Very nice review of Caduogan by ESPN at the Reebok Camp

[Murffieus]

I agree with Murf...last time we saw a guard with comparable body/speed in the BE it was Lavance Fields or Kahlid Elhamin (sp?).  We surely don't want pg's like that.  They struggle in the BE.

So now you are saying that Caduogan is the second coming of Fields or el amin------and I'm sure you know that for sure.

[Murffieus]

Yeah that's the point, you can play point guard without quickness and athleticism, which you say are the most important things in a point guard (to go along with 3 point shooting), and I'm saying it's far more important to have good ball handling, a high basketball IQ, the ability to run an offense, and strength in a point guard.  I would argue that you can be a good point guard without being great at any of those 3 areas that you suggest (although to play any D1 guard position you have to have some degree of athleticism and quickness), but to be a good point guard at the D1 level you have to be great in at least 3 of the 4 areas I suggest.

There are exceptions to everything, but yes quickness, athleticism, and 3 pt shooting are the most important qualities in a PG assumming ball handling skills, BB IQ are court saavy are givens.

[ErickJD08]

Alot of the posts have much to do with nothing.  If you had me describe all the attributes I would WANT in my PG, it would be every single one mentioned by everyone else.  To be a good PG in college, you must play your part, manage the offense.  If there is a PG that can not manage the offense, he is just a small SG.  I would rather have a floor general than the most atheletic or lights-out shooter on the court (I am not saying I am ok with 0 athleticism though).  And by court general, I want a PG who can understand the defense, run the right offense, execute the play, and understand who should have the ball at the right time.  Junior should work out for MU.  Plus, how arrogant is anyone for thinking they can watch a couple of clips and make a better evalution on talent than guys who do it for a living.  He is a top talent so I doubt he has 0 athletic ability.  I think he will adjust to anything the BE will throw at him. 

On top of that, every good PG is surrounded by talent and I think (hope) he will. 

GO MU

[detroitwarrior]

Whether it is Yahoo Rivals,Scout,NBA Draft.Net,HoopReports,Hoopmasters,Bob Gibbons/Espn etc, there is one consistent thread about Junior...he can play and is an awesome signing for MU. There is absoluely no mention of an issue of playing in the BE so contrary to those who sit from afar and assess talent based on viewing what they describe as "feel good " videos , I will rely on those who evaluate talent for a living and give them the benefit of the doubt until I can see Junior play myself several times. Anyway, the name Junior Cadougan just flat out sounds cool!

[Murffieus]

Look, I want to believe as much as you do. But does it bother you when you see the report at CHN that one Avery Bradley while playing defense against Junior Cadougan "stayed in front of him making life very difficult and virtually shutting him down in the half court"? Also I see where JC has dropped from #16 to #20 on Scout's PG rankings.

[muarmy81]

There are exceptions to everything, but yes quickness, athleticism, and 3 pt shooting are the most important qualities in a PG assumming ball handling skills, BB IQ are court saavy are givens.

What ??????



So of the 6 things you just listed as "important" what are the top 3?

[Nukem2]

Look, I want to believe as much as you do. But does it bother you when you see the report at CHN that one Avery Bradley while playing defense against Junior Cadougan "stayed in front of him making life very difficult and virtually shutting him down in the half court"? Also I see where JC has dropped from #16 to #20 on Scout's PG rankings.

Murff, other reports also indicated that Junior had a foot injury slowing him down.  given all the other positive reports from the Reebok camp, I guess I would discount the Avery Bradley report.  As far as Scout goes, most of the other raters have Junior going up significantly.  Guess I'll go with the flow and ignore your "report".

[Murffieus]

What ??????



So of the 6 things you just listed as "important" what are the top 3?

Again most PGs have good ball handling skills and court savvy (these are the very basic skills to qualify for further evaluation)------but outside of the basic skills quickness, athleticism, and trey shooting are the most important.

[Murffieus]

Murff, other reports also indicated that Junior had a foot injury slowing him down.  given all the other positive reports from the Reebok camp, I guess I would discount the Avery Bradley report.  As far as Scout goes, most of the other raters have Junior going up significantly.  Guess I'll go with the flow and ignore your "report".

Oh I see, he only had a bad foot when he lined up against Avery Bradley-----but the rest of the camp time his foot was OK. So when he does things well he fights through whatever ails him, but when he fails----injury is the excuse.

What's the excuse as to why Scout dropped him from #16 PG to #20 PG???????

[bma725]

Oh I see, he only had a bad foot when he lined up against Avery Bradley-----but the rest of the camp time his foot was OK. So when he does things well he fights through whatever ails him, but when he fails----injury is the excuse.

What's the excuse as to why Scout dropped him from #16 PG to #20 PG???????

What's the reason Hoopscoop moved him up from #37 in the country to #21 after the same camp Scout dropped him?

[Nukem2]

Oh I see, he only had a bad foot when he lined up against Avery Bradley-----but the rest of the camp time his foot was OK. So when he does things well he fights through whatever ails him, but when he fails----injury is the excuse.

What's the excuse as to why Scout dropped him from #16 PG to #20 PG???????

Whatever Murff.  The injury happened as the week went along.  so, by the end it probably affected him more, especially against a solid opponent.  Just the way it is.  No rationalizations here.   You read way too much into one report.  As far as the rankings, again the majority are pushing JC upward.  You seem to be ignoring the facts and using one ranking that supports your view?

[bilsu]

What do we know about Avery Bradley? Maybe he is extremely quick. Assuming Bradley stopped him, it does make a difference what talent level he has. There were reports that Cadougan stood out in scrimages at MU, when he visited. I of course was not there, but I assume he did get to play against McNeal and James and did okay against them.

[avid1010]

So now you are saying that Caduogan is the second coming of Fields or el amin------and I'm sure you know that for sure.

From what I read and see on him he has lagit chances of being that good.  That's my opinion.  Just like your opinion of him not being quick or athletic enough to make it in the BE.  We'll see, but it sure is more fun to get excited about the kid coming to MU and having a chance to be a solid BE point guard.  I'm happy it's not Johny Lacy, and I am excited to see if Caduogan can live up to the comparisons of El amin, Fields, Sherman Douglas, etc.  I remember a guy at MSU (Cleeves) who wasn't fast, wasn't a great shooter, wasn't supper athletic, but he had loads of talent around him and he knew how to get them the ball.  I also trust the MU coaches' evaluation of talent over yours any day. 

[Nukem2]

There are tons of quick guys who can't play as they just don't have "it".  Junior seems to have "it" and a strong motor. 

[Murffieus]

From what I read and see on him he has lagit chances of being that good.  That's my opinion.  Just like your opinion of him not being quick or athletic enough to make it in the BE.  We'll see, but it sure is more fun to get excited about the kid coming to MU and having a chance to be a solid BE point guard.  I'm happy it's not Johny Lacy, and I am excited to see if Caduogan can live up to the comparisons of El amin, Fields, Sherman Douglas, etc.  I remember a guy at MSU (Cleeves) who wasn't fast, wasn't a great shooter, wasn't supper athletic, but he had loads of talent around him and he knew how to get them the ball.  I also trust the MU coaches' evaluation of talent over yours any day. 

You are correct, IMO Cadoagan is the better choice than lacy who isn't a real PG----he's a small shooting guard like Couby.

I'm not asking you to trust me-------just telling you how it is-----IMO what you see now in Junior is what you will get-----PG's who are not athletic or quick coming out of generally have very little upside----very few exceptions apply!

[bma725]

What do we know about Avery Bradley? Maybe he is extremely quick. Assuming Bradley stopped him, it does make a difference what talent level he has.

We know that Bradley is a top 20-30 talent, one of the most athletic shooting guards in the class of 2009, and considered a great on the ball defender. 

[detroitwarrior]

Espn's June 08 analysis seems to suggest he is quick enough and will be a nice point guard in the Big East. Of course, like all prospects, there are areas that need improvement.
http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/player?recruitId=43474&season=2009&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fncb%2frecruiting%2ftracker%2fplayer%3frecruitId%3d43474%26season%3d2009

[jmayer1]

I like what I hear about Caduogan.  Seems like he will be a good floor general who will be able to direct traffic, see the court, and get other players in a good position to score while also being able to score himself when needed or if ignored by the D.  From all accounts he kinda reminds me of the way Mark Jackson played.  The fact that Murff doesn't like him only makes him a better prospect in my eyes.

[detroitwarrior]

He is also ranked #79 in the ESPN #100 dated 7/11/08.
Jeronne Maymon is ranked #33 in the same list and Erik Williams #69.

http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/espn100?season=2009&display=25&set=1&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fncb%2frecruiting%2ftracker%2fespn100%3fseason%3d2009%26display%3d25%26set%3d1

[Murffieus]

I like what I hear about Caduogan.  Seems like he will be a good floor general who will be able to direct traffic, see the court, and get other players in a good position to score while also being able to score himself when needed or if ignored by the D.  From all accounts he kinda reminds me of the way Mark Jackson played.  The fact that Murff doesn't like him only makes him a better prospect in my eyes.

Now I'm not saying he's going to be bust----I just think he has his limitations and that we could have done better.

[muarmy81]

Murff,
Your "evaluation" is based on a short Highlight reel that's out on the internet and reading between the lines of a recent review that actually said Cadougan performed rather well. 
You have to see why so many people are skeptical of your opinion because other recruiting experts have been very high on JC throughout the summer both at Gibson's camp and at the recent Reebok Camp.  Why don't you wait to watch him play before passing judgement?

[Murffieus]

Well in the face of this 'feel good" news at the camps, he drops in Scouts PG ranking #16 to #20----furthermore he is only a 3 star recruit. These camps are run and shoot which seems to be the best part of his game (transition)-----my reservations are based on his half court offense.

[79Warrior]

Now I'm not saying he's going to be bust----I just think he has his limitations and that we could have done better.

you sould like a bitter old lady. Same sh## over and over.

[ErickJD08]

Murf, I am not sure if you like making stupid posts to get attention or what, but you're basing your opinion on a drop of rank from 16 to 20.  Big Deal!  He is still a good prospect.  I don't know about you, but I think getting a top 20 PG is great.  Who could have we gotten that would be significantly better?...  No one.  Be happy we are not getting someone who is a project. 

You put so much value into athletic ability but that is probably the least important factor to be an effective PG.  There are countless of a good college PG's that are not the most athletic players on the court: Lavance Fields, Scottie Reynolds, to name a couple in the BE.  Neither one of those two can make a reverse dunk or alley-oop either.

I think Junior is the safe pick from the looks of his reviews because he doesn't make alot mistakes which is what we will need for 2009-10 year.  The next two seasons are extremely important seasons.  If we can get deeper in the tourney this year (which is expected) and get some good PR, and then make the 2010 tourney in a "re-building" year, I think Marquette can really begin to argue that we are a top program.  I think our best chances for success for 2009-10 is to have a mature freshmen around some veterans/talent.

GO MU

[jmayer1]

Now I'm not saying he's going to be bust----I just think he has his limitations and that we could have done better.

Who do you think would be better that MU actually had a shot at landing?