Favre talking to Vikings...here we go again

[ATWizJr]

Favre just might make Childress look like Eric Mangini, too.

[NavinRJohnson]

The problem is the coaching.  They passed the ball too much last year with Jackson at QB.  Childress is gonna look like Mike Martz this year with Favre - despite having the best running back in the game.

I completely agree with this. Couple it with Favre's obviously declining health and ability, and this is absolutely the best thing they could have done for the Packers and Bears. AP is virtually unstoppable, and now they are gonna let Favre go out there and throw interceptions to try to satisfy some irrational need to stick it to Ted Thompson? Silly.

[reinko]

The problem is the coaching.  They passed the ball too much last year with Jackson at QB.  Childress is gonna look like Mike Martz this year with Favre - despite having the best running back in the game.

It's not quite that simple, the Vikes had the 3rd most rushing attempts in the NFL last year (519), only behind Atlanta and the Ravens.  And threw it 267 times, which was 23rd in the league.  So yeah, they could be running more and passing less, but they are clealry running the ball a ton, and at least with Favre you can keep the linebackers honest, and not throw 7-8 guys in the box.

[ATWizJr]

With the exception of obvious passing downs when Viking's opponents will go nickel or dime, you'll rarely seen less than 7 in the box.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

At this point, this would be a move by the Vikings in response to the Bears off season moves. I don't think either team is particularly concerned with what the Packers bring to the table this coming season.

And I'm a Bears fan who has NEVER liked the Vikings. I actually like GB, but I'm not as enamored with Rodgers as some seem to be. The Vikings, on the other hand, with a QB that's even servicable (and Favre is still much more than that) have to be considered one of the 2 or 3 favorites in the NFC.

[NavinRJohnson]

with a QB that's even servicable (and Favre is still much more than that)

On what do you base that opinion? His arm injury, the end of the season collapse and 22 INT's last year, or the fact that he will be 40 in October?

As I said in the very first post of this thread, this is going to be a negative for the Vikings, not a positive.

[GGGG]

At this point, this would be a move by the Vikings in response to the Bears off season moves. I don't think either team is particularly concerned with what the Packers bring to the table this coming season.

As a Packer fan, I agree with you.

[LON]

As a Packer fan, I agree with you.

I'm more concerned with making sure TT gets a good deal in place for Jennings. 

Also, you gotta feel for Kampan; he's in a contract year and is being asked to play an entirely different position.

[GGGG]

I'm more concerned with making sure TT gets a good deal in place for Jennings. 

Also, you gotta feel for Kampan; he's in a contract year and is being asked to play an entirely different position.

And his high school coach was just murdered this morning.

[NavinRJohnson]

Also, you gotta feel for Kampan; he's in a contract year and is being asked to play an entirely different position.

He'll be just fine. When you're good, you're good. He has a large enough body of work leading up to this year that he can easily explain away any struggles with the new scheme. Frankly, if he has a decent year, his value will probably go up because of his ability to make the adjustment.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

He'll be just fine. When you're good, you're good. He has a large enough body of work leading up to this year that he can easily explain away any struggles with the new scheme. Frankly, if he has a decent year, his value will probably go up because of his ability to make the adjustment.

Couldn't you say the same thing for Farve last year?

It was a new system.

The Vikings have a similar west coast system. Should be much more comfortable for him.

Right?

[NavinRJohnson]

Couldn't you say the same thing for Farve last year?

It was a new system.

The Vikings have a similar west coast system. Should be much more comfortable for him.

Right?

Is that a serious question? If you asked this question 10 years ago, you might have something, but Aaron Kampman is not 40 years old, he's not injured, and does not have the wear and tear of playing 18 years in the league. The situations are not comparable in any way.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Is that a serious question? If you asked this question 10 years ago, you might have something, but Aaron Kampman is not 40 years old, he's not injured, and does not have the wear and tear of playing 18 years in the league. The situations are not comparable in any way.

This is a serious question.

The average lifespan of a D lineman in the NFL is not nearly as long as a top QB, so the situations are not as far apart as you think. (still a difference, but not night and day). Kampman is 29. There are VERY few lineman that play past 35... there are a LOT of QB's that play past that age. 

You say Aarron Kampan is good, he's good. So, he's got nothing to worry about even if he stumbles in the 3-4. Right?

I am by no means a Favre backer or anything, I'm just saying that it seems way to convenient that you completely doubt his ability to come back and play, but have no doubts that kampman will be successful in the future.

Favre's injury, is certainly a question... but his 22 interceptions could be written off to moving to a new system just like you seem convinced that teams will right off a lack of success for Kampman on being in a new system.

Right?

If Kampman has 3 sacks, can that be written off on the new system?

[NavinRJohnson]

First off the question was as to Kampman's next contract. Dude is gonna get another decent contract whether he has a bad year or not (unless he gets hurt of course). That was the point, but yes, when you're good, you're good.

When you're old and injured however, you're not good, you used to be good.

Not sure if you watched Favre at all last year, but he was far better early in the year than he was late in the year (when he was downright terrible). His problems had very little to do with the system, and had everything to do with his age and his injury. He is now a year older and just had to have surgery to address the injury.

If Kampman has 3 sacks, can that be written off on the new system?

Probably (maybe not), and if so he has a track record of success in a 4-3 to fall back on to get another team to sign him. That was what I was saying. You brought up Favre, who struggled because of declining ability as a result of age and injury.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Probably (maybe not), and if so he has a track record of success in a 4-3 to fall back on to get another team to sign him. That was what I was saying. You brought up Favre, who struggled because of declining ability as a result of age and injury.

Well, there's the rub, I guess.

Some GM's may see a poor year by kampman as a sign that he's getting old, some may see it as a product of the system.

Some GM's don't see Farve's year as a measure of his ability because he was in a new system (and he was hurt), some see it as just a sign he's not that good anymore. Nobody can really say how much the injury really effected him. Brett will say a lot, but that's because he's too prideful to admit his skills may have diminished or he didn't really understand the system.

I hear what you are saying though... I just don't think it's so easy to be confident that Kampman will bounce back no matter what, while Favre has no shot at bouncing back.

Both moved to new systems (Farve has had an injury as well), which inevitably will have some effect on their future in the league.

[deep vacuum]

Well, there's the rub, I guess.

Some GM's may see a poor year by kampman as a sign that he's getting old, some may see it as a product of the system.

Some GM's don't see Farve's year as a measure of his ability because he was in a new system (and he was hurt), some see it as just a sign he's not that good anymore. Nobody can really say how much the injury really effected him. Brett will say a lot, but that's because he's too prideful to admit his skills may have diminished or he didn't really understand the system.

I hear what you are saying though... I just don't think it's so easy to be confident that Kampman will bounce back no matter what, while Favre has no shot at bouncing back.

Both moved to new systems (Farve has had an injury as well), which inevitably will have some effect on their future in the league.

Favre has been awful the past 4-5 seasons as the seasons wound down.  If past history is an indicator of future production then I would put my money on Kampman producing down the stretch more than I would Favre.

As a Packer fan I am torn about how I feel about Favre joining the dreaded Vikings.  On the plus side is a strong feeling that Farve will be Farve at the worst possible time for the Vikings and cost them a championship.  On the negative side is an equally strong feeling that Farve's antics will cost the Vikings HC his job and they will finally get a qualified HC.  That team with a qualified HC and OC would be scary.

[ATWizJr]

No need to feel torn over Favre. 

Simply put, Favre really does not have any strong desire to play other than to jam it up our collective a**.  His only motive is revenge, pure and simple.  I hope he does play and it costs him his $20 million marketing deal.

As for HOF...he deserves to be in but, he is dead to me, so someone else will have to gush over him.  I've had it with his antics. 

As for Viking fan, be careful what you wish for.  Not bitter, though!

[NavinRJohnson]

Simply put, Favre really does not have any strong desire to play other than to jam it up our collective a**.  His only motive is revenge, pure and simple. 

Don't forget his hillbilly family not yet ready to give up their life of BIRGing and spending his money.

[Hards Alumni]

I like what deepvaccuum said and I'd like to echo his words.

Brett plays great the first 2/3 of the year and then his age and the fatigue that comes along with it starts to kick in and he becomes very erratic.  I think he starts to realize that his body just isn't up to the challenge that his mind is and he starts to force things and elevate his game... but realistically he just becomes the young gunslinger that he used to be... throwing STUPID passes and taking games away from his team rather than coming through like he did in his hay day.

[ATWizJr]

Don't forget his hillbilly family not yet ready to give up their life of BIRGing and spending his money.

Will they be CORFing after this season in MN?

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Favre has been awful the past 4-5 seasons as the seasons wound down.  If past history is an indicator of future production then I would put my money on Kampman producing down the stretch more than I would Favre.

As a Packer fan I am torn about how I feel about Favre joining the dreaded Vikings.  On the plus side is a strong feeling that Farve will be Farve at the worst possible time for the Vikings and cost them a championship.  On the negative side is an equally strong feeling that Farve's antics will cost the Vikings HC his job and they will finally get a qualified HC.  That team with a qualified HC and OC would be scary.

I don't know if he's been awful... but certainly he's had some late season issues.

The interesting thing is that when he was a Packer, I rarely heard this type of criticism. Maybe some people were thinking it, but people rarely said it. It was blasphemy to go against st. Brett.

Now that he may become a Viking, the critiques have become rather harsh. The balance is probably in the middle.

He's not as good as all Packer fans thought 4 years ago, and he's not as bad as most fans are saying now.

I don't know the man personally, but I also can't think that he goes to bed at night dreaming about "shoving it up Packers fans *sses."

Let's face it, he just a dude who loves football. In his mind, Ted tried to take that from him. So, he's going to the best team that needs a quarterback to show Ted (and the rest of the league) that he can still play.

If the Vikes were horrible, I bet he'd be headed to Denver or the Ravens etc. etc.

The fact that they play in the same division is just the cherry on top so he can really "show Ted"

[ATWizJr]

Baloney.

If he wanted to continue playing after last season he could have remained with the Jets.  But that wouldn't have allowed him the revenge he sought. So, he chose to retire once again.  And then unretire again, so he could play against the Packers twice a year.

This is all pretty transparent.  His motivation is revenge against TT and the Packer organization and jamming it up Packer fans *sses is collateral damage which is of no concern to Favre.  He cares nothing for Packer fans or his legacy.

His own indecisiveness led to his leaving GB.  He could still have been playing there but he just couldn't make up his mind and decided not to unretire when Packer officals gave him the chance.  Then, forced to plan to go on without him, the Packers prepared to play with Rodgers. 

This is a mess of his own making and now he wants to keep coming back to prove the Packers made a mistake? 

Favre, you idiot, it's you who made the mistake and now you continue to compound it.  In all likelihood you have lost your $20 million dollar marketing deal, have tarnished your legacy and are about to burn whatever bridges remain to Packer nation.  Wise up and show a little class.  You made the mistake. Show some class and live with it.

If you have a great season with MN do you think the GB fans you alienated will come running back to you singing your praises and beating their breasts asking for your forgiveness?  Or, will they resent you even more for putting their team in a position where they had no choice but to go on without you while you did everything you can to make them pay for YOUR mistake?

[GGGG]

ATWixJr, I agree with most of what you say.  However if Favre says** the right things when he comes to Green Bay this year, eventually goes off into retirement, gets elected into the Hall of Fame, and comes back to Lambeau to get his number retired, he'll be treated like a hero.

**"I thought I was ready to retire a Packer, but I wasn't.  But these fans and this place will always be special to me."

[ATWizJr]

Sultan, I hear ya'.

However, if he thought he was ready to retire a Packer but found out he really wanted to continue to play, then, instead of doing everything possible to go to a team in the Packer's own division and sabotage the Packer's chances, he should have stayed with the Jets.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Baloney.

If he wanted to continue playing after last season he could have remained with the Jets.  But that wouldn't have allowed him the revenge he sought. So, he chose to retire once again.  And then unretire again, so he could play against the Packers twice a year.

This is all pretty transparent.  His motivation is revenge against TT and the Packer organization and jamming it up Packer fans *sses is collateral damage which is of no concern to Favre.  He cares nothing for Packer fans or his legacy.

His own indecisiveness led to his leaving GB.  He could still have been playing there but he just couldn't make up his mind and decided not to unretire when Packer officals gave him the chance.  Then, forced to plan to go on without him, the Packers prepared to play with Rodgers.  

This is a mess of his own making and now he wants to keep coming back to prove the Packers made a mistake?  

Favre, you idiot, it's you who made the mistake and now you continue to compound it.  In all likelihood you have lost your $20 million dollar marketing deal, have tarnished your legacy and are about to burn whatever bridges remain to Packer nation.  Wise up and show a little class.  You made the mistake. Show some class and live with it.

If you have a great season with MN do you think the GB fans you alienated will come running back to you singing your praises and beating their breasts asking for your forgiveness?  Or, will they resent you even more for putting their team in a position where they had no choice but to go on without you while you did everything you can to make them pay for YOUR mistake?

Let me just try to use his Brett's logic though (this is what is going through his mind, not mine)...

#1 He never wanted to go to the Jets, we wanted to be the Packer QB, but Ted told him "no". So Brett wanted to go to the best team that needed a QB... the Vikes. GB wouldn't let that happen.

#2 He wants to go to the Vikes again because they are a GOOD TEAM, unlike the Jets who fired their coach. Also, he knows Darrel B. and the offense, so he feels he has a better chance for success.

#3 Playing the Packers twice is certainly a big bonus... but in case you didn't notice, Brett never tried to go to the Lions, who are in the same division and could have used a QB. Hmmm... I wonder why.... it's because he wants to WIN. MN, more than ANY team in the NFL give him the chance to win.

I don't blame Ted for what he did (team first, I love it), and I'm not a Brett defender (he's been addicted to drugs, cheated on his wife, he doesn't put the team first, etc.).

BUT, I don't like when Packer Backers are so personally offended that Brett would dare want to play football again. HE'S A FOOTBALL PLAYER. LET HIM PLAY FOOTBALL IF HE WANTS.

You are free to root against him. That's sports. It's great.

Just because there are 10,000 Packer rubes with #4 tattoos doesn't mean Brett shouldn't be allowed to play for any team he wants.

Reggie came back. Did that "ruin his legacy"? up in GB... or because he was wearing black and teal, it didn't matter?

This talk about legacy and loyalty are crap. I know we all want to have a man-crush on our favorite players, and we all have a romantic view of our favorite teams... but this is reality.

I know GB fans are tremendously loyal (which is great), but some need to realize that the players and even the team aren't that loyal. Players sign with other teams all of the time, teams cut players every year to save $. It's just business for them. It's transactional, don't pretend it's romance.

The only people that care about Brett's legacy and his marketing contract are Packer fans who were pseudo in love with Brett, and now have to come to gripes with the fact that he's just a super competitive athlete who played in GB... not some divinity sent to save the Packer franchise.