't political at all.  it was about rising above the fray and empowering yourself.  we all can be what we want to be.  check out her history and you'll see that she is living proof and she definitely walked the walk.  she talks about succeeding in life and by the way, she became one of the first 2 women to become members of augusta national, her name comes up often to be the next commisioner of the nfl...

[warriorchick]

dynamite!  lenny's quote here should be used as a reference and focal point to any argument regarding the liberal vs. conservative imbalance on college campuses.  i had the good fortune of seeing/hearing condi rice speak at a convention.  wow!  she has so much to offer to people of ALL walks.  her talk wasn't political at all.  it was about rising above the fray and empowering yourself.  we all can be what we want to be.  check out her history and you'll see that she is living proof and she definitely walked the walk.  she talks about succeeding in life and by the way, she became one of the first 2 women to become members of augusta national, her name comes up often to be the next commisioner of the nfl...

Is the "shift" key broken on your device?

[rocket surgeon]

Is the "shift" key broken on your device?

It's called a choice. Many may not like it, but I am really amazed by how much it bothers people.  I see my iPad is correcting it for me but if I'm on one of my other devices, I'm just another lazy slob I guess and I just choose to type away.  It's ok though.  If people want to judge me and my opinions by the type and scrambling nature of my posts...that's ok too but you all are gonna miss a lot of good stuff

[forgetful]

dynamite!  lenny's quote here should be used as a reference and focal point to any argument regarding the liberal vs. conservative imbalance on college campuses.  i had the good fortune of seeing/hearing condi rice speak at a convention.  wow!  she has so much to offer to people of ALL walks.  her talk wasn't political at all.  it was about rising above the fray and empowering yourself.  we all can be what we want to be.  check out her history and you'll see that she is living proof and she definitely walked the walk.  she talks about succeeding in life and by the way, she became one of the first 2 women to become members of augusta national, her name comes up often to be the next commisioner of the nfl...

Remember, those calling for her talk to be cancelled were the students not the professors/administration.  It is their commencement, the person should not be polarizing, she will forever be polarizing to some because of her involvement in the Iraq War and the fictitious WMDs.

College campuses may have more liberal faculty, but they are far from oppressive.  They may disagree with the conservative faculty, but they do not try to repress them in greater than 99% of cases.

In fact, the amount of oppression from the right (despite being a minority) is far stronger.  There are a lot of faculty living in the closet, because of fear of firing.  The number of faculty in this category far outnumber, those whose ideas are marginalized on the right.

[Eldon]

Remember, those calling for her talk to be cancelled were the students not the professors/administration.  It is their commencement, the person should not be polarizing, she will forever be polarizing to some because of her involvement in the Iraq War and the fictitious WMDs.

College campuses may have more liberal faculty, but they are far from oppressive.  They may disagree with the conservative faculty, but they do not try to repress them in greater than 99% of cases.

In fact, the amount of oppression from the right (despite being a minority) is far stronger.  There are a lot of faculty living in the closet, because of fear of firing.  The number of faculty in this category far outnumber, those whose ideas are marginalized on the right.

Whoops.

http://www.nj.com/education/2014/05/how_condoleezza_rices_rutgers_commencement_appearance_fell_apart_in_88_days.html
"A few weeks later, petitions objecting to Rice's selection began circulating around campus. Then, the Rutgers faculty council on the New Brunswick campus filed the first formal objection to Rice's selection when they passed a resolution calling on the school to rescind her invitation."

Here's Bloomberg lamenting the oppression
http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2014/5/29/bloomberg-commencemnt-censorship-education/

And here's faculty protesting an institute named after a (fiscally-)conservative scholar, a Nobel laureate no less
http://www.thefire.org/u-of-chicago-faculty-members-oppose-milton-friedman-institute/

[ChicosBailBonds]

Remember, those calling for her talk to be cancelled were the students not the professors/administration.  It is their commencement, the person should not be polarizing, she will forever be polarizing to some because of her involvement in the Iraq War and the fictitious WMDs.

College campuses may have more liberal faculty, but they are far from oppressive.  They may disagree with the conservative faculty, but they do not try to repress them in greater than 99% of cases.

In fact, the amount of oppression from the right (despite being a minority) is far stronger.  There are a lot of faculty living in the closet, because of fear of firing.  The number of faculty in this category far outnumber, those whose ideas are marginalized on the right.

Can you quantify the "FACT" you stated at the end.

Secondly, at college commencements over the last 15 years, the number of times faculty have turned their backs on a conservative speaker vs a liberal speaker during the speech?  Is it 50 to 0?  100 to 0?   Honestly cannot recall ever a liberal having FACULTY turn their backs on them.  Some in the crowd might, but not the faculty.

[Blue Horseshoe]

Can you quantify the "FACT" you stated at the end.

Secondly, at college commencements over the last 15 years, the number of times faculty have turned their backs on a conservative speaker vs a liberal speaker during the speech?  Is it 50 to 0?  100 to 0?   Honestly cannot recall ever a liberal having FACULTY turn their backs on them.  Some in the crowd might, but not the faculty.

Invitation left unanswered for days forever.

[forgetful]

Can you quantify the "FACT" you stated at the end.

Secondly, at college commencements over the last 15 years, the number of times faculty have turned their backs on a conservative speaker vs a liberal speaker during the speech?  Is it 50 to 0?  100 to 0?   Honestly cannot recall ever a liberal having FACULTY turn their backs on them.  Some in the crowd might, but not the faculty.

The phrase "in fact" is an abbreviation for "in point of fact" it is used to counter an assertion.  The assertion being that liberals repress conservatives on campuses.  I do know about a dozen professors who hide the fact that they are gay from coworkers/colleagues, because they may lose their jobs (if untenured) for being gay and are ostracized by the right on campuses.  Even after tenure, they still hide it, because ones that have come out have been attacked by the minority (the right).

As for the turning their back.  It is a form of protest.  The right just typically doesn't come to the liberal talks at all.

[ChicosBailBonds]

The phrase "in fact" is an abbreviation for "in point of fact" it is used to counter an assertion.  The assertion being that liberals repress conservatives on campuses.  I do know about a dozen professors who hide the fact that they are gay from coworkers/colleagues, because they may lose their jobs (if untenured) for being gay and are ostracized by the right on campuses.  Even after tenure, they still hide it, because ones that have come out have been attacked by the minority (the right).

As for the turning their back.  It is a form of protest.  The right just typically doesn't come to the liberal talks at all.

Conservatives don't attend college commencements when liberals are speaking?

[forgetful]

Conservatives don't attend college commencements when liberals are speaking?

Some don't.  Do all liberals turn their backs on speakers?

[ChicosBailBonds]

Some don't.  Do all liberals turn their backs on speakers?

Some liberals do for conservative speakers.  I cannot think of one example EVER where the opposite happened.  That's why I asked.

I can name literally dozens if not more where liberals have turned their backs on conservative speakers in "protest", but not the reverse.  Why do you think that is?

As for your story about gay out of the closet professors hiding, that seems odd to me.  Now, granted that I live in So. Cal where coming out gay has been going on for 30 years and is no big deal, but with liberals dominating college professorships and employment in general, I find this odd unless your gay professor friends are teaching at a strongly conservative college.  I don't know and everyone has their reasons for staying in the closet, etc.  I hope your friends find the courage to do so, they are professors after all and likely have tenure, plus they would be protected against any harassment.  They shouldn't fear anything IMO, but if they do I hope they find the strength to come forward.  The law is on their side and more than likely based on the profession they chose, they have allies everywhere.  Plus, populace is overwhelmingly accepting of gay people, even a majority supports gay marriage in this country.  My two cents.

[Ellenson Guerrero]

This article struck me as apropos for this thread:  http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/03/22/opinion/sunday/judith-shulevitz-hiding-from-scary-ideas.html?referrer=&_r=0

[Eldon]

Pony up, Marquette

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-steven-salaita-settlement-met-20151112-story.html

The University of Illinois' decision last year to revoke a job offer to controversial professor Steven Salaita will cost more than $2 million, including an $875,000 settlement that trustees approved Thursday.

Salaita, who lost a tenured faculty position after posting a string of anti-Israel comments on social media, will get $600,000 in the deal in exchange for dropping two lawsuits against the university and agreeing he will never work at U. of I.

Salaita's attorneys will get $275,000.

The settlement — to be paid out within 30 days — is on top of the $1.3 million in legal fees the university has spent during the past 14 months on Salaita-related issues, including a federal suit brought by Salaita that alleged breach of contract and violation of his free speech rights.

[GGGG]

We will see, but McAdams wasn't a free speech or freedom of expression case, but a workplace conduct case.  Different set of standards.

[Coleman]

Pony up, Marquette

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-steven-salaita-settlement-met-20151112-story.html

The University of Illinois' decision last year to revoke a job offer to controversial professor Steven Salaita will cost more than $2 million, including an $875,000 settlement that trustees approved Thursday.

Salaita, who lost a tenured faculty position after posting a string of anti-Israel comments on social media, will get $600,000 in the deal in exchange for dropping two lawsuits against the university and agreeing he will never work at U. of I.

Salaita's attorneys will get $275,000.

The settlement — to be paid out within 30 days — is on top of the $1.3 million in legal fees the university has spent during the past 14 months on Salaita-related issues, including a federal suit brought by Salaita that alleged breach of contract and violation of his free speech rights.

Would be money well spent in McAdams' case

[mu-rara]

We will see, but McAdams wasn't a free speech or freedom of expression case, but a workplace conduct case.  Different set of standards.

Well, that's the narrative Marquette is spinning.

[GGGG]

Well, that's the narrative Marquette is spinning.

By "narrative," you mean "legal position," then yes.  Whether or not it is a legal position that is viable, time will tell.  But that makes it different than the UofI case.

[keefe]

Is the "shift" key broken on your device?

The first challenge to Rocket's unique writing style!

Chick is like the shepherds who found the Dead Sea Scrolls!

[rocket surgeon]

The first challenge to Rocket's unique writing style!

Chick is like the shepherds who found the Dead Sea Scrolls!

NOW THAT'S FUNNY!