St. Thomas game on FS1

[wadesworld]

It's not completely crazy. I live in St. Paul, very nearly went to St. Thomas, and my wife teaches as an adjunct there. UST would only slightly expand the BE footprint (5ish hrs from Omaha and Milwaukee) but add another large market of viewers without splitting an existing BE fan base. The school's urban campus, student body size, endowment level and Catholic affiliation all align with the Big East's current membership. Sure, they don't draw a ton of fans now but if you put their games at the Target Center or Xcel and bring in Marquette, UConn, Villanova, etc. that will change quickly. They are also already comparable if not better than some BE programs in other sports. Hire a well respected coach, get their donors excited, and land a couple of high profile local recruits and they could be middle of the conference within 5 years. Locally, this has been a well known aspiration of UST for years: https://shamasportsheadliners.com/tommies-hoops-future-looks-bright/.

You might be right, but why does bringing in Marquette, UCONN, Nova, etc. in a bigger arena guarantee great attendance?  The University of Minnesota brought in Mizzou when they were 2-0 and there was an announced attendance of 7,975 in their 14,625 capacity arena.  Last year they had an announced attendance of 9,251 when number 3 Purdue played there.

Sure, it would be better than the 1,200 they get at home games now.  But if you're playing at the Target or Xcel Center, is it much better to have 6,000 in the 17,000 seat arenas?

[MU82]

Heard on the grapevine that the Big East will be reaching out to Augsburg or Macalester to tap that Twin Cities market.

[frozena pizza]

You might be right, but why does bringing in Marquette, UCONN, Nova, etc. in a bigger arena guarantee great attendance?  The University of Minnesota brought in Mizzou when they were 2-0 and there was an announced attendance of 7,975 in their 14,625 capacity arena.  Last year they had an announced attendance of 9,251 when number 3 Purdue played there.

Sure, it would be better than the 1,200 they get at home games now.  But if you're playing at the Target or Xcel Center, is it much better to have 6,000 in the 17,000 seat arenas?

Who knows, but I could see them playing some games in the smaller arena on campus and other games in a pro arena. As for the Gophers, when you're coming off a 2-17 season and the NBA team in your town has the league's best record you're not going to sell out a mid-November game. At least with UST there would be some novelty initially.

[MU82]

The only way the Big East takes St. Thomas is if it can relegate DePaul to the Summit League.

[duanewade]

Does anyone really believe any of the BE NE schools care an ounce about a nobody team and program because it's in MSP?  Yes Marquette gets a lot of Minnesota students so there is some affinity for that area with some posters here... but that's where it ends.  Further how does propping up St. Nobody and watering down the BEast help Marquette.  Do we want the next Dawson Garcia type prospect in the area to eliminate us completely because he can play at home instead of Marquette if he wants to play in the BEast? 

[Galway Eagle]

Does anyone really believe any of the BE NE schools care an ounce about a nobody team and program because it's in MSP?  Yes Marquette gets a lot of Minnesota students so there is some affinity for that area with some posters here... but that's where it ends.  Further how does propping up St. Nobody and watering down the BEast help Marquette.  Do we want the next Dawson Garcia type prospect in the area to eliminate us completely because he can play at home instead of Marquette if he wants to play in the BEast?

I agree with the first half but also by logic Stevie should've eliminated us because he could've played at Nova, Tyler could've played at PC, etc sometimes kids want to get away from home

[BLWarrior91]

There's no way in its present form that the BE takes St. Thomas.  It's absolutely absurd to even consider this.  Every program in the BE has been to multiple Elite 8s and all but two have been to at least one Final Four.

It was a perfect fit of programs with rich basketball traditions.

[PGsHeroes32]

I agree with the first half but also by logic Stevie should've eliminated us because he could've played at Nova, Tyler could've played at PC, etc sometimes kids want to get away from home

Bit different scenarios there

Especially since Nova and PC didnt want Stevie and TK

Well, until it was too late in PC case...

[Galway Eagle]

Bit different scenarios there

Especially since Nova and BC didnt want Stevie and TK

Well, until it was too late in PC case...

Ok Sean Jones. X offered

[The Sultan]

It's not completely crazy. I live in St. Paul, very nearly went to St. Thomas, and my wife teaches as an adjunct there. UST would only slightly expand the BE footprint (5ish hrs from Omaha and Milwaukee) but add another large market of viewers without splitting an existing BE fan base. The school's urban campus, student body size, endowment level and Catholic affiliation all align with the Big East's current membership. Sure, they don't draw a ton of fans now but if you put their games at the Target Center or Xcel and bring in Marquette, UConn, Villanova, etc. that will change quickly. They are also already comparable if not better than some BE programs in other sports. Hire a well respected coach, get their donors excited, and land a couple of high profile local recruits and they could be middle of the conference within 5 years. Locally, this has been a well known aspiration of UST for years: https://shamasportsheadliners.com/tommies-hoops-future-looks-bright/.

That's ridiculous.  Would you think they could do the same with Boston University and the Boston Garden?

[Newsdreams]

Does anyone really believe any of the BE NE schools care an ounce about a nobody team and program because it's in MSP?  Yes Marquette gets a lot of Minnesota students so there is some affinity for that area with some posters here... but that's where it ends.  Further how does propping up St. Nobody and watering down the BEast help Marquette.  Do we want the next Dawson Garcia type prospect in the area to eliminate us completely because he can play at home instead of Marquette if he wants to play in the BEast?

Yet here is Scoop....

[Pakuni]

The only way the Big East takes St. Thomas is if it can relegate DePaul to the Summit League.

Nah.
A lousy DePaul is still a better asset to the BE than St. Thomas.

[WhiteTrash]

This whole idea is insane. Maybe in 20 years the Tommies could begin a 20 year process to get into the BE. That's a 'Big Maybe'. So if you are in a big market and have rich alumni your can just write a ticket to the big time of college hoops? And this has happen exactly how many times? How is the uber rich (guessing 100x richer than STU) Rice University in the 4th largest market doing with their dreams of going big time?

Look, there is more than 3 or 4 boxes to check to get into the BE. One you can't really buy and that is sustained support. I know a Gonzaga guy who is afraid that when Few leaves they will become just a decent basketball team again and Gonzaga will attract very good coaches. STU will have to prove they are a local and national draw even when they are not good. That takes time.

[JustinLewisFanClubPres]

At least with UST there would be some novelty initially.

That statement is pretty much the definition of why this should never happen. Novelty is great for UST while it lasts. What is the benefit to the Big East? To undermine what it has established since the reformation?

[PointWarrior]

If the Big East lets St Thomas in, then they have to let Dayton in.  Just say no...

[Newsdreams]

If the Big East lets St Thomas in, then they have to let Dayton in.  Just say no...

And / or St. Louis

[Coleman]

Just for a reality check for the Tommies....here is a list of schools I think the Big East would take before them, just off the top of my head. I'm sure there are many, many more

Gonzaga
St. Marys
LaSalle
St. Bonaventure
Dayton
SLU
Loyola Chicago
St. Josephs
UMass
Richmond
VCU

[Pakuni]

Just for a reality check for the Tommies....here is a list of schools I think the Big East would take before them, just off the top of my head. I'm sure there are many, many more

Gonzaga
St. Marys
LaSalle
St. Bonaventure
Dayton
SLU
Loyola Chicago
St. Josephs
UMass
Richmond
VCU

Playing devil's advocate, I think ...
Loyola, St. Joe's and LaSalle don't make the cut, because DePaul and Nova wouldn't want to elevate crosstown competition. Could Xavier similarly seek to block Dayton?
I suspect Richmond might want to follow James Madison and Delaware into FBS, which means Sun Belt or C-USA.
Being public schools might be a stumbling block for UMass and VCU (UConn was an exception, given their history in the Big East and strength of the program).
St. Bonaventure doesn't really fit the bill as an urban campus.

I would have once said travel considerations would make St. Mary's and Gonzaga prohibitive, but given what we've seen elsewhere, I'm not sure that matters anymore. So, they're definitely in way ahead of St. Thomas. I'd suggest the San Francisco Dons and Seattle University may be as well, to create travel partners.

[WhiteTrash]

I'd say, given the chatter about BB only schools in P4 conferences, MU is way, way closer to getting in the Big10 than UST joining the Big East.

[Carl]

I'm sure there is a definitive answer to this but I've always wondered why Notre Dame didn't LEAP at the chance to park their basketball team in a basketball-centric league and maintain their (ridiculous) football independence. Was it simply because the new BE was perceived as far inferior to the new super ACC at the time of the split? I wonder how they view that now and whether or not there is a path to ND rejoining the BE. They'd be a lot of people's #1 choice in an expansion

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I'm sure there is a definitive answer to this but I've always wondered why Notre Dame didn't LEAP at the chance to park their basketball team in a basketball-centric league and maintain their (ridiculous) football independence. Was it simply because the new BE was perceived as far inferior to the new super ACC at the time of the split? I wonder how they view that now and whether or not there is a path to ND rejoining the BE. They'd be a lot of people's #1 choice in an expansion

Was it simply because the new BE was perceived as far inferior to the new super ACC at the time of the split? - I believe this was inferred by ND at the time.

And they needed a schedule agreement for FB to cover half their games and didn't want to play the remaining Big East FB teams for that half.

[WhiteTrash]

I'm sure there is a definitive answer to this but I've always wondered why Notre Dame didn't LEAP at the chance to park their basketball team in a basketball-centric league and maintain their (ridiculous) football independence. Was it simply because the new BE was perceived as far inferior to the new super ACC at the time of the split? I wonder how they view that now and whether or not there is a path to ND rejoining the BE. They'd be a lot of people's #1 choice in an expansion

My gut tells me bold above is the answer but maybe the $ was better in the ACC with the quasi-member FB schedule. I think ND officially stated a home for Olympic sports was a deciding factor.

I have little love for ND, but the 'ridiculous' football independence has work pretty well so far. Way better than fully joining the sinking ACC. 

[The Sultan]

Was it simply because the new BE was perceived as far inferior to the new super ACC at the time of the split? - I believe this was inferred by ND at the time.

And they needed a schedule agreement for FB to cover half their games and didn't want to play the remaining Big East FB teams for that half.

The ACC was seen as superior not just in basketball, but in all of the non-football sports.

[warriorfred]

I retain the belief that the ACC implodes in a few years, and there is a possibility for traditional Big East teams to return.  So I am not super-excited to add other teams at this time.

[brewcity77]

Was it simply because the new BE was perceived as far inferior to the new super ACC at the time of the split? - I believe this was inferred by ND at the time.

And they needed a schedule agreement for FB to cover half their games and didn't want to play the remaining Big East FB teams for that half.

As I recall it was really just timing. The TV deal that included TCU fell apart over the summer of 2011, Pitt & Syracuse announced they were leaving in late 2011, followed by West Virginia. TCU flipped their commitment and joined the Big 12. In response, the league went crazy, inviting Memphis, Temple, UCF, Boise, San Diego State, basically anyone with a pulse.

Commissioner John Marinatto was forced out in spring and it was clear the league was in turmoil. Right after, Louisville said they were leaving. In September, Notre Dame came to their agreement with the ACC. The remaining schools tried to keep it together, but Rutgers went to the B10, Louisville made it official, and finally in December the C7 had enough and split.

I've heard that had the C7 left sooner, Notre Dame might have went with them and stayed independent in football. But the ship was sinking and they took the first lifeboat, not realizing another would be available.