Cracked Sidewalks: NIL's possible impact at Marquette

[WhiteTrash]

As stated previously,  the payments to players will have nothing or little to do with value to a business. Booster have paid big money in the past with zero expectations of ROI except a better team.

[Newsdreams]

As stated previously,  the payments to players will have nothing or little to do with value to a business. Booster have paid big money in the past with zero expectations of ROI except a better team.

You make it seem like it will be a free for all, it won't be.

[Billy Hoyle]

As stated previously,  the payments to players will have nothing or little to do with value to a business. Booster have paid big money in the past with zero expectations of ROI except a better team.

However, players have to disclose every deal to their compliance offices. Failure to do so can result in ineligibility

[The Equalizer]

None of this contradicts what I've written here.
You've just shifted from "it's not against the rules" to "the rules are unenforceable."
And I think it's probably way more enforceable than how it's been done for the last century, which was entirely under the table. At least here you're going to have actual contracts, numbers and transactions occurring between known entities.

Also, fwiw, if you read the legislation passed by states on this, they also ban students from being compensated in exchange for attending a particular school.

For example, the Illinois bill reads:
" A student-athlete may not earn compensation in exchange for the student-athlete's athletic ability or participation in intercollegiate athletics or sports competition or agreement or willingness to attend a postsecondary educational institution."

Texas' biill reads:
A student athlete may not enter into a contract for the use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness if (C)  the compensation for the use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness is provided (i)  in exchange for athletic performance or attendance at the institution

The Florida bill:
"such compensation may not be provided in exchange for athletic performance or attendance at a particular institution and may only be provided by a third party unaffiliated with the intercollegiate athlete’s postsecondary educational institution."

Georgia:
A student athlete at a postsecondary educational institution may earn compensation for the use of his or her name, image, or likeness. Such compensation must be commensurate with the market value of the authorized use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness. Such compensation may not be provided in exchange, in whole or in part, for a current or prospective student athlete to attend, participate, or perform at a particular postsecondary educational institution.

So, not only is what you're suggesting expressly prohibited by the NCAA, but also state law where NIL legislation has been passed (and copycat bills will be passed eventually in all states).

So you don't compensate them for attending a particular school or in exchange for athletic abilities.
 
You compensate them for speaking at your company's sales meeting, or holding a meet and greet with customers once a month, or using his image in advertising, or being your "campus ambassador."   The things you COULD still pay the player for are endless.


And The Georgia law has this doozy:

"Such compensation must be commensurate with the market value of the authorized use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness." 

However, market value is by definition set by the market, which means that in Georgia, NIL compensation by law must be somewhere between the minimum a player is willing to accept and the most a booster is willing to pay. 

[brewcity77]

I don't think people are cognizant of what's about to happen. There will be millionaires playing college sports by the end of the year. There will be 6-figure deals coming out tomorrow. This will be a sea change.

[Pakuni]

So you don't compensate them for attending a particular school or in exchange for athletic abilities.
 
You compensate them for speaking at your company's sales meeting, or holding a meet and greet with customers once a month, or using his image in advertising, or being your "campus ambassador."   The things you COULD still pay the player for are endless.

You're misunderstanding.
The rules are that the compensation cannot be conditioned upon attendance at a particular school, ergo JoeBob's Dodge of Waukesha can't say "We'll pay you for a meet and greet IF you attend Marquette University."

And The Georgia law has this doozy:

"Such compensation must be commensurate with the market value of the authorized use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness." 

However, market value is by definition set by the market, which means that in Georgia, NIL compensation by law must be somewhere between the minimum a player is willing to accept and the most a booster is willing to pay.

Uhhh ...yeah. That's not quite how fair market value is determined.

[brewcity77]

You're misunderstanding.
The rules are that the compensation cannot be conditioned upon attendance at a particular school, ergo JoeBob's Dodge of Waukesha can't say "We'll pay you for a meet and greet IF you attend Marquette University."

So that can't be in print. It won't be in the contract. If you don't think it will be obvious, explicit, and unsaid while also being completely allowed by both government and NCAA because there's no way to prevent it, I think you are out of your mind.

[WhiteTrash]

You're misunderstanding.
The rules are that the compensation cannot be conditioned upon attendance at a particular school, ergo JoeBob's Dodge of Waukesha can't say "We'll pay you for a meet and greet IF you attend Marquette University."

Uhhh ...yeah. That's not quite how fair market value is determined.

You need to get into the real world.  There is almost no way to determine FMV for personal service. Some people make 10X others for doing the same work.  Not saying it's right but it happens every day.

[TallTitan34]

I don't think people are cognizant of what's about to happen. There will be millionaires playing college sports by the end of the year. There will be 6-figure deals coming out tomorrow. This will be a sea change.

“LSU gymnast @livvydunne will be one of the first to cash in. Could sign $100K+ in deals easy this week.”

https://instagram.com/livvydunne?utm_medium=copy_link

[rocket surgeon]

kinda like the good ole days-making sure the football fields sprinkler system goes off at the correct times, watching the grass grow, tutoring, etc etc.  this is going to mess up "amateur" sports real nicely.  no more eye's raised when buckets mchoopster drives up in his mclaren gt

[Pakuni]

So that can't be in print. It won't be in the contract. If you don't think it will be obvious, explicit, and unsaid while also being completely allowed by both government and NCAA because there's no way to prevent it, I think you are out of your mind.

We seem to have reached the straw man portion of the discussion.
I have zero doubt that NIL agreements will be reached with an expectation that a player attends a particular school.. After all, a Milwaukee business is unlikely to strike an endorsement deal with a kid it expects to attend Penn State.
But this is VERY different than your initial post and some of your ensuing arguments, which were predicated on offering a kid (Dawson Garcia, to be specific) six figures "contingent" on him returning to Marquette for another season. You insisted that this was allowed, there were no rules against it  and there would be no way to enforce it even if it were against the rules, all of which is obviously incorrect.

As for "that can't be in print," you seem awfully flip about that  ... which, understandably, is easy to do when talking about other people's money. I suspect smart business people won't be as comfortable handing a teenager $100K with no contractual protections, merely in the hopes he doesn't have a change of heart or doesn't get a better offer elsewhere.
Heck, if your vision for how this all turns out were true, a 5-star recruit could collect several hundred thousand dollars from boosters at multiple schools and end up attending none of them.

[brewcity77]

You insisted that this was allowed, there were no rules against it  and there would be no way to enforce it even if it were against the rules, all of which is obviously incorrect.

It is allowed, especially in Wisconsin where there are LITERALLY NO LAWS TO PREVENT IT. The laws you cite may as well outlaw unicorns.

[Pakuni]

It is allowed, especially in Wisconsin where there are LITERALLY NO LAWS TO PREVENT IT. The laws you cite may as well outlaw unicorns.

It literally is not allowed. Just read the NCAA rules. This isn't rocket science and using ALL CAPS doesn't make your arguments any less wrong.
 
The very first item listed under what the rules do not allow is:
"Allow NIL compensation contingent on enrollment at a particular institution."

https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/ncaa/NIL/NIL_PolicyKeyTakeaways.pdf

[rocky_warrior]

I don't think people are cognizant of what's about to happen. There will be millionaires playing college sports by the end of the year. There will be 6-figure deals coming out tomorrow. This will be a sea change.

Your statements *may* be true.  But it won' be as prevalent as you may be projecting.

[rocky_warrior]

Not a Redick fan, but this is fantastic:

https://twitter.com/jj_redick/status/1410403487947558914
JJ Redick
@jj_redick
From 2004-2006, I would have made a bag Money bag on NIL endorsements.  Sadly- I would have blown it all on Natty Light and Lacoste polos (with the collars popped, of course).

[muwarrior69]

Like they have found out other violations , eventually word gets around. They investigate and find violations by talking to former players.

So now we're going to have players ratting on each other and put the school in a position to deny this ever happened. So either the rule goes or this will kill college football and basketball.

NCAA: Did Markus get paid to go to MU?
Joey: Yes!
NCAA: Did you get paid to go to MU?
Joey: Hell No! Why do you think I left.

NCAA: MU can recruit only one player for the next 5 years.

[skianth16]

I don't think people are cognizant of what's about to happen. There will be millionaires playing college sports by the end of the year. There will be 6-figure deals coming out tomorrow. This will be a sea change.

I'm guessing there will only be a handful of athletes making big time money with the changes. Heisman candidates, blue blood one-and-done guys, and maybe a few talented transfers here and there in CBB and CFB. Most athletes are unknown on their own campuses, let alone to broader audiences, so I doubt we'll see significant impacts for the average athlete.

What I do think we'll see now are spirit shops selling player-specific merchandise like jerseys, signed photos, etc. that the players will get cut in on. And I would bet we'll see a huge influx of memorabilia sold online. Players setting up ebay or etsy stores to sell autographs or game worn shoes will become more common. We might even see cameo type services where players could get paid to wish an alum's kid happy birthday. But the value of most of this stuff is probably going to be pretty modest, but selling a bunch of $20 autographs probably still sounds pretty good for an 18 year old. 

I can see a world where athletic departments set themselves apart from other schools by offering advisors to help the student athletes manage these kinds of stores/services and even provide financial guidance too.

And OnlyFans will definitely happen too. Sooner than later.

[Galway Eagle]

I'm guessing there will only be a handful of athletes making big time money with the changes. Heisman candidates, blue blood one-and-done guys, and maybe a few talented transfers here and there in CBB and CFB. Most athletes are unknown on their own campuses, let alone to broader audiences, so I doubt we'll see significant impacts for the average athlete.

What I do think we'll see now are spirit shops selling player-specific merchandise like jerseys, signed photos, etc. that the players will get cut in on. And I would bet we'll see a huge influx of memorabilia sold online. Players setting up ebay or etsy stores to sell autographs or game worn shoes will become more common. We might even see cameo type services where players could get paid to wish an alum's kid happy birthday. But the value of most of this stuff is probably going to be pretty modest, but selling a bunch of $20 autographs probably still sounds pretty good for an 18 year old. 

I can see a world where athletic departments set themselves apart from other schools by offering advisors to help the student athletes manage these kinds of stores/services and even provide financial guidance too.

And OnlyFans will definitely happen too. Sooner than later.

Given it's impossible to track I'd wager more than a couple athletes are on there now. It's one of my concerns with 18yr olds who represent the university. Would like some form of morality clause in their options

[Pakuni]

Given it's impossible to track I'd wager more than a couple athletes are on there now. It's one of my concerns with 18yr olds who represent the university. Would like some form of morality clause in their options

I haven't read every state's NIL law, but the ones I have read include prohibitions on "adult" businesses (as well as gambling, tobacco and alcohol).

[Galway Eagle]

I haven't read every state's NIL law, but the ones I have read include prohibitions on "adult" businesses (as well as gambling, tobacco and alcohol).

Well that's good

[dgies9156]

I can see it now:

"Hi, this is Dawson Garcia for 'One Call That's All" and the Gruber Law Offices. You see, when I get angry at Coach Shaka because someone else is getting more shots, I don't write letters. That's so passé.

"Instead I make the One Call and guess what ... things happen.

"Remember, One Call, That's All!

[lawdog77]

However, players have to disclose every deal to their compliance offices. Failure to do so can result in ineligibility

Throwing out a hypothetical. If Garcia would get an NIL endorsement offer today, who would he run it through? It's summer, and he is in the portal.

His instagram is now 11K. I wonder if it gets a big spike, then that might mean another school fanbase is getting behind him in order for him to make more $$

[JWags85]

I'm guessing there will only be a handful of athletes making big time money with the changes. Heisman candidates, blue blood one-and-done guys, and maybe a few talented transfers here and there in CBB and CFB. Most athletes are unknown on their own campuses, let alone to broader audiences, so I doubt we'll see significant impacts for the average athlete.

Disagree here.  Bo Nix already signed a deal today with a large sweet tea brand.  He's a bum, but he's QB1 at Auburn.  Sure its not a million dollar deal, but I dont think its hard to imagine the QB at any D1 program or the leading scorer on any P6 basketball team having chances to make six figures.

A good friend of mine out of college was from Monroe, LA and went to Ole Miss.  He joked that if you were a starting SEC QB for 1-2 years, your life was set.  You could open up a car dealership or insurance agency, toss up a billboard with a picture of you shaking hands with Nick Saban or Dan Mullen, and clients would roll in.  I think you greatly underestimate the cult of collegiate athletics in many places.

[brewcity77]

It literally is not allowed. Just read the NCAA rules. This isn't rocket science and using ALL CAPS doesn't make your arguments any less wrong.
 
The very first item listed under what the rules do not allow is:
"Allow NIL compensation contingent on enrollment at a particular institution."

https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/ncaa/NIL/NIL_PolicyKeyTakeaways.pdf

NCAA rules are not laws. I didn't word that haphazardly. Wisconsin has no laws regarding this, and as Marquette is still in Wisconsin (despite popular belief otherwise) there are no laws to prevent it.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

NCAA rules are not laws. I didn't word that haphazardly. Wisconsin has no laws regarding this, and as Marquette is still in Wisconsin (despite popular belief otherwise) there are no laws to prevent it.

Just because there are no laws preventing something, that doesn't mean another organization's rules can't apply.