MU's Resurgence/Recruiting Future

[Goose]

BC

I would be surprised if only one left after this season. I am good with that because that is progress. My heart wants to believe Oso and Omax are back and hope that is the case. Depending on how things shake out, I could see one of the guards, aside from Ellis, leaving after this season.

[Elonsmusk]

5 years to judge. What will happen when Wojo hasn't gifted us the majority of our stellar starting lineup aina?

Shaka hires Wojo to be his recruiting ace, due to his incredible charisma and intellect.

[BCHoopster]

BC

I would be surprised if only one left after this season. I am good with that because that is progress. My heart wants to believe Oso and Omax are back and hope that is the case. Depending on how things shake out, I could see one of the guards, aside from Ellis, leaving after this season.

2 would be great, add another big in the transfer portal would help.  Last years transfer did not work, but kids watch MU now they have to be impressed with the system they are playing. 

[tower912]

I prefer continuity to the mythical impact big.

[jfp61]

The type of results are what I thought was possible, and my expectations were a top 15-25 type team in the preseason. I think Goose and I were of similar minds that while most were looking at what we lost, not enough were looking at what we brought back.

I mentioned to the Three Man Weave guys in preseason that we were basically Creighton in that we brought back a starting PG (Kolek/Nembhard) and forward (O-Max/Kaluma), as well as elevating a key reserve (Mitchell/Alexander). For all three of those, Marquette had the more efficient player. We both had high-efficiency bigs (Oso/Kalk). We both lost our best players (Justin/Hawkins) and supplementary scorers (Morsell/O'Connell). The biggest question was replacing that offensive pop, we did so from within (Kam) while they did so from outside (Scheierman).

They mostly dismissed Marquette being better, like all of the national media did, but this team was about what we brought back. What's impressed me the most, however, is how rapidly Coach Smart has brought development out of these guys. I expected Tyler, Kam, O-Max, and Oso to be good, but Stevie's efficiency, Joplin's usefulness (even his defense has shown signs of life the past few games), and Chase Ohmigod Ross really look good.

I had among the highest expectations for this team and they are still blowing past them. So I guess "F**k me" too

Unrelated. I have been watching some Creighton games lately, they look really good. By far the best defensive team in this conference. I could see them being a Big East title contender at the end of the year with Marquette.

[Dr. Blackheart]

You don't think Shaka will Crean anybody?

I think he'll go about it differently, maintaining the relationship, coaching the player to realize that they will get more playing time and have more fun by dropping down a level. But I bet he "recruits over" folks at the end of the day.

Well he "Creaned" a few of Wojo's guys. But, in this case, I think the plan was very clear when they took the overcommit.

[muwarrior69]

Excellent post, Goose.

My only quibble is that I don't think you give Oso enough credit in point #5 above. Like Kolek, he is a "connector" -- a highly intelligent, team-first guy who is always thinking about ways to put his teammates in position to succeed. The almost unbelievable degree to which he improved is relevant  -- it makes him a tremendous role model, and it speaks to Shaka's ability to both develop talent and think outside the box. There already have been a few national stories about Oso, and there will be dozens more during what we both expect will be a memorable month of March. Such notoriety can only help Shaka's recruiting.

Recruiting is never "easy," but I agree with you (and others) that Shaka's Marquette program will only get more attractive to kids who want to play in an incredibly fun, successful, share-the-ball system under a "cool" coach who simply gets it.

Yep yep yep.

So the Hausers would have loved Shaka. 

[dgies9156]

Well he "Creaned" a few of Wojo's guys. But, in this case, I think the plan was very clear when they took the overcommit.

Brother Doc, you have to. With NIL and immediate transfers, if you don't Crean a few players, you end up with rosters like Wojos that had empty scholarships.

[dgies9156]

So the Hausers would have loved Shaka. 

Sam: Absolutely.

Joey: No, especially when Coach Shaka sits him on his ass for not being connected.

[willie warrior]

Shaka hires Wojo to be his recruiting ace, due to his incredible charisma and intellect.

Now, that....is funny. While there may be intellect, charisma is lacking

[MU82]

Somebody is leaving, and I do not believe Oso or Omax are NBA ready

Whether you believe it or not is immaterial. Did you believe Vander was ready? Did you believe Carton was ready? Did you believe Lewis was ready?

College kids leave when they leave for a variety of reasons — none of which is whether Scoopers think they're ready.

Now, maybe NIL, plus feeling really comfortable with Shaka, the other players and the program's direction, could factor into either or both staying.

We'll see!

[DoctorV]

Another great thread.

Scoopers are on a heater today.

Times are good.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

I just can't believe how far ahead of "schedule" this team is.

Blah blah blah five years blah

It's great to be on the right track and I think people are right.  The best part about getting a system rolling is that you can select a couple players a year that fit as opposed to going after best that says yes regardless of fit. 

[Goose]

One thing I did not mention on my earlier post, but it might be the biggest reason for my optimism with Shaka from day one. The hiring of Shaka was big deal and his being a seasoned HC, aside from Shaka the person, was what I was most excited about.

I, and I think Dr. B., stated the meter on judging Shaka started the day he signed the contract. There was no five year grace period and there should not have been a long leash.

MU showed what basketball means to the school with this hire and for the gamble to work, it needed quick results, IMO. Apathy had taken over much of the fanbase and patience was running thin.

The hiring of a high level HC changed everything to me. Plus, Shaka arrived with a lot to prove and that was important to me. Sure, he was going to get time, but I do not think a five year rebuild was ever part of the conversation.

[The Equalizer]

Overlooked is roster composition. Crean and Wojo always had holes. Shaka got right into it and got "his guys" in here even if a few of them were Wojo's guys. No "five (or 7) years to judge."

To be fair, this statement was made in the context of low-major hires or promoted assistants--not guys coming in with a P6 pedigree.

You don't need to give Miller or Smart or Anderson five years--you knew what you were getting when you hired them. In other words, they already had their five+ years, and they passed the test at the Big East level.

On the other hand, it would be highly unfair to make any conclusion about Neptune or even Stubblefield right now. They inherited tough situations (Neptune with a depleted roster and injuries, Stubblefield with a major rebuild).   Even if Villanova was winning at full strength, fans would want to see if he can recruit to the level that Jay Wright did.

[MuMark]

Overlooked is roster composition. Crean and Wojo always had holes. Shaka got right into it and got "his guys" in here even if a few of them were Wojo's guys. No "five (or 7) years to judge."

The one blip this year was Wrightsil's injury and his board work, but that's not a miss.

That said, I was a COLE this year (step back year: bubble or NIT) because of youth and the Alphas moving on. Figuring next season was the big jump with experience. This team's Alpha is "the team". No one guy is "the guy" which has been the fun part of the surprise.

Yep.....glad Shaka is our coach.....and I'm glad Wojo recruited Oso, Kam and Stevie before he was let go.

This team would look very different without those guys.

I know this team lost Justin, Morsell and Kur and has gotten better......I think if people expect that to happen consistently they are probably fooling themselves.

The pieces fit on this team......players complement each other......every coach will have to deal with attrition......sometimes it works out fine.......sometimes it doesn't.

[BCHoopster]

Whether you believe it or not is immaterial. Did you believe Vander was ready? Did you believe Carton was ready? Did you believe Lewis was ready?

College kids leave when they leave for a variety of reasons — none of which is whether Scoopers think they're ready.

Now, maybe NIL, plus feeling really comfortable with Shaka, the other players and the program's direction, could factor into either or both staying.

We'll see!

True, but looking at some mock drafts they are not even sniffing the Top 60.  Omax has improved but lacks some consistency and Oso who might be the most improved
player in the country, does not fit the NBA game yet.  Both need at least another year to get stronger and work on there game a little bit more.  I would be more concerned about the NLI money being thrown around.  Yes, both received some decent money this year but not millions some of these football players are getting.
Shaka has brought the best out of Oso, offense is run threw him, not many programs are doing that, he changed the offense to best fit Oso, and he has proved Shaka
right.  Like you said, time will tell.  A deep run in the tournament may want them to comeback and do better the following year.  Hope that is the case.

[MU82]

True, but looking at some mock drafts they are not even sniffing the Top 60.  Omax has improved but lacks some consistency and Oso who might be the most improved
player in the country, does not fit the NBA game yet.  Both need at least another year to get stronger and work on there game a little bit more.  I would be more concerned about the NLI money being thrown around.  Yes, both received some decent money this year but not millions some of these football players are getting.
Shaka has brought the best out of Oso, offense is run threw him, not many programs are doing that, he changed the offense to best fit Oso, and he has proved Shaka
right.  Like you said, time will tell.  A deep run in the tournament may want them to comeback and do better the following year.  Hope that is the case.

Re your first sentence: Again, you are acting like that actually matters. If guys want to go, they will go. The last 10 years of Marquette basketball have proven that over and over again. Blue, Carton and Bailey were showing up in few (if any) mock drafts and they obviously weren't "ready." They left anyway. I'm sure you felt each needed another year in college. They left anyway.

Of course Oso and O-Max aren't "ready."

So?

[GoldenEagles03]

Re your first sentence: Again, you are acting like that actually matters. If guys want to go, they will go. The last 10 years of Marquette basketball have proven that over and over again. Blue, Carton and Bailey were showing up in few (if any) mock drafts and they obviously weren't "ready." They left anyway. I'm sure you felt each needed another year in college. They left anyway.

Of course Oso and O-Max aren't "ready."

So?

With a side note that Vander, Carton, Bailey weren't able to get paid in College.

[mileskishnish72]

The type of results are what I thought was possible, and my expectations were a top 15-25 type team in the preseason.
What's impressed me the most, however, is how rapidly Coach Smart has brought development out of these guys. I expected Tyler, Kam, O-Max, and Oso to be good, but Stevie's efficiency, Joplin's usefulness (even his defense has shown signs of life the past few games), and Chase Ohmigod Ross really look good.

I had among the highest expectations for this team and they are still blowing past them. So I guess "F**k me" too

My expectations were quite a bit lower, and I'm absolutely delighted to have been so wrong. I think that you are completely correct to point to the player development as a key factor. I admit I did not foresee it because we were not used to expecting it.  We've seen multiple players correct shortcomings and develop new skills. Yes, I am attributing it to Shaka because this is year-to-year improvement we haven't seen since JFB. This kind of development is suggestive of a coach that views his job as a year-round gig and who seeks to facilitate the most improvement for the kids that have committed to play for him. I am enjoying the ride, and the sensation of MU hoops being relevant again. And the best thing is, it feels like we're still on the upcurve. Go, Warriors!

[Tyler COLEk]

Re your first sentence: Again, you are acting like that actually matters. If guys want to go, they will go. The last 10 years of Marquette basketball have proven that over and over again. Blue, Carton and Bailey were showing up in few (if any) mock drafts and they obviously weren't "ready." They left anyway. I'm sure you felt each needed another year in college. They left anyway.

Of course Oso and O-Max aren't "ready."

So?

What a silly point this is. Should we worry about Sean Jones going pro too? Or maybe Stevie?

Of course college players can choose to go pro at any time. Do you have a reason you think Omax or Oso would be inclined to do so? Feels like scoopers were awfully influenced by a couple CBSSN broadcast comments about scouts in attendance.

[GoFastAndWin]

The biggest threat to continuity won't be players leaving early to go pro. It will be players considering transfers given the current rules and NIL.

No.
They love Shaka, and playing for him.
That's good for more than you think.

[GoFastAndWin]

One thing I did not mention on my earlier post, but it might be the biggest reason for my optimism with Shaka from day one. The hiring of Shaka was big deal and his being a seasoned HC, aside from Shaka the person, was what I was most excited about.

I, and I think Dr. B., stated the meter on judging Shaka started the day he signed the contract. There was no five year grace period and there should not have been a long leash.

MU showed what basketball means to the school with this hire and for the gamble to work, it needed quick results, IMO. Apathy had taken over much of the fanbase and patience was running thin.

The hiring of a high level HC changed everything to me. Plus, Shaka arrived with a lot to prove and that was important to me. Sure, he was going to get time, but I do not think a five year rebuild was ever part of the conversation.

Excellent post, Goose!

[GoFastAndWin]

The biggest threat to continuity won't be NIL. It will be "believing the hype" with hype being on its way for this program, in spades. I don't think even that is a threat, as Shaka knows what buttons to push to keep guys within the culture at all times. Buzz was always fond of saying "we have zero margin for error". If this team and future teams still play with this humble mindset, despite evidence to the contrary, look out!

[MU82]

With a side note that Vander, Carton, Bailey weren't able to get paid in College.

Good point. In my first response to BC, I said NIL could help keep kids in school.

What a silly point this is. Should we worry about Sean Jones going pro too? Or maybe Stevie?

Of course college players can choose to go pro at any time. Do you have a reason you think Omax or Oso would be inclined to do so? Feels like scoopers were awfully influenced by a couple CBSSN broadcast comments about scouts in attendance.

With all due respect, I was responding to a Scooper who keeps opining that guys won't go pro because they're "not ready" — as if supposedly not being ready keeps kids from going pro.

I do not "worry" about this at all.