2013 NFC North/NFL Thread

[mu-rara]

You really want to turn this into a pointless charity-work/nice-guy pi$$ing contest? Cool.

There. Both guys do charity work and are genuinely decent guys. Glad we got that cleared up.

Only question that matters...Who would Bear fans prefer as their QB.  Rodgers or Cutler?

Thought so.

[jesmu84]

Only question that matters...Who would Bear fans prefer as their QB.  Rodgers or Cutler?

Thought so.

I'm not disagreeing. But I think this discussion was about perceived appearance by the public.

[NavinRJohnson]

Wow, the last 5 pages of 'is Jay Cutler a jerk or not' conversation is scintillating stuff.

[MU B2002]

Only question that matters...Who would Bear fans prefer as their QB.  Rodgers or Cutler?

Thought so.

Such a wicked burn.

[tower912]

If Cutler starts.......  I predict Suh sacks him again and he re-injures his groin.   The NFL finds a way to fine Suh for the hit.     Another defensive injury for the Bears.   Ouch.   I am going to do something that I cannot ever remember doing before and predict the Lions win in Chicago.   Too many injuries on defense catches up to the Bears and the Lions win a shootout.    Having actually made that prediction, as a Lions fan I expect to be let down. 

[DegenerateDish]

Let's play football. I feel like these last five pages are a sports radio show I'd turn off quickly.

[jesmu84]

I like Simmons' take on Martin/Incognito/NFL teams, especially the last two sentences...

"Unrelated: I have a good feel for anything that might mushroom into a massive sports story at this point, but the collective newspaper/Internet/sports-radio/talking-head reaction to Incognito vs. Martin blew me away. How did this become the most polarizing NFL story since Michael Vick came back from jail? And how does the story keep gaining steam? People are so fired up that there was angry shouting on "Mike & Mike" this week. Repeat: There was angry shouting on "Mike & Mike" this week!!!! On Monday, I thought the big takeaway would be "Oh yeah, I totally forgot — football players are dumb meatheads" and we'd be making jokes about Jonathan Martin wasting a perfectly good plate of spaghetti. Instead, it has launched the following story lines …

    "How can we stop bullying in the workplace?"
    "Did Miami's coaching staff order the Code Red?"
    "Should people outside a locker room be allowed to tell people inside a locker room how to act?"
    "What's the difference between being a leader and being an pretty boy?"
    "Why did the Dolphins so steadfastly stick up for Incognito when he seems like such a humongous jerk? Is this like Stockholm syndrome?"
    "What are the boundaries of racially charged teasing between teammates?"
    "Should the locker room be like a family — in other words, what happens in the house stays in the house?"
    "Wait, NFL players make rookies pay for everything? This really happens?"
    "When one of the Mikes becomes upset on 'Mike & Mike,' should this be considered a national emergency?"
    "What's going to happen to the Dolphins now? Can they recover from this?"
    "Isn't there a certain irony in the bully culture of blogs/Twitter/message boards now rushing to the defense of Jonathan Martin and taking a strong stand against bullying?"
    "Hey, all the ex-players on TV who keep saying that Martin needed to stand up for himself and punch Incognito when Martin clearly had mental issues know that they sound like insensitive Neanderthals, right?"
    "How do we honor tradition and team building without crossing the line into hazing?"
    "What does this story say about us?"

 
That's a whopping 14 story lines! On Grantland, we've already run two terrific takes — one by Brian Phillips, one by Andrew Sharp — and we probably could have run five or six more. Two lingering points stuck out for me. First, Sharp made a fantastic point about how we spent the past three decades deifying Michael Jordan … a homicidally competitive superstar who brutalized any teammate who didn't meet his lofty standards. What Jordan did to Kwame Brown, Brad Sellers and others wasn't any different from what Incognito did to Martin. I'm not saying this should alter MJ's legacy or anything. But we've seen bullying in sports since basically forever, and other than your occasional Real Sports/Outside the Lines/E:60 piece, nobody really cared until Martin vs. Incognito. Now? People care. Just feels like more and more people are going to be coming out with their stories. This ain't ending anytime soon.

And second, I'm endlessly fascinated by people who keep bringing up "the code" in football locker rooms like it's the military or something. I never played football past ninth grade, so I don't feel comfortable saying it's right or wrong. But more than a few ex-players genuinely believe that there's something to the whole "Everything that happens in the locker room NEEDS TO STAY IN THE LOCKER ROOM" thing, and that nobody can fully understand it unless they've played football. That this story ballooned during the same week as Tony Dorsett's heartbreaking CTE story meant something, I think. It's just becoming clearer and clearer that professional football is a profoundly messed-up sport. And yet we're still watching. "

[ChicosBailBonds]

Why did Simmons limit it to professional football?  Why not college, high school?  Why not hockey?  LaCrosse?  Women's hoops, etc?

[brandx]

Why did Simmons limit it to professional football?  Why not college, high school?  Why not hockey?  LaCrosse?  Women's hoops, etc?

You sound like a politician with the false equivalency argument. Everything is not equal.

[ChicosBailBonds]

[brandx]

The dog is gonna sue if he breaks his hind leg 

[ChicosBailBonds]

You sound like a politician with the false equivalency argument. Everything is not equal.

It's about the children.....I didn't realize a concussed kid playing hockey was different than a concussed kid playing football.  They're both concussed.  


And you sound like today's press....you'll decide what gets equal treatment and if you don't like the other argument, you can fall back on the commentary that it's not the same, thus doesn't deserve equal time.

[jesmu84]

It's about the children.....I didn't realize a concussed kid playing hockey was different than a concussed kid playing football.  They're both concussed.  


And you sound like today's press....you'll decide what gets equal treatment and if you don't like the other argument, you can fall back on the commentary that it's not the same, thus doesn't deserve equal time.

Ironic isn't it that the press and politicians are both controlled by the same entities?

[NavinRJohnson]

Why did Simmons limit it to professional football?  Why not college, high school?  Why not hockey?  LaCrosse?  Women's hoops, etc?

Because the NFL was the subject. Not sure why that would be difficult to understand.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Because the NFL was the subject. Not sure why that would be difficult to understand.

Here I thought Simmons was a sports columnist, not a NFL columnist....my bad....

[GGGG]

Here I thought Simmons was a sports columnist, not a NFL columnist....my bad....

He is a sports columnist.  He was writing a column about the NFL.  I'm trying to figure out if you are being purposely obtuse again.

[jesmu84]

Scott who?

[wadesworld]

How did we not sign a QB? That is literally beyond belief. Not only does Wallace suck, but how can you only have a backup QB and a practice squad QB on your roster? You don't think Wallace could get hurt? Good preparation.

This could get ugly.

[ChicosBailBonds]

He is a sports columnist.  He was writing a column about the NFL.  I'm trying to figure out if you are being purposely obtuse again.

I'm trying to understand why he isn't using his pretend outrage to cover all of the issue, not just one part.  You do get 4 points for using obtuse in a sentence, however.

[jesmu84]

Colts might be the biggest "play to the level of the competition" team i've ever seen.

[wadesworld]

Jay being Jay. Loved those red zone interceptions. Better off with McCown under center.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Scott who?

Vadger QB.

Aside from Wilson, who played one year for UW-madison and is really a product of NC State, the Vadgers haven't exactly lit the world on fired the last, oh, century in terms of QBs in the NFL.

Randy Wright
Brooks Bollinger
Neil Graff
Jim Sorgi
VanderKelen
Tolzien

I don't think Bevell ever even made a roster.  Decent college QBs, but just have had a tough time in the NFL.

[ChicosBailBonds]

"I'll kill you" from a guy with a violent criminal past who is considered the dirtiest player in the game.

Hardly playing "fast and loose".

Looks like Martin said the same thing to Incognito....do you think Martin was actually trying to kill Incognito's family or just playing "fast and loose"?   


http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9955599/richie-incognito-miami-dolphins-only-product-environment

"When words are put in a context, I understand why a lot of eyebrows get raised," Incognito told Fox Sports during the interview, which aired Sunday. "But people don't know how Jon and I communicate to one another. For instance, a week before this went down, Jonathan Martin texted me on my phone, 'I will murder your whole F'ing family.'

"Now, do I think Jonathan Martin was going to murder my family? Not one bit. He texted me that. I didn't think he was going to kill my family. I knew that was coming from a brother. I knew it was coming from a friend. I knew it was coming from a teammate."

[DegenerateDish]

Jay being Jay. Loved those red zone interceptions. Better off with McCown under center.

One was clearly tipped.

If I were a Pack fan, I'd be much more concerned about the sinking ship that is Green Bay's season.

[jesmu84]

Looks like Martin said the same thing to Incognito....do you think Martin was actually trying to kill Incognito's family or just playing "fast and loose"?   


http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9955599/richie-incognito-miami-dolphins-only-product-environment

"When words are put in a context, I understand why a lot of eyebrows get raised," Incognito told Fox Sports during the interview, which aired Sunday. "But people don't know how Jon and I communicate to one another. For instance, a week before this went down, Jonathan Martin texted me on my phone, 'I will murder your whole F'ing family.'

"Now, do I think Jonathan Martin was going to murder my family? Not one bit. He texted me that. I didn't think he was going to kill my family. I knew that was coming from a brother. I knew it was coming from a friend. I knew it was coming from a teammate."

Does Martin have the same violent past? I honestly don't know. I think that has to play into it.