Does vander stay?

[dwaderoy2004]

Watch the NBA sometime and see what type of guards make the league, players who can shot the ball, tell me a GM wants to draft a player with a 30 percent tile from 3 and I will show
you an NBA general manager who will be fired.  Vander needs another year, bottom line, needs to get his shooting in the 40 range to make the association.

Dwyane Wade shot 31% from three his last year in college.

[GGGG]

All 5 are better shooters than Vander is right now!

Oh, and you know what the difference would have been between Vander as a 33% 3pt shooter and the 30% he finished with?

With his 142 attempts, he would have had to make 4 more shots over the course of the year. 

[RawdogDX]

Okay, I think a lot of people are dismissing the idea of Blue leaving. I want to play devil's advocate a bit as to why he should give the NBA a serious thought, and why NBA scouts would also give him a long look:

Vander will only be 20 years old on draft night. He is young for his class (younger than sophomore Mayo) and in the eyes of scouts is a college sophomore. He made his name here with his defense and has proven to be a willing and capable defender. Most important, he has shown the ability to improve. I heard someone talking about how NBA scouts are starting to come around to the idea that potential isn't determined by age but rather by whether or not a player has shown the ability to get better. Vander has shown that in spades.

When he arrived, he was a solid defender. He quickly developed into a very good rebounder and while his rebounding numbers were down this year that was because we needed him to score. He was widely criticized for his shooting form, which has improved by leaps and bounds this year (consistent form, proper release point at height of jump, and making shots out to the arc). His 3P% improved from 16% as a freshman to 25.8% as a sophomore to 30.9% this year. He was also criticized for his finishing at the rim. This year he has become as good a finisher at the rim as we've had since Wade.

If the NBA drafts on potential, Vander should be a first-round pick. It may sound laughable, but this is a 20 year old kid that has made huge strides in his game since he arrived on campus 2-1/2 years ago. I still think he'd be a second-round pick if he came out, but I could very well see him developing into a solid NBA starter at the 2 (if he's legitimately 6'4") and it wouldn't surprise me if he could develop into a borderline All-Star.

Of course he's not there yet. We know that, Buzz knows that, scouts know that, and Vander knows that. But who would you trust more to get there? Someone like Vander who has already demonstrated the dedication to improving his game and ability to make himself a better player or someone like BJ Young (just declared today) who actually seemed to regress a bit as a sophomore and may have hit his peak at 19?

Vander should look at the NBA. I would love to have him back for a year, but if he gets word that he will be picked, he should definitely think about going. And anyone dismissing it out of hand doesn't understand that potential is more than just what class you are in school.

Exactly.  I think the question at this point is if he's invited to chicago to work out.  I think the answer will be yes.

[Galway Eagle]

On that Paint Touches interview it sounded like he was planning on returning he said, "Obviously we want to get a little further next year, so now we can set that goal. Our goal this year was to get past the Sweet 16, we achieved that. So now we want to get into the Final Four." I feel as though that is a hint toward him longing to reach the Final Four. 

[MU82]

On that Paint Touches interview it sounded like he was planning on returning he said, "Obviously we want to get a little further next year, so now we can set that goal. Our goal this year was to get past the Sweet 16, we achieved that. So now we want to get into the Final Four." I feel as though that is a hint toward him longing to reach the Final Four. 

Why isn't his goal to win the national title?

He's willing to settle for the Final Four? Let him leave!

[MUHoopsFan2]

Why isn't his goal to win the national title?

He's willing to settle for the Final Four? Let him leave!

That is his goal...but obviously you have to make the 'Final Four' first don't you? 

Get there first...and then worry about two more wins. I think that should have gone without him having to say that.

[MUHoopsFan2]

Oh, and you know what the difference would have been between Vander as a 33% 3pt shooter and the 30% he finished with?

With his 142 attempts, he would have had to make 4 more shots over the course of the year. 

The NBA 3pt shot is not the college 3pt shot. The NBA is all about measurables and name recognition and recall. Vander has some measurables skils that are off the charts good.

He has a great vertical. Quickness, Explosion. And burst to the ball and good size and ballhandling and passing skills in the open floor.

One thing that will go against him in my opinion is he has no true position right now at 6'3/6'4 in a league and draft that is guard heavy.

It is a weak draft in some regards but he would do well to stay and come out next year with Jamil and maybe Devante instead of by himself. Wesley, Jerel, and Dominic were helped just like Jimmy and Jae coming out with teammates.

Don't remember if Novak came out alone...but that is not always good. Usually it helps coming out to the NBA draft with a teammate.

If you have a good to great tournament they will remember you. NBA scouts are dizzy...many of them cannnot assess a player any better then you or I.

It's a meat market. they will take kids who are not ready simply to get them before someone else does because every team thinks they can fix the kid when the kid should stay in school another year.

That money is the same regardless pretty much. 

[MUHoopsFan2]

That is absolutely false. 

Let's look at the 2012 NBA Draft.  In the top 12 picks, five SGs were chosen.  (Beal, Waiters, Ross, Rivers, Lamb)

Of those five, they all shot at about the 45% clip from 2.  And somewhere in the range of 33 - 36% from 3.  No one was near 40%.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=austin-rivers&i=1&p1=vander-blue&p2=bradley-beal&p3=dion-walters&p4=terrence-ross&p5=jeremy-lamb

This is NOT FALSE...that is true. That is what is wrong with the NBA now, most of the guards can't shoot!

If Vander had made the Final Four and MU shot the ball better and beat 'Cuse he would be drafted high.

But losing in the Elite Eight like they did and shooting like they did against a zone and being on National TV and having a record setting futility % rating had to hurt him in the eyes of scouts.

If he returns and he is All Big East if not a possible All American Canidate as he could be...he can be a possible late lottery pick or first round guy next year if he works on that jumper a bit more.

With a program like MU on the rise and the recruiting class coming in and he being the returning Star and Senior leader, there is no doubt in my mind...

But all it takes is for one fool to make a promise to him and think they can fix him and boom. 

[MUHoopsFan2]

Whether or not Vander should leave based on what we saw Saturday or even over the course of the season is immaterial.

How many guys leave who maybe shouldn't? Lots.

How many guys nowhere near as good as Vander have done so? Lots.

How many either have an inflated opinion of themselves, get bad advice from those around them or both? Lots.

I doubt a single poster here has any insight into what's going on in Vander's head right now. Including me.

Do I think leaving now would be his wisest move? Probably not. Do I want him to return? Absolutely. Despite all that, do I think there's a chance he would decide to leave? You bet your sweet bippy I do.

Well duh....of course there is a chance. We know that! All it takes is one person to whisper in his ear.

He seems like he is a very impressionable guy imo and is very self confident in himself.

But I also feel he is also honest with himself to where he is his own man and will do what he feels is best regardless to what we think.

i dont think McleMore of Kansas is ready but he might be the #1 pick. Hell, I don't think Shabazz Muhammad is ready either,, but he will go!

I don't think the Smart kid at Oklahoma State is ready yet for the NBA...but I do think Tim Hardaway Jr is...and the Relaford kid for the Jayhawks is.

So it is all relative.

[GGGG]

This is NOT FALSE...that is true. That is what is wrong with the NBA now, most of the guards can't shoot!

Well, I'm not sure if that is the case or not, but that really isn't the point of what I called "false."  What is false is BC's assertion that he would have to shoot a 3 point percentage of around 40% to be drafted. 

[setyoursightsnorth]

The latest Draft Express 2014 Mock Draft has Vander going 21st overall. Crazy. Let's see what the kid can do his senior year.

[mugrad99]

The latest Draft Express 2014 Mock Draft has Vander going 21st overall. Crazy. Let's see what the kid can do his senior year.

Jamil at 36
Vander at 47
Deonte Burton at 43

http://www.nbadraft.net/2014mock_draft

[BCHoopster]

Thats Deonte Burton of Nevada

[setyoursightsnorth]

Thats Deonte Burton of Nevada

I'm assuming that's why he wrote in in teal? 

[RawdogDX]

Jamil at 36
Vander at 47
Deonte Burton at 43

http://www.nbadraft.net/2014mock_draft

47th in a draft that is considered the worst in over a decade.

[Marqus Howard]

47th in a draft that is considered the worst in over a decade.

2013 is weak, 2014 is loaded.

[MU B2002]

Xactly.

[77ncaachamps]

Think hell get away with the left/right arm wards in the NBA?

[MU82]

2013 is weak, 2014 is loaded.

Draft Express and CBS still don't have Vander being drafted this year.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Draft Express and CBS still don't have Vander being drafted this year.

Nor should they...if we're honest about it.

[dwaderoy2004]

Think hell get away with the left/right arm wards in the NBA?

He won't need them in the NBA.  They don't allow you to handcheck like they do in college.

[WarriorFan]

In order to get an NBA job, anyone 6'5" and smaller needs to be able to shoot.  Vander still has a flawed shot and no range.  There are no examples in the NBA of people like him who've made it and stick.  Remember, Crowder is still a fringe player, and DJO didn't make it in NBA (and not getting much PT in Europe) and they were both way better than Vander is now. 
In order to get a job in Europe (where everyone plays zone), you need to be able to shoot.
Vander's only options would be China or Philippines or anywhere else they play pick-up ball for money, and it wouldn't be worth leaving now for $40k a year there when he could still play another year at MU and move into the first round, where at least he'll get a guaranteed contract worth much more.

I do believe he'll learn how to shoot.  He needs one more year.