NCAA Tournament

[dgies9156]

The NCAA women's final was a classic finess versus physicality game. Iowa was a finess team and LSU was brutal physically. The game reminded me quite a bit of when Northeast or certain Midwest teams would go south and play SEC finess teams. The SEC would get their butts handed to them.

Ironically, while LSU was bumping Iowa around just enough to make them "off" a bit, it was their uncanny three-point shooting in the first half that made the difference in the game. That and LSU always seemed to come up with a basket when it mattered.

I agree with Brother Goose -- Caitlin Clark needs to learn some defense. She probably also needs to bulk up a bit, or else she will get killed in the WNBA. The fact that LSU's physicality was getting to her was evident with her carping at referees. To some extent, her technical probably came from the refs getting tired of her(Her coach should have said, "Caitlin, shut up and play. Sometimes, we're going to get bad refs!") Nonetheless, she is an incredible basketball player and single-handedly took down South Carolina, which probably was the best team in the nation this year.

Ultimately, Ms. Clark reminds me of a combination of Markus and Tyler. Some of her bounce passes were incredible to watch. The way she found open women was at times Kolek-esq and if she does bulk up, she'll truly be a generational talent.

[TallTitan34]

Don't get me wrong I think she is a great player and rightfully the player of the year. 

What bothers me is when you see her logo shots, many of them are contested shots with 25 seconds on the shot clock and open players right on the line.  Unless shes getting backed into a corner she could literally get a better shot at any point in the possession.  Couple that with selling "From The Logo" gear. 

I love Markus (and think his number should be retired yesterday) but it drove me crazy when he would take a contested three early in the shot clock.  Many went in (just like Caitlin) but that still doesn't make it a good shot. 

[lawdog77]

The NCAA women's final was a classic finess versus physicality game. Iowa was a finess team and LSU was brutal physically. The game reminded me quite a bit of when Northeast or certain Midwest teams would go south and play SEC finess teams. The SEC would get their butts handed to them.

Ironically, while LSU was bumping Iowa around just enough to make them "off" a bit, it was their uncanny three-point shooting in the first half that made the difference in the game. That and LSU always seemed to come up with a basket when it mattered.

I agree with Brother Goose -- Caitlin Clark needs to learn some defense. She probably also needs to bulk up a bit, or else she will get killed in the WNBA. The fact that LSU's physicality was getting to her was evident with her carping at referees. To some extent, her technical probably came from the refs getting tired of her(Her coach should have said, "Caitlin, shut up and play. Sometimes, we're going to get bad refs!") Nonetheless, she is an incredible basketball player and single-handedly took down South Carolina, which probably was the best team in the nation this year.

Ultimately, Ms. Clark reminds me of a combination of Markus and Tyler. Some of her bounce passes were incredible to watch. The way she found open women was at times Kolek-esq and if she does bulk up, she'll truly be a generational talent.

The T was horsecrap. Here is the ref explanation:

Referee Lisa Jones explained the technical foul call to a pool reporter after the game.

"Iowa received a delay of game warning in the third period at the 7:28 mark for batting the ball away after a made basket, causing a delay," Jones said. "The second offense was when No. 22 from Iowa [Clark] picked up the ball and failed to immediately pass the ball to the nearest official after the whistle was blown ... by failing to and it reads, attempting to gain an advantage by interfering with the ball after a goal or by failing to immediately pass the ball to the nearest official after the whistle is blown."

[dgies9156]

MU's all time leading scorer.  Two time all American.  Cousy award finalist as best PG in the country.

Disrespected by those who don't know ball.

Brother Tower:

Markus was incredible, I'll agree. He was a generational find by Coach Wojo. He was an excellent representative of Marquette University.

But, what most who turn our backs on the Markus Howard era see is a guy who didn't make his team better. Candidly, that's probably coaching more than than any individual player. But we see a team that was a "way too early" ranking of second in the nation that imploded and cost Coach Wojo his job. We saw a team that was destined to be very good become very ordinary very quickly. We saw a team that filled up on candy and didn't do the "meat and potatoes" things that make a team in the NCAA really good. And, Markus wasn't any good defensively.

Fair or not, Markus' tenure at Marquette always will be intertwined with the Hausers and the "letter." Most of us just want to move on from that period.

[StillAWarrior]

MU's all time leading scorer.  Two time all American.  Cousy award finalist as best PG in the country.

Disrespected by those who don't know ball.

It's ignorant (and, yes, disrespectful) to say that Markus didn't make that team better. Of course he did. It's impossible to know exactly what that team could have been if a coach used the talent on the roster differently -- but Markus was absolutely fantastic in the role he was asked to play. He was among the best  who ever played for Marquette. I think anyone who feels differently is either protecting their anti-Wojo feelings for Wojo onto Markus or relishes being contrarian.

Clark led her team in points, rebounds, assists, blocks, and was second in steals. She clearly excelled in the role she was asked to play. I think that anyone who says they are not impressed by her either had unrealistic expectations or simply relishes being contrarian.

[NickelDimer]

Markus Howard carried a team which featured Sacar anim as its second leading scorer to a safe ncaa bid. That is significant.

Safe to say your definition of significant differs from mine...pretty significantly

[StillAWarrior]

The fact that LSU's physicality was getting to her was evident with her carping at referees. To some extent, her technical probably came from the refs getting tired of her(Her coach should have said, "Caitlin, shut up and play. Sometimes, we're going to get bad refs!") Nonetheless, she is an incredible basketball player and single-handedly took down South Carolina, which probably was the best team in the nation this year.

While I don't disagree, two comments in response: 1) I did see one of the assistant coaches sit her down on the bench once when she was carping at referees; 2) I could not believe how long of a leash the refs gave the LSU coach -- if they were inclined to get tired of someone, I can't imagine how they didn't get tired of her.

[StillAWarrior]

Don't get me wrong I think she is a great player and rightfully the player of the year. 

What bothers me is when you see her logo shots, many of them are contested shots with 25 seconds on the shot clock and open players right on the line.  Unless shes getting backed into a corner she could literally get a better shot at any point in the possession.  Couple that with selling "From The Logo" gear. 

I love Markus (and think his number should be retired yesterday) but it drove me crazy when he would take a contested three early in the shot clock.  Many went in (just like Caitlin) but that still doesn't make it a good shot.

That's aboslutely fair.

[5DollarPitcher]

MU's all time leading scorer.  Two time all American.  Cousy award finalist as best PG in the country.

Disrespected by those who don't know ball.

Great player. His tenure is commensurate with team failure. Both undeniable facts.

If you acknowledge one without the other - maybe it is you who doesn't know ball.

[lawdog77]

While I don't disagree, two comments in response: 1) I did see one of the assistant coaches sit her down on the bench once when she was carping at referees; 2) I could not believe how long of a leash the refs gave the LSU coach -- if they were inclined to get tired of someone, I can't imagine how they didn't get tired of her.

They were probably afraid Ms. Mulkey would literally murder them. I had nightmares last night because of her scowl. I did dig her outfit though.

[wadesworld]

Brother Tower:

Markus was incredible, I'll agree. He was a generational find by Coach Wojo. He was an excellent representative of Marquette University.

But, what most who turn our backs on the Markus Howard era see is a guy who didn't make his team better. Candidly, that's probably coaching more than than any individual player. But we see a team that was a "way too early" ranking of second in the nation that imploded and cost Coach Wojo his job. We saw a team that was destined to be very good become very ordinary very quickly. We saw a team that filled up on candy and didn't do the "meat and potatoes" things that make a team in the NCAA really good. And, Markus wasn't any good defensively.

Fair or not, Markus' tenure at Marquette always will be intertwined with the Hausers and the "letter." Most of us just want to move on from that period.

Again, that's just laughable.

If your argument for that is, "Markus ran the Hausers off," well, people who claim to be important here also noted that the Hausers told Wojo not to recruit Tyler Herro.  So it appears that the Hausers did not like to play with guys who had more talent than them.  The common denominator appears to have been the Hausers, not Markus.

[dgies9156]

They were probably afraid Ms. Mulkey would literally murder them. I had nightmares last night because of her scowl. I did dig her outfit though.

No kidding.

Ms. Mulkey reminded me of my Mom on a bad day, when we children just got under skin a bit too much.

We all knew the drill -- take cover!

Ms. Mulkey's outfits were ridiculous and designed to garner attention. Kinda like slick Rick and his white suits.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Great player. His tenure is commensurate with team failure. Both undeniable facts.

If you acknowledge one without the other - maybe it is you who doesn't know ball.

I haven't seen anyone not acknowledge the team failure part. I have seen several people not acknowledge the great player part.

[dgies9156]

I haven't seen anyone not acknowledge the team failure part. I have seen several people not acknowledge the great player part.

Brother TAMU:

I did. And I cheered hard for Markus when he was with us. Nobody this side of maybe Coach Wojo and Markus himself wanted Markus to succeed more than I did. Because I wanted us to win, early and often!!!!

I see Markus the way I do Pete Maravich. I saw Maravich quite a bit as a boy. He was truly a remarkable basketball player. But none of his LSU teams were any good and the one that made post-season, 1969-1970, ran into a lawnmower named Al McGuire and the Marquette Warriors. The failing Maravich had was that Daddy, like Wojo, thought one person could carry a team. In LSU's case, there wasn't enough talent around this remarkable talent to make LSU truly special.

Marquette may have been worse yet because Markus had talent around him but the coaching was even worse than LSU!

[Uncle Rico]

I haven't seen anyone not acknowledge the team failure part. I have seen several people not acknowledge the great player part.

He wasn't a white guy from Stevens Point

[Viper]

It's ignorant (and, yes, disrespectful) to say that Markus didn't make that team better. Of course he did. It's impossible to know exactly what that team could have been if a coach used the talent on the roster differently -- but Markus was absolutely fantastic in the role he was asked to play. He was among the best  who ever played for Marquette. I think anyone who feels differently is either protecting their anti-Wojo feelings for Wojo onto Markus or relishes being contrarian.

Clark led her team in points, rebounds, assists, blocks, and was second in steals. She clearly excelled in the role she was asked to play. I think that anyone who says they are not impressed by her either had unrealistic expectations or simply relishes being contrarian.

for me, MH...and Rowsey too, was why I tuned in. Incredible shooters. Wojo was ok with shoot to get hot shoot to stay hot so that's what MH did. Unfortunately Markus' teams weren't better. That's on Wojo for not making the proper adjustments. As a result...well, we know the results.
I'm sure, however, his jersey will be hoisted to the rafters someday.

[tower912]

Brother dgies

I stand by my statement.

[MuggsyB]

Brother TAMU:

I did. And I cheered hard for Markus when he was with us. Nobody this side of maybe Coach Wojo and Markus himself wanted Markus to succeed more than I did. Because I wanted us to win, early and often!!!!

I see Markus the way I do Pete Maravich. I saw Maravich quite a bit as a boy. He was truly a remarkable basketball player. But none of his LSU teams were any good and the one that made post-season, 1969-1970, ran into a lawnmower named Al McGuire and the Marquette Warriors. The failing Maravich had was that Daddy, like Wojo, thought one person could carry a team. In LSU's case, there wasn't enough talent around this remarkable talent to make LSU truly special.

Marquette may have been worse yet because Markus had talent around him but the coaching was even worse than LSU!

Brother Dgies,

Had we had the right coaching and pieces around the mighty mites we would have done some serious damage.  We probably had 3/5 best pure shooters in the country.  The problem is defensively you couldn't play the mm's together all that much and our overall defense was a sieve. 

[Lennys Tap]

Again, that's just laughable.

So it appears that the Hausers did not like to play with guys who had more talent than them.

Really? Sam's seems OK playing with some pretty good players on the Boston Celtics. Where's Markus these days?

[Uncle Rico]

Really? Sam's seems OK playing with some pretty good players on the Boston Celtics. Where's Markus these days?

Proudly representing your alma mater in Spain.

[dgies9156]

OK, since the question has been raised about a hanging of Markus' jersey in the rafters, here's something to gnaw on:  I'm against it because while he was a good ballplayer, he was not a transformative legacy that the program will remember forever -- or should remember forever.

To that end, here's some jerseys that are and aren't retired.

Kojis -- First great player to Marquette. Made us part of the NCAAs during his career.
Meminger -- Leader of Marquette's NIT Championship team in 1970.
Thompson -- MU's first great superstar. Got team to regional finals in 1969. McGuire's first of many.
Chones -- Not up there. Maybe the greatest ever at Marquette next to DWade, but wasn't transformative. Left before he could win an NCAA.
Lucas -- Led us to the 1974 NCAA Runner-up.
Lee/Ellis -- NCAA Champions.
Rivers -- Held the program up under Hank.
Wade -- HOFer. May have saved the program!
Al -- Greatest Coach Ever, made MU Basketball
Hank -- Assistant on the 1977 team, ever loyal to Al.

Using the Glenn Rivers standard, I could see Markus. But, if you do that, plan on about 20 other jerseys up there as well.

[Uncle Rico]

OK, since the question has been raised about a hanging of Markus' jersey in the rafters, here's something to gnaw on:  I'm against it because while he was a good ballplayer, he was not a transformative legacy that the program will remember forever -- or should remember forever.

To that end, here's some jerseys that are and aren't retired.

Kojis -- First great player to Marquette. Made us part of the NCAAs during his career.
Meminger -- Leader of Marquette's NIT Championship team in 1970.
Thompson -- MU's first great superstar. Got team to regional finals in 1969. McGuire's first of many.
Chones -- Not up there. Maybe the greatest ever at Marquette next to DWade, but wasn't transformative. Left before he could win an NCAA.
Lucas -- Led us to the 1974 NCAA Runner-up.
Lee/Ellis -- NCAA Champions.
Rivers -- Held the program up under Hank.
Wade -- HOFer. May have saved the program!
Al -- Greatest Coach Ever, made MU Basketball
Hank -- Assistant on the 1977 team, ever loyal to Al.

Using the Glenn Rivers standard, I could see Markus. But, if you do that, plan on about 20 other jerseys up there as well.

Get rid of retired jerseys altogether and do a ring of honor type of thing

[cheebs09]

Get rid of retired jerseys altogether and do a ring of honor type of thing

This is the way.

[Jay Bee]

Raise Markus' jersey AND erect a statue next to Al, TODAY!!

[tower912]

Get rid of retired jerseys altogether and do a ring of honor type of thing

He has spoken