2024-25 NFL Thread

[Not all scoop users are created equal apparently]

Absolutely. The guy with 5 losses should always be MVP.

Matt Ryan agrees with you

[Hards Alumni]

Absolutely. The guy with 5 losses should always be MVP.

As opposed to the guy with 4 losses who is the first MVP to not even be All-Pro in 21 years.  Brilliant analysis!

Where'd Mahomes finish in voting, again?  4th best QB?  LOL

[tower912]

Goff in front of Mahomes.   Silly.

Allen and Jackson each received 49 out of 50 first or second place votes.  Fair.  Allen received more first place votes, Jackson more second.   So the voting was consistent.  One outlier vote for each.

[Uncle Rico]

Sterling Sharpe is the best Packers WR I ever saw, edging out James Lofton.  Sharpe had speed, toughness, hands and route running. 

Jordy and Davante are right up there but have the luxury of playing in an era of even more freedom for offenses. 

The Packers were better after he left.  The QB matured without him.  Still, considering how great Sharpe was, hard to blame a QB for constantly targeting him and heck, no one could stop him anyway.

[Jockey]

As opposed to the guy with 4 losses who is the first MVP to not even be All-Pro in 21 years.  Brilliant analysis!

Where'd Mahomes finish in voting, again?  4th best QB?  LOL

Allen had ONE Pro Bowler on his team. Lamar had EIGHT. Still not a good enough player to win playoff games (yes I know that doesn't matter in voting).

Lamar is Aaron Rodgers - a great regular season QB. At least Aaron won something.

[Uncle Rico]

Allen had ONE Pro Bowler on his team. Lamar had EIGHT. Still not a good enough player to win playoff games (yes I know that doesn't matter in voting).

Lamar is Aaron Rodgers - a great regular season QB. At least Aaron won something.

I don't particularly care who wins MVP (should have been Lukas Van Ness), but can't understand why anyone would have a problem with Josh Allen winning. 

[tower912]

I don't particularly care who wins MVP (should have been Lukas Van Ness), but can't understand why anyone would have a problem with Josh Allen winning. 

It is scoop, it is America. Complaining is the American pastime.

[Uncle Rico]

It is scoop, it is America. Complaining is the American pastime.

I get that, but it's not like they have it to Jalen Hurts

[Hards Alumni]

I don't particularly care who wins MVP (should have been Lukas Van Ness), but can't understand why anyone would have a problem with Josh Allen winning. 

I don't, it's Jockey's new hill to die on that Lamar wasn't the best QB this year, and somehow Mahomes was.

But if we're going by the stats, Josh Allen lags Lamar in every category.  If we are going by who is the most valuable to their team then it's probably Josh since he willed them to win.

An argument can be made for both.

Either way, it is certainly not Mahomes, right Jockey?

[Pakuni]

Allen had ONE Pro Bowler on his team. Lamar had EIGHT. Still not a good enough player to win playoff games (yes I know that doesn't matter in voting).

Lamar is Aaron Rodgers - a great regular season QB. At least Aaron won something.

Lamar definitely should have caught that 2-point conversion. Total choke job.
And when he made Zay Flowers fumble at the goal line in last year's AFC Championship game? Not a winner.

[The Sultan]

Sterling Sharpe is the best Packers WR I ever saw, edging out James Lofton.  Sharpe had speed, toughness, hands and route running. 

Jordy and Davante are right up there but have the luxury of playing in an era of even more freedom for offenses. 

The Packers were better after he left.  The QB matured without him.  Still, considering how great Sharpe was, hard to blame a QB for constantly targeting him and heck, no one could stop him anyway.

Yes.  Feel bad for Mike Holmgren though. Needed to win one more IMO.

[Uncle Rico]

Yes.  Feel bad for Mike Holmgren though. Needed to win one more IMO.

Should have handed off more to Levens against the Broncos

[GB Warrior]

Sterling Sharpe is the best Packers WR I ever saw, edging out James Lofton.  Sharpe had speed, toughness, hands and route running. 

Jordy and Davante are right up there but have the luxury of playing in an era of even more freedom for offenses. 

The Packers were better after he left.  The QB matured without him.  Still, considering how great Sharpe was, hard to blame a QB for constantly targeting him and heck, no one could stop him anyway.

Coulda had Barry too. Would have turned Favre into Brad Johnson

[Not all scoop users are created equal apparently]

As opposed to the guy with 4 losses who is the first MVP to not even be All-Pro in 21 years.  Brilliant analysis!

Where'd Mahomes finish in voting, again?  4th best QB?  LOL

41 TD with 4 Int, almost double the rushing yards of Josh Allen.

Not to disparage Allen who is a great player and had a remarkable year, but Jackson's numbers were absolutely insane. 4th highest QBR of all time.

Hence why I said voter fatigue.

[Not all scoop users are created equal apparently]

Allen had ONE Pro Bowler on his team. Lamar had EIGHT. Still not a good enough player to win playoff games (yes I know that doesn't matter in voting).

Lamar is Aaron Rodgers - a great regular season QB. At least Aaron won something.

"Playoffs don't matter in voting"

"Lamar hasn't won in the playoffs"

Pick a lane dude

[MU82]

Though I personally would have voted for Jackson, I'd have been fine with either Jackson or Allen winning MVP. Both are tremendous and fun to watch.

All I'll say is that, until proven otherwise, I would take Mahomes over any other QB if you asked me: "Your life depends on you winning this game; which QB would you choose?" And, frankly, it wouldn't even be close. The guy is one of the great big-game studs in the history of sports; that's not debatable. Why would anyone choose a QB who hasn't even been able to get to a Super Bowl, let alone win a few of them?

That's way different from MVP, a regular-season award. With his comparatively modest stats, Mahomes wasn't a legit candidate this season and the voting reflected that.

As for Jackson not being able to make Andrews catch that 2-point conversion ... it's true. He defintely has gotten blamed for some things out of his control. But let's not pretend that he didn't have a costly fumble and and a bad interception in that game, too. That didn't make him a "loser" or anything other than a great QB. But it also didn't help him shake the rap against him.

Fair or not, until he wins the big one, he'll always be a great QB who couldn't win the big one. Same goes for Allen, for that matter.

[Not all scoop users are created equal apparently]

Yeah I have no issues with Allen winning it, but it doesn't change my personal position on how I would have voted based on my assessment of "value".

At least these awards are not a Derek Jeter gold glove situation!

[Pakuni]

41 TD with 4 Int, almost double the rushing yards of Josh Allen.

Not to disparage Allen who is a great player and had a remarkable year, but Jackson's numbers were absolutely insane. 4th highest QBR of all time.

Hence why I said voter fatigue.

I think if you're willing to look beyond the stats, for which there's an obvious case for Lamar, there's a fair argument that Allen was more valuable to his team in an "achieved more with less" kind of way. No doubt voter fatigue played a part, but even without fatigue there's still a reasonable case to be made for Allen.

[cheebs09]

I think if you're willing to look beyond the stats, for which there's an obvious case for Lamar, there's a fair argument that Allen was more valuable to his team in an "achieved more with less" kind of way. No doubt voter fatigue played a part, but even without fatigue there's still a reasonable case to be made for Allen.

It feels like this comes down to Most Valuable to their team or best stats. And basically limited to the QB position.

[Jockey]

"Playoffs don't matter in voting"

Pick a lane dude

Hey dude - I only put that in my post so i wouldn't get a lame reply how MVP is voted on before the playoffs.

[JWags85]

Sterling Sharpe is the best Packers WR I ever saw, edging out James Lofton.  Sharpe had speed, toughness, hands and route running. 

Jordy and Davante are right up there but have the luxury of playing in an era of even more freedom for offenses. 

The Packers were better after he left.  The QB matured without him.  Still, considering how great Sharpe was, hard to blame a QB for constantly targeting him and heck, no one could stop him anyway.

I think its pretty incredible that in a world of stats obsession for the HOF, especially counting stats, a guy who only played 7 seasons and retired before 30 made the HOF. 

The NFL isn't as bad about it as MLB, but still, pretty awesome acknowledgment of a guy who in his short peak was arguably the best WR in football for stretches, and the only other person in that discussion is thought by many to be the best WR ever.

[BM1090]

It's a bit weird to me that the guy saying Lamar can't win in the playoffs was banging the Goff for MVP drum.

Lamar DOES need to be better in the playoffs. Can't fumble that snap for a TD. Needs to be more consistent. Can't fumble and throw a pick in a big moment in 2024.

But this is the second consecutive year that his teammates have failed in big moments. It was Andrews this year. It was Flowers fumbling at the one yard line in 2024.

The Ravens were (IMO) the better team in both of those games. But they have to clean that crap up.

[WhiteTrash]

I think its pretty incredible that in a world of stats obsession for the HOF, especially counting stats, a guy who only played 7 seasons and retired before 30 made the HOF. 

The NFL isn't as bad about it as MLB, but still, pretty awesome acknowledgment of a guy who in his short peak was arguably the best WR in football for stretches, and the only other person in that discussion is thought by many to be the best WR ever.

In this Bears fan's opinion, Sterling was also a great analyst on TV. Better than his brother.

[Jockey]

Lamar definitely should have caught that 2-point conversion. Total choke job.
And when he made Zay Flowers fumble at the goal line in last year's AFC Championship game? Not a winner.

I never could understand why these things happen to Lamar, but not any other QBs. Guys like Rodgers were never denied the SB because a guy fumbled


But this whole discussion is over Hards calling Lamar the greatest  NFL player ever.

[The Sultan]

I think its pretty incredible that in a world of stats obsession for the HOF, especially counting stats, a guy who only played 7 seasons and retired before 30 made the HOF. 

The NFL isn't as bad about it as MLB, but still, pretty awesome acknowledgment of a guy who in his short peak was arguably the best WR in football for stretches, and the only other person in that discussion is thought by many to be the best WR ever.

And until the end of his career, played on some really bad teams.