What should be MU's next campus improvement priority?

[deep vacuum]

I already touched on Lalumiere. Its NOT functional. It leaks water every year into classrooms and hallways. I guess you could repair/renovate for that, but why not just tear the damn thing down?

And they have been advertising on the new Law School. At least last time I drove by it, there was a huge blue and gold sign that said Marquette University Law School visible from the highway.

Thomas Ganey from the University Architect's office had a nice little presentation last fall on "The Business of Marquette". I believe he mentioned that both Lalumiere and McCormick, despite known building issues, are incredibly inexpensive to operate.  Both buildings are going nowhere unless someone decides to pay for the removal and construction of replacement buildings.

[martyconlonontherun]

I already touched on Lalumiere. Its NOT functional. It leaks water every year into classrooms and hallways. I guess you could repair/renovate for that, but why not just tear the damn thing down?

I've had multiple classes and spent a large amount of time there for social organizations. Never noticed the leaking problem. Maybe they fixed it the last 3 years. There's a big difference between tearing down and building a new building, and fixing a roof. I agree with you on it needing to come down in the future. IMO, though, McCormick>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>need then Lalumiere. I look at dorms as big part of the college experience and a lot of students get turned off living in a small, pie-shaped room. Not only that, but even the design is a hazard in that one of the stairs only goes to the second floor.

And they have been advertising on the new Law School. At least last time I drove by it, there was a huge blue and gold sign that said Marquette University Law School visible from the highway.

Never said they weren't advertising the law school. In fact, I said they were doing a good job. I just wanted more permanent advertising. Not necessarily billboards, but more stuff on building and more along the highway. Will that big sign still be there when the school is complete?

[/quote]

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

By increasing tuition, that has helped to raise the profile and weed out some students that are not qualified to attend MU.

Sorry if that sounds prickish, but I believe it to be true. 

This is 100% true, but what's the tipping point? 40K per year? 50K per year? 100k per year?

At some point (I don't know when) MU is going to become too expensive for a lot of bright kids... leaving only the wealthy who can afford it.

[ChicosBailBonds]

The only problem with that concept is that .. at no point will anyone say "ok, we have enough" and that leads to constant spending, often for spending's sake because, well for the love of god, we've got to improve.  If you're not first, you're last.  --  This isn't an electronics company, in desperate need to innovate every quarter.

I imagine a MU Trustee meeting, where someone plops down a great plan with the premise it will improve quality of such and such.  Well, improve quality, we've got to improve quality.  Better is better.  We've got to improve always.   Plan approved!

Bottom line, all this improvement is just super.  Super-d-duper.  Unfortunately, the product is going to get so super, so expensive, in the long run, no one will be able to afford the product.  

Then the mission has failed.

(Another note .. aggressive cost containment, even at the detriment of the perception of prestige, I believe, would NOT give MU fewer applicants.  MU would receive more applicants, since the truth is, the prestige level is fine as it is .. if they were a low(er) cost leader, the world would beat a path to their doorstep in this age of outrageous tuition levels.)

LOL....sounds like my argument with government.  Always a new program, always a new entitlement, they never stop and the old ones never go away.

I understand what you're saying, there's a fine line here, however.  If we're to attract quality students, we need quality buildings.  I think the Dental School is exhibit A for this.  If these are funded outside of the core University fund by donors \ gifts, I'm all for it because it's something MU has to do to stay competitive.

The cost of attending MU is high, but students are also receiving a tremendous amount of grants and aid as well which makes it a reasonable cost for many.

[Brewtown Andy]

I understand that the old law library will be torn down in the near future but does anyone know what will happen to Sensenbrenner Hall when Eckstein Hall opens?

My understanding was that Sensenbrenner will be restored to its pre-expansion state, albeit with an elevator somehow. 

[MUBurrow]

do you know what it will be used for at that point?

[ZiggysFryBoy]

This is 100% true, but what's the tipping point? 40K per year? 50K per year? 100k per year?

At some point (I don't know when) MU is going to become too expensive for a lot of bright kids... leaving only the wealthy who can afford it.

MU isn't the only school that is increasing tuition.  All schools are, public and private.  Look at the US news website at the top 100 schools, specifically schools that I consider peer schools and their tuition is right around the same as MU's.

Of course, then there's UW, which has about 75 new buildings going up at the same time.  and signs boasting about how little tuition $$ are being used to build some of the buildings.   

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

MU isn't the only school that is increasing tuition.  All schools are, public and private.  Look at the US news website at the top 100 schools, specifically schools that I consider peer schools and their tuition is right around the same as MU's.

Of course, then there's UW, which has about 75 new buildings going up at the same time.  and signs boasting about how little tuition $$ are being used to build some of the buildings.   

Totally fair.

I'm fearful that a lot of private schools might be pricing themselves right out of the market, MU especially.

[Ari Gold]

this topic has been discussed extensively but I wanted to toss in a few thoughts. Negating the thought that these costs would directly be passed on to the students.

I think that Laulamire needs to be taken down. It's an eyesore. I think besides a more modern building to replace it MU needs to put up a clock tower of some sort.

Catholic knights would be a great building to remodel and create for student housing but I think it would be a great place to consolidate professors and academic people for some/most colleges. That way MU could get rid of the academic support facility -when I was there a few TAs were forced to be in there.

As a CoC grad I think MU needs to gut JH. There are stairwells that don't go to every floor, floors don't have both mens and women's bathrooms and the audio or taping studios are spaced too far apart while the computers are too close together. And there is that whole issue of MU radio not operating on a frequency.

The Rec Center could use a remodel or rebuild. It gets real crowded after 3pm til about 630-7.  If things would just get a bit more comfortable in there.

On a side note and more of an aesthetic suggestion, MU needs a fountain. 

[Coleman]

this topic has been discussed extensively but I wanted to toss in a few thoughts. Negating the thought that these costs would directly be passed on to the students.

I think that Laulamire needs to be taken down. It's an eyesore. I think besides a more modern building to replace it MU needs to put up a clock tower of some sort.

Catholic knights would be a great building to remodel and create for student housing but I think it would be a great place to consolidate professors and academic people for some/most colleges. That way MU could get rid of the academic support facility -when I was there a few TAs were forced to be in there.

As a CoC grad I think MU needs to gut JH. There are stairwells that don't go to every floor, floors don't have both mens and women's bathrooms and the audio or taping studios are spaced too far apart while the computers are too close together. And there is that whole issue of MU radio not operating on a frequency.

The Rec Center could use a remodel or rebuild. It gets real crowded after 3pm til about 630-7.  If things would just get a bit more comfortable in there.

On a side note and more of an aesthetic suggestion, MU needs a fountain. 

+1 on the clocktower/fountain. I think these could be combined into one piece. SLU has a nice clocktower/fountain. Where would you put it?

[ChicosBailBonds]

This is 100% true, but what's the tipping point? 40K per year? 50K per year? 100k per year?

At some point (I don't know when) MU is going to become too expensive for a lot of bright kids... leaving only the wealthy who can afford it.

Perhaps, but with the amount of money in aid coming in for students, I think we are far from hitting that tipping point.  Don't get me wrong, I worry about it.  It's like any product, whether it's your monthly television bill, cost of a basketball ticket or sending a kid to college.  Price elasticity is a big issue.

I just don't want MU to go back to the days of having an ugly school in a piss poor neighborhood.  MU finally recognized that and cleaned things up, put money into aesthetics, improved the appearance and made functional improvements to some academic buildings which ultimately will lead to a higher quality law, dental and engineering student coming to Marquette.

We've made steady strides in our academic ratings during this same time.   MU has to decide what it wants to be.  IMO, if they want to stay where they are academically and not fall back, they're going to have to continue to spend money improving buildings, labs, etc to justify the tuition expenses.

Tuition isn't going down so the way to maintain the price integrity is to continue providing a product that people believe warrants that expenditure.  That includes the physical plant.

[Brewtown Andy]

As a CoC grad I think MU needs to gut JH. There are stairwells that don't go to every floor,

Only one, and it doesn't go up to 5 and that's it.

floors don't have both mens and women's bathrooms

This would literally require starting the building over at this point, since there's no space for 2 bathrooms next to each other in the current location, so the piping would have to be completely redone.

And there is that whole issue of MU radio not operating on a frequency.

I'm guessing that's more of a funding issue than anything else?

CoC has done a lot of work refreshing the existing room setup, including a complete revamp for the Tribune, MUTV, and WMUR offices, moving all of them into the same end of the basement.

[martyconlonontherun]

Not leaning one way or another, but I find it funny some are arguing to keep costs down while others want to build fountains and a clock-tower, which kind of reminds me of Avenue Commons.

[Brewtown Andy]

Not leaning one way or another, but I find it funny some are arguing to keep costs down while others want to build fountains and a clock-tower, which kind of reminds me of Avenue Commons.

[NumenFlumenque]

On a side note and more of an aesthetic suggestion, MU needs a fountain. 

Well, technically, there is that little fountain in front of Joan of Arc. Of course, I don't think I've ever actually seen running water.

I've heard this somewhere, but is it true that OPUS (the construction company building all these things) also helps fund the cost of construction for these buildings? They have exclusive access to MU projects (seemingly). Do they throw in some money to kick it off? And does MU pay it back, or is it part of some deal they have together?

[Ari Gold]

Andy-
CoC got like a $20m donation a few years ago. I know it was used to buy some great equipment for the Broadcasting students but nothing about a frequency. I think the BREC students ran out of places to put AVID computers. I like what that money went to for the MUTV studio.

There is also that middle stairwell on the west side of the building, Pretty sure it's locked. Either way traffic flow sucks in that building. Also 'that one stairwell" can't reach the 2nd floor either.

I didn't know the MUTV and WMUR offices were all put in the basement. I knew the trib was down there. I still thought MTUV was 3rd floor? and WMUR was 4th... or is it 2nd and 3rd.

[Ari Gold]

+1 on the clocktower/fountain. I think these could be combined into one piece. SLU has a nice clocktower/fountain. Where would you put it?

If it was Just a clock tower, I'd put it where LL is (of course with an Academic building too), but you could put both on the mall there. I just think it's terrible that when people drive on I-94 the one MU building they see is LL. A nice clock tower, a MU style academic building and a fountain would look nicer. 

[martyconlonontherun]

There is also that middle stairwell on the west side of the building, Pretty sure it's locked. Either way traffic flow sucks in that building. Also 'that one stairwell" can't reach the 2nd floor either.

I think you can't access the second floor because it's locked, right? It wouldn't need new construction, just a set of keys.

[GGGG]

Well, technically, there is that little fountain in front of Joan of Arc. Of course, I don't think I've ever actually seen running water.

I've heard this somewhere, but is it true that OPUS (the construction company building all these things) also helps fund the cost of construction for these buildings? They have exclusive access to MU projects (seemingly). Do they throw in some money to kick it off? And does MU pay it back, or is it part of some deal they have together?

Opus is owned / run (???) by Marquette people.  I'm sure they give MU a discount...I'm sure that MU gives them all their jobs to keep them happy.  And I'm sure donations then flow back from the company and the alumni to the University.

[NumenFlumenque]

Opus is owned / run (???) by Marquette people.  I'm sure they give MU a discount...I'm sure that MU gives them all their jobs to keep them happy.  And I'm sure donations then flow back from the company and the alumni to the University.

Thanks for the info.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Perhaps, but with the amount of money in aid coming in for students, I think we are far from hitting that tipping point.  Don't get me wrong, I worry about it.  It's like any product, whether it's your monthly television bill, cost of a basketball ticket or sending a kid to college.  Price elasticity is a big issue.

I just don't want MU to go back to the days of having an ugly school in a piss poor neighborhood.  MU finally recognized that and cleaned things up, put money into aesthetics, improved the appearance and made functional improvements to some academic buildings which ultimately will lead to a higher quality law, dental and engineering student coming to Marquette.

We've made steady strides in our academic ratings during this same time.   MU has to decide what it wants to be.  IMO, if they want to stay where they are academically and not fall back, they're going to have to continue to spend money improving buildings, labs, etc to justify the tuition expenses.

Tuition isn't going down so the way to maintain the price integrity is to continue providing a product that people believe warrants that expenditure.  That includes the physical plant.

Agree completely.

I'm by no means saying that MU should stop building and freeze tuition costs...

BUT, they need to be smart about what they do. It looks like an awesome idea right now to keep building new facilities in order to attract top students. I get it.

But, 4 years ago it also seemed like a good idea for lenders to give out $$ like crazy to anybody with a pulse because real-estate was a can't lose option.

Things change.

I hope the campus keeps improving, but I hope MU keeps a keen eye on it's rising costs. Should they build? Yes. Should they keep going and going and going and going. Nope.  I know nobody is proposing that, but you get the idea.

MU needs to be smart about what they do and how they do it. Upgrade where it fits, maintain when possible.

[muwarrior87]

Opus is owned / run (???) by Marquette people.  I'm sure they give MU a discount...I'm sure that MU gives them all their jobs to keep them happy.  And I'm sure donations then flow back from the company and the alumni to the University.

Marquette is also the only reason Opus is functioning right now.  Just about every one of their offices outside of Milwaukee has closed and the MU projects are their only real business right now.

[GGGG]

Marquette is also the only reason Opus is functioning right now.  Just about every one of their offices outside of Milwaukee has closed and the MU projects are their only real business right now.

Not according to their web site:

http://www.opuscorp.com/pages/proj_results.aspx?ProjectComplete=0&Region=&ProjectType=&ProjectSize=0,999999999

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Not according to their web site:

http://www.opuscorp.com/pages/proj_results.aspx?ProjectComplete=0&Region=&ProjectType=&ProjectSize=0,999999999

don't believe everything you read on the internet.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Agree completely.

I'm by no means saying that MU should stop building and freeze tuition costs...

BUT, they need to be smart about what they do. It looks like an awesome idea right now to keep building new facilities in order to attract top students. I get it.

But, 4 years ago it also seemed like a good idea for lenders to give out $$ like crazy to anybody with a pulse because real-estate was a can't lose option.

Things change.

I hope the campus keeps improving, but I hope MU keeps a keen eye on it's rising costs. Should they build? Yes. Should they keep going and going and going and going. Nope.  I know nobody is proposing that, but you get the idea.

MU needs to be smart about what they do and how they do it. Upgrade where it fits, maintain when possible.

I never thought it was a good idea to lend money to people who couldn't even pay the rent, but that's a subject for another day.

In MU's case, they can finance debt and make this happen.  You are right, they need to be smart about it.  Gold toilet seats....no thanks.