Cracked Sidewalks: NIL's possible impact at Marquette

[Pakuni]

Sure it can. "We're looking for a local athlete for a one-year sponsorship of our product/dealership/business." And because Dawson is already at Marquette, those offers can come immediately with the "we'll sign just as soon as you're enrolled in classes" caveat.

According to an NCAA memo obtained by Dennis Dodds, schools shall post a written NIL policy that prohibits payments from boosters "in exchange for athletic performance or attendance" at that school.
How is "we'll sign just as soon as you're enrolled in classes" not in violation of that written policy?

If you're advocating that MU break the rules, OK. But you can't argue that such an arrangement isn't against the rules.

[Pakuni]

Individuals like the one that found $6M to can Wojo will have plenty of motivation. And market size will matter less than alumni interest. The monied boosters know they are competing not just with other schools, but with G League Ignite and Overtime Elite. We're going to see numerous deals in the $100k-$500k range and beyond. Welcome to the new normal.

I really don't think so. I think you're vastly overestimating the perceived value of college basketball players.

[Newsdreams]

I really don't think so. I think you're vastly overestimating the perceived value of college basketball players.

I could see that type of money by shoe companies for locks to be lottery picks. Willing to gamble and have them engaged for a pro endorsement.

[Pakuni]

I could see that type of money by shoe companies for locks to be lottery picks. Willing to gamble and have them engaged for a pro endorsement.

For sure, but that's a long-term investment that would carry over to the professional ranks.
Brew seems to be suggesting that local car dealers and dentists are going to be spending $500K+ every year on borderline all-Big East players that 90% of the market has never heard of.
I just don't see it, but maybe I'll be proven wrong.

[dgies9156]

I've said it before and will do so again. The biggest beneficiaries of NIL changes will be people like emerging gymnasts, tennis platers, golfers and track and field athletes, provided they are university students and world class/olympic athletes.

Here's the MU Athletes who would more than marginally profit from NIL in recent years, while they were at Marquette.

1) Dwyane Wade
2) Markus Howard

I'd be curious about arguments for anyone else. The reality is we are in a professional sports town where MU has to compete with the Packers, Bucks, Brewers as well as the Red Rodent. We haven't had a coach who I think would have been a commercial draw since Al.

If you go back to the Al years, I'd argue the following additional athletes:

3) Butch Lee
4) Bo Ellis
5) Maurice Lucas
6) Jim Chones

All this said, I'm worried about NIL. We don't have the boosters nor do we have the depth of an alumni network that most Power 5 conferences have. Plus, our alumni are cheap! I fear when this is over and fully implemented, we're going to be road kill.

[The Lens]

We just bought out a coach and his staff to the tune of 8-10 million.  I don't think our boosters are cheap.
We are top ten in basketball expenses.  I don't think our boosters are cheap.
We just hired a guy away from Texas. I don't think our boosters are cheap.

[brewcity77]

How is "we'll sign just as soon as you're enrolled in classes" not in violation of that written policy?

If you're advocating that MU break the rules, OK. But you can't argue that such an arrangement isn't against the rules.

The NCAA has zero authority in telling David Gruber or any other private company how they handle their endorsements. That is a ridiculous and unenforceable rule.

[dgies9156]

We just bought out a coach and his staff to the tune of 8-10 million.  I don't think our boosters are cheap.
We are top ten in basketball expenses.  I don't think our boosters are cheap.
We just hired a guy away from Texas. I don't think our boosters are cheap.

Brother Lens, compared to the Power 5, the amount of money you're talking about is pocket change.

The buyout and retention of Shaka came because we're part of the Big East, have a large television contract and because the Jessies did a financial analysis that determined it would cost more to keep Coach Wojo than to start anew. We're Top 10 in expenses because of an institutional commitment. Our fans show up, but I don't count the season ticket holder whose only gift to the B&G Fund is the stipend to be a season ticket holder the same way I do people who the preponderance of their six- or seven figure contributions to the university is to athletic funds.

I'm not ruling it out, but I'd be surprised if anyone stepped up to pay out Coach Wojo's contract.

[Pakuni]

The NCAA has zero authority in telling David Gruber or any other private company how they handle their endorsements. That is a ridiculous and unenforceable rule.

You're right, the NCAA can't tell David Gruber how to handle his endorsements.
But the NCAA can suspend or declare ineligible any player it deems to have been compensated in violation of its rules. Would be kinda dumb for Dave to give $500K to a player who can't actually play, right?
Also, the NCAA can require Marquette to disassociate itself from a booster who's participated in rules violations (see: Martin, Ed). So, perhaps Dave's reward for spending six figures to buy a player woiuld be losing his season tickets.

[Jay Bee]

Can we have Dawson do a Scoop welcome video for the website & pay him for it? Let’s start up a collection plate. I Got Five On It.

[brewcity77]

You're right, the NCAA can't tell David Gruber how to handle his endorsements.
But the NCAA can suspend or declare ineligible any player it deems to have been compensated in violation of its rules. Would be kinda dumb for Dave to give $500K to a player who can't actually play, right?
Also, the NCAA can require Marquette to disassociate itself from a booster who's participated in rules violations (see: Martin, Ed). So, perhaps Dave's reward for spending six figures to buy a player woiuld be losing his season tickets.

Schools are allowed to use past NIL deals for recruiting. Once the first deal is struck, all of the ability to prevent enticement goes out the door. This is completely unenforceable and it's laughable to suggest otherwise. The NCAA screwed up by dragging their feet and by saying whatever the school decides is cool pretty much means they gave up any pretense of policing this.

[ZiggysChestHair]

How much longer until a set of schools realize the NCAA does not provide them enough value and walk away?  I'm guessing it will start with a set of football schools or the ivy league.

[Uncle Rico]

How much longer until a set of schools realize the NCAA does not provide them enough value and walk away?  I'm guessing it will start with a set of football schools or the ivy league.

Who is going to run all of their tournaments for non-revenue sports

[muwarrior69]

Can the school offer a player a percentage of sales with their name/number sold at the spirit shop. I imagine quite a few students/alums would purchase MU gear knowing some of it is going to the player.

[muwarrior69]

My dad (PC Alum and season ticket holder) is convinced that this will doom the Big East and college hoops. FWIW I think he is wrong and think this sort of thing has been going on under the table for a long time regardless of legality. I get his concern as a PC fan with a small market, smaller alumni base, etc. but I do think that St Johns, Nova, Depaul, UCONN, MU, Georgetown with large markets/student bodies wont be significantly impacted on the negative side.

Between playing at MSG for the tourney, the national reputation of the Big East, and having a great commissioner with Val I do not expect this to be anything but a positive for MU

I'm in the same camp as your dad; perhaps a generational thing. I do hope we're wrong.

[Pakuni]

Schools are allowed to use past NIL deals for recruiting. Once the first deal is struck, all of the ability to prevent enticement goes out the door. This is completely unenforceable and it's laughable to suggest otherwise. The NCAA screwed up by dragging their feet and by saying whatever the school decides is cool pretty much means they gave up any pretense of policing this.

None of this contradicts what I've written here.
You've just shifted from "it's not against the rules" to "the rules are unenforceable."
And I think it's probably way more enforceable than how it's been done for the last century, which was entirely under the table. At least here you're going to have actual contracts, numbers and transactions occurring between known entities.

Also, fwiw, if you read the legislation passed by states on this, they also ban students from being compensated in exchange for attending a particular school.

For example, the Illinois bill reads:
" A student-athlete may not earn compensation in exchange for the student-athlete's athletic ability or participation in intercollegiate athletics or sports competition or agreement or willingness to attend a postsecondary educational institution."

Texas' biill reads:
A student athlete may not enter into a contract for the use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness if (C)  the compensation for the use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness is provided (i)  in exchange for athletic performance or attendance at the institution

The Florida bill:
"such compensation may not be provided in exchange for athletic performance or attendance at a particular institution and may only be provided by a third party unaffiliated with the intercollegiate athlete’s postsecondary educational institution."

Georgia:
A student athlete at a postsecondary educational institution may earn compensation for the use of his or her name, image, or likeness. Such compensation must be commensurate with the market value of the authorized use of the student athlete's name, image, or likeness. Such compensation may not be provided in exchange, in whole or in part, for a current or prospective student athlete to attend, participate, or perform at a particular postsecondary educational institution.

So, not only is what you're suggesting expressly prohibited by the NCAA, but also state law where NIL legislation has been passed (and copycat bills will be passed eventually in all states).

[lawdog77]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/college/2021/06/30/ncaa-adopts-name-image-likeness-policy/7813970002/

[muwarrior69]

They can't offer him a deal to stay. That is a violation. If they make an offer it cannot be contingent on him staying here.

They could offer him a deal and say it was not contingent on him staying. How could they prove it was?

[Pakuni]

They could offer him a deal and say it was not contingent on him staying. How could they prove it was?

They likely couldn't. But the athlete could sign the deal today and transfer tomorrow, and the sponsor would have no legal recourse.
I guess it all depends on how much you trust a 17- or 18-year-old with six figures of your money.

[Newsdreams]

They could offer him a deal and say it was not contingent on him staying. How could they prove it was?

Like they have found out other violations , eventually word gets around. They investigate and find violations by talking to former players.

[Dawson Rental]

We just bought out a coach and his staff to the tune of 8-10 million.  I don't think our boosters are cheap.
We are top ten in basketball expenses.  I don't think our boosters are cheap.
We just hired a guy away from Texas. I don't think our boosters are cheap.

They just took the guy from Texas because no buyout.

[Newsdreams]

Can we have Dawson do a Scoop welcome video for the website & pay him for it? Let’s start up a collection plate. I Got Five On It.

You mean 5k, right? If people here only knew how wealthy you are.

[Newsdreams]

Can the school offer a player a percentage of sales with their name/number sold at the spirit shop. I imagine quite a few students/alums would purchase MU gear knowing some of it is going to the player.

Hopefully they don't prevent that. To me it would be a no brainer. Would increase sales.

[brewcity77]

None of this contradicts what I've written here.

It's all irrelevant because the contracts won't materialize if the player isn't where the sponsor wants them to be. They'll be one year deals and based on where players play. The very existence of these laws means those clauses are irrelevant.

[Billy Hoyle]

They can't offer him a deal to stay. That is a violation. If they make an offer it cannot be contingent on him staying here.

Schools cannot directly or indirectly arrange deals either.

This will benefit stars, not many others though. It’s social media where kids are going to benefit. Just wait until a MU SA wants to start doing Only Fans and see how MU reacts to that.