Syria = Impending S-Show

[MuggsyB]

Again, you are being illogical. Just because someone isn't outraged about all injustice doesn't mean they can't be outraged over specific cases of injustice.

But, as Americans, the injustice happening in Gaza that is being caused by one of our supposed allies, is going to be front and center.

No, wrong.  And again you and others refuse to answer questions that are very applicable to Gaza.  The fact that Israel is an ally is irrelevant to the "caring about humanity" narrative .  We and many of our allies have done way worse things than Israel and well after WW2.  War is ugly, it's not humanitarian.  That doesn't mean Netanyahu and Israel haven't done some fked up things.  The obsession over Israel has nothing to do with them being an ally.  Was our operation in Mosul executed without innocent people and children dying?   How many kids have died from US drone strikes over the past 10 years?

[MUBurrow]

Muggs doesn't think we should hold western-style liberal societies to a higher standard when judging how they use violence. It's a tremendous self own he'll never wrap his head around.

Don't make me tap the sign

[Hards Alumni]

It's not a deflection, these are facts.  How many kids under 5 have been massacred or starved to death all over  Africa ?  And I'm talking yearly?  Do you care?  Do any of you care?  Are you racists?  Where are the protests?  Where is the outrage?  This is one of many reasons why we should usurp the oil fields.

Is the US giving away billions of dollars and supplying weapons to the country starving those children in Sudan?  Could that conflict be stopped with a couple of phone calls from the US government?  The outrage at the genocide Gaza strip is because of the complicity of the US Government in it.

[Uncle Rico]

No, wrong.  And again you and others refuse to answer questions that are very applicable to Gaza.  The fact that Israel is an ally is irrelevant to the "caring about humanity" narrative .  We and many of our allies have done way worse things than Israel and well after WW2.  War is ugly, it's not humanitarian.  That doesn't mean Netanyahu and Israel haven't done some fked up things.  The obsession over Israel has nothing to do with them being an ally.  Was our operation in Mosul executed without innocent people and children dying?  How many kids have died from US drone strikes over the past 10 years?

To be fair, we're accelerating the number of American kids that will needlessly die with current domestic policy, so it'll even out. 

[MuggsyB]

Is the US giving away billions of dollars and supplying weapons to the country starving those children in Sudan?  Could that conflict be stopped with a couple of phone calls from the US government?  The outrage at the genocide Gaza strip is because of the complicity of the US Government in it.

We've given money hand over fist to the entire middle east. If the Jewish population were to leave, and we set up a state/territory for them in the USA, what exactly do you think would happen to that land or the Middle East as a whole?  Would it be gumdrop smiles?  Rivers of chocolate?

[Hards Alumni]

We've given money hand over fist to the entire middle east. If tbe entire Jewish population were to leave, and we set up a state/territory for them in the USA, what exactly do you think would happen to that land or the Middle East as a whole?  Would it be gumdrop smiles?  Rivers of chocolate?

Why would they leave, and why would they do that.

They can defend themselves without the help of the United States.

[MuggsyB]

Why would they leave, and why would they do that.

They can defend themselves without the help of the United States.

So we shouldn't give them a dime.  Got it.  Should we give any foreign aid to any countries?

[Uncle Rico]

So we shouldn't give them a dime.  Got it.  Should we give any foreign aid to any countries?

Depends if they allow hotels and golf courses to be built cheaply

[The Sultan]

No, wrong.  And again you and others refuse to answer questions that are very applicable to Gaza.  The fact that Israel is an ally is irrelevant to the "caring about humanity" narrative .  We and many of our allies have done way worse things than Israel and well after WW2.  War is ugly, it's not humanitarian.  That doesn't mean Netanyahu and Israel haven't done some fked up things.  The obsession over Israel has nothing to do with them being an ally.  Was our operation in Mosul executed without innocent people and children dying?   How many kids have died from US drone strikes over the past 10 years?

No I am correct. And either you don't have the ability to see that, or you are being intentionally obtuse.

Regardless, your continued deflections on this topic pretty much shows a lot about your priorities really.

[Hards Alumni]

So we shouldn't give them a dime.  Got it.  Should we give any foreign aid to any countries?

We should not give aid to countries committing a genocide.  Correct.

See how easy that is.

[MuggsyB]

We should not give aid to countries committing a genocide.  Correct.

See how easy that is.

LOL. 

[MU82]

It's not a deflection, these are facts.  How many kids under 5 have been massacred or starved to death all over  Africa ?  And I'm talking yearly?  Do you care?  Do any of you care?  Are you racists?  Where are the protests?  Where is the outrage?  This is one of many reasons why we should usurp the oil fields.

Hell, man ... you are outraged when Marquette doesn't play well. What about African kids dying? Are you a racist?

[MUBurrow]

Is the US giving away billions of dollars and supplying weapons to the country starving those children in Sudan?  Could that conflict be stopped with a couple of phone calls from the US government?  The outrage at the genocide Gaza strip is because of the complicity of the US Government in it.

And even a little more abstractly, I feel like we have skin in the game of seeing a liberal society succeed in the middle east.  But that only remains important so long as "liberal society" is shorthand for a lot of shared values that are worth propogating - including holding yourself to a higher human rights standard in the means by which you defeat your enemies.

[Hards Alumni]

And even a little more abstractly, I feel like we have skin in the game of seeing a liberal society succeed in the middle east.  But that only remains important so long as "liberal society" is shorthand for a lot of shared values that are worth propogating - including holding yourself to a higher human rights standard in the means by which you defeat your enemies.

Unfortunately, they've descended deep into fascism in Israel.

[MuggsyB]

And even a little more abstractly, I feel like we have skin in the game of seeing a liberal society succeed in the middle east.  But that only remains important so long as "liberal society" is shorthand for a lot of shared values that are worth propogating - including holding yourself to a higher human rights standard in the means by which you defeat your enemies.

But we can still slaughter people all over the place with drone strikes because of our values.  Got it. 

[Uncle Rico]

But we can still slaughter people all over the place with drone strikes because of our values.  Got it.

It's because we say "god bless the troops"

[Scoop Snoop]

Usurping oil fields. Like his plan to assassinate Putin and his "assurance" that the Russians would immediately surrender, the US should do this ASAP. We will meet no resistance.

Unilaterally declaring what reality and immutable facts are. Furiously lecturing us on his obsessions on a such a wide range of subjects while we remain unable to grasp the inherent truths Muggsy keeps gifting us. His crown jewel is his 5-point plan for world peace, even though he has not revealed it to us in its entirety.

[MUBurrow]

But we can still slaughter people all over the place with drone strikes because of our values.  Got it.

If you think that's equally as bad as the tactics being used in Sudan, why are you so passionate about defending it?

[Shaka Shart]

At least Israel is being peaceful and respectful about the 2.3M Palestinians in the West Bank

[Pakuni]

But we can still slaughter people all over the place with drone strikes because of our values.  Got it.

Muggsy going from full-scale invasion of Iran to anti-war zealot is not the plot twist I expected here.

[JWags85]

Hamas is shooting Palestinian children in gaza?

Absolutely.  Again, I'm not blanket justifying IDF/Israeli action or policy and my argument is different than Muggsy, but Hamas ABSOLUTELY is and has been killing Palestinian civilians, children included.  Not saying that any civilian shooting attributed to the IDF was actually Hamas, but shooting at and killing Palestinians to keep control, prevent movement or push a narrative is absolutely something that has been happening for a LONG time.

No matter what you think of Israel or their actions, good bad or otherwise, Hamas has never been and will never be good, moral, or protective leaders of their own people without even taking their aggression towards Israel into account. Their end goal is power and an eradication of Israel, not an uplifting and salvation of Palestinians.

[Pakuni]

Absolutely.  Again, I'm not blanket justifying IDF/Israeli action or policy and my argument is different than Muggsy, but Hamas ABSOLUTELY is and has been killing Palestinian civilians, children included.  Not saying that any civilian shooting attributed to the IDF was actually Hamas, but shooting at and killing Palestinians to keep control, prevent movement or push a narrative is absolutely something that has been happening for a LONG time.

No matter what you think of Israel or their actions, good bad or otherwise, Hamas has never been and will never be good, moral, or protective leaders of their own people without even taking their aggression towards Israel into account. Their end goal is power and an eradication of Israel, not an uplifting and salvation of Palestinians.

I don't think many critics of Israel here - or in the West in general - argue that Hamas is good, moral or protective leaders of their people. 

"Hamas is bad, too" is little more than a deflection of the legitimate denunciation of Israel's actions here. Especially since we ought to be holding Israel to a higher standard than we would a terrorist organization.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Is Muggsy just doing a bit, like Herm used to?

[forgetful]

Yes. It's a terrible situation.  But Hamas is primarily responsible for this tragedy.  I also don't diffentiate between innocent children dying in Gaza vs South Sudan, or the entire continent of Africa, where no one seems to remotely care or has even shown a scintilla of sympathy.  Or outrage for that matter.

I asked before, and got no answer, how do you assign blame? Where do you start the timeline in something that has been going on for countless decades?

I know the simple answer for many, including yourself, whether you will admit it or not...

Israel is our ally, they are on the side of good. If you are not our ally, you are on the side of bad.

Gazans, Palestinians, etc., would argue that there actions were in self defense, due to repeated settler attacks, arrests and detainments without trials (they would call them hostages), military actions in the West Bank, and land seizures.

That is the problem in these types of things, they are way more complex than many will admit, and I'm really not taking sides, I just address the complexity of things.

But the fact that the entire world now thinks Israel has gone way way too far, to the extremes of genocide, should be a wake up call to a lot of people. And we are funding these acts, which is why so many are specifically distressed about it.

[MU82]

From Axios:

Keenly aware of Israel's reputational crisis, Netanyahu sat for an interview last week with the Nelk Boys — a team of MAGA YouTubers popular with young men.

The backlash was swift and extraordinary: the Nelk Boys' own audience turned on them, accusing the hosts of platforming a war criminal and failing to ask meaningful questions.

The group apologized by hosting a parade of openly antisemitic influencers to present "the other side," including white nationalist Nick Fuentes and "red pill" podcaster Myron Gaines.