Weed Debate in Wisconsin

[Billy Hoyle]

This.

It. Is. Inevitable.

Why not get it over with and start collecting taxes?

My friends live in a town outside of Boulder who "opted out" when weed was legalized in Colorado, meaning they wouldn't permit dispensaries and thus would not take tax revenue. After a year they saw what they were missing out on, realized their massive mistake, and took in over $200k in revenue in the first five months.

In 2020 in Oregon sales were over $1 billion. up from $795 billion the previous year. $150 million in additional tax revenue is the result of that $1 billion. Michigan took in over $450 million in revenue in the first year of marijuana being legalized there; they made $5 million in tax revenue the first three months of legalization, $262 million annually is estimated by the end of the 2022-23 fiscal year. Why wouldn't Wisconsin want that?

As others have stated, the answer to that is the Tavern League.

It's anecdotal, but my dad, a retired physician, is very anti-drug. He drug tested my brother back in HS when a parent accused him of using. Zero tolerance in our home. Well, about a month ago my dad ended up in the hospital due to side effects from medication he is taking for restless leg. It affected his heart but if he didn't take it he couldn't sleep. On my suggestion, he got some THC/CBD gummies....and he's finally sleeping well.

[JWags85]

People fear what they don’t understand.  Many opposed to legal marijuana, that don’t have some moral objection like they would with drinking, stay grounded in remembering the stoner burnout they knew in the 70s or some other empirical example of someone they knew who smoked pot and lacked ambition.  Ignoring that many people they know actively use marijuana, in the same way many have a drink or two, and lead productive, ambitious, and exceptional lives.

Beyond that, the profound tax revenue being seen in many places should make it a no brainer.

[🏀]

rocket with the argument from the unnatural carnal knowledgeing 90s.

Legalize it, tax it. Working great in Illinois.

[HouWarrior]

Sargent Joe Friday explained the marijuana gateway in 1967....

Friday [to a drug dealer who is trying to pass drugs off as similar in effect to alcohol]:

I'll tell you what I know. I know in fact too many kids that begin with pot end up in heroin, then onto LSD. I know if you drink you suffer a loss of judgment if you drink to excess, but I also know that judgment returns when you sober up. I know, and so do you, that when you flip out on an acid trip you never know when you're gonna slip out again. This is now, Bentley, not a couple of years ago. We've had time now to see and study the effects of LSD. People who haven't had a dose in weeks sail out on another trip, they never know when. The minute they've dropped one acid capsule or ingested it in any way, they bought the farm. They've lost the chance to depend on or even restore that most precious of all inner senses, judgment. And in my way of thinking, without judgment you might as well be dead. Your brain is, so why not the rest of you?

Bentley, the drug dealer:

We were talking about marijuana.

Friday:

We still are; marijuana is the flame, heroin is the fuse, LSD is the bomb.

So don't you try to equate liquor with marijuana, mister, not with me. You may sell that jazz to another pothead but not to somebody who spends most of their time holding some sick kid's head while he vomits and retches sitting on a curb stone at four o'clock in the morning. And when his knees get enough starch back in them so he can stand up and empty his pockets, you can bet he'll turn out a stick or two of marijuana. And you can double your money that he'll be holding a sugarcube or a cap or two. So don't you con me with your mind expansion slop, I deal with kids every day. I try to clean up the mess people like you make out of them. I'm the expert here. You're not.

[JWags85]

I know 50+ people who have used marijuana recreationally.  Raging in ages from 20 to 50+.  A number of them you could aptly describe as potheads at some point in their life.  Not a single one has ever dropped LSD much less meandered over to heroin.  I’m gonna shy away from using a fictional character from the 60s to advise on current marijuana debates and reform.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Sargent Joe Friday explained the marijuana gateway in 1967....

Friday [to a drug dealer who is trying to pass drugs off as similar in effect to alcohol]:

I'll tell you what I know. I know in fact too many kids that begin with pot end up in heroin, then onto LSD. I know if you drink you suffer a loss of judgment if you drink to excess, but I also know that judgment returns when you sober up. I know, and so do you, that when you flip out on an acid trip you never know when you're gonna slip out again. This is now, Bentley, not a couple of years ago. We've had time now to see and study the effects of LSD. People who haven't had a dose in weeks sail out on another trip, they never know when. The minute they've dropped one acid capsule or ingested it in any way, they bought the farm. They've lost the chance to depend on or even restore that most precious of all inner senses, judgment. And in my way of thinking, without judgment you might as well be dead. Your brain is, so why not the rest of you?

Bentley, the drug dealer:

We were talking about marijuana.

Friday:

We still are; marijuana is the flame, heroin is the fuse, LSD is the bomb.

So don't you try to equate liquor with marijuana, mister, not with me. You may sell that jazz to another pothead but not to somebody who spends most of their time holding some sick kid's head while he vomits and retches sitting on a curb stone at four o'clock in the morning. And when his knees get enough starch back in them so he can stand up and empty his pockets, you can bet he'll turn out a stick or two of marijuana. And you can double your money that he'll be holding a sugarcube or a cap or two. So don't you con me with your mind expansion slop, I deal with kids every day. I try to clean up the mess people like you make out of them. I'm the expert here. You're not.

Yeah I don't think I'm going to take advice from a fictional character from 54 years ago.

[tower912]

Well, if a fictional character from the 60's said ...... whoa.   I must be trippin', man. 

[Galway Eagle]

I thought he posted that as a joke to show how comical the argument is

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Excuse me while I kiss the sky.

[tower912]

I thought he posted that as a joke to show how comical the argument is

So did I.   Or, he might be lightheaded and a little out of it after finally getting his power and internet back.   

[HouWarrior]

I thought he posted that as a joke to show how comical the argument is

Of COURSE that was intended solely as comical....If you dont easily laugh at the bs of 60's tv and those over the top morality plays...your takin life too seriously.....Fluff; Wags

AND oh BTW, as I guess explaining was required ....this post was Laughable to all....BUT mainly it was a subtle zing at rocket's post that Mjane is a gateway...

he and I heard our parents and Joe Friday say that BS in the 60s ....but I have long since moved on from my parents teaching shortcuts of those days. Ye old gateway argument died with their generation Rocket buddy

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Gotcha houwarrior!

Hope you are heated and watered down there these days.

[StillAWarrior]

How do other states handle drug tests with relation to employment? I work in the manufacturing industry, and I know we do drug tests and worry about people operating machinery. I suppose it is just like making sure someone isn’t drunk at work.

It's much more difficult than determining if someone is drunk at work because when you test for BAC you are testing that person's level at that moment in time. When you test for marijuana, you are essentially testing the person over the past week or so. If someone goes out on Saturday night gets hammered, it's not going to show up in a breath or blood test on Monday. If someone goes out on Saturday night and gets high, it's going to show up on a test on Monday even if he/she is not impaired at all. It really can be a challenge for employers who feel strongly about their drug testing policy.  As it started here with Medical MJ, I've explained it to a lot of clients that it's not unlike an employee who has a totally legit pain killer prescription -- they're going to test positive (although if the employer is "doing it right" they probably won't receive notice of the positive), but as long as they aren't impaired, it's a non-issue. It's all about impairment. Employers are going to have to invest in training their management to recognize impairment and then have to support them when they make decisions. And there's a lot of money to be made if someone could develop a test that could identify current impairment.

On a side note, I've had a number of clients tell me, "if we tested for MJ, we wouldn't be able to operate." And these are in job classifications that I think most people would probably prefer testing.

[jesmu84]

I invite you to share the studies. This topic should be an actual debate on it.

Do these studies show that weed leads to "trying" or sustained consistent use of other drugs? Do they compare against alcohol, caffeine, nicotine, prescription drugs (xanex, nirovam, painkillers, adderall), or even something as simple as sugar?

I only ask because if they're looking at who currently uses an illegal drug then that user has already shown to engage in illicit behavior and would be more likely to engage in other illicit behaviors. If they look at states where it is legal and compare against other legal substances they'd get a more accurate number of what it truly a gateway drug.

Rocket will never answer you.

He'll drop some knowledge bomb and never come back to it.

Mostly because he has only heard talking heads spew biased opinions and hasn't actually done any research.

[jesmu84]

I see 2 problems with marijuana legalization/taxation (much like any other source of new funding/business)

1. As in Illinois, when starting out, it is crony capitalism. It isn't free-market. Those who get sales licenses are those who know someone.

2. Taxes can be fungible in a budget. Sure, a state might say all marijuana tax revenue goes to education. But they don't say that any previous tax revenue that was going to education is being moved to other areas which may result in a net negative toward education funding.

[StillAWarrior]

more and more studies are showing pot to be a gateway drug.

I've gotta admit, I considered starting a masturbation thread just so you could pop in and tell us that more and more studies show that it causes blindness.

[wadesworld]

I've gotta admit, I considered starting a masturbation thread just so you could pop in and tell us that more and more studies show that it causes blindness.

Hey now.  Heise is already obsessed enough with talking about circle jerks without the masturbation thread.  We don't need that.

[Jockey]

Absolutely yes. Making it legal not only brings in tax revenue (although I’m not for heavily taxing it, normal sales taxes are fine) but it does two more important things, to me anyway.

That isn't the way it works though. It will be taxed in the 35%-40% range. Just hit the store in Mundelein last week and the tax was over $40 on a $125 purchase.

[JWags85]

Of COURSE that was intended solely as comical....If you dont easily laugh at the bs of 60's tv and those over the top morality plays...your takin life too seriously.....Fluff; Wags

    Well played. Lets just say I have people I know who still view marijuana usage with that absurd of a lens.  Hell, I dated a girl in her 20s not long ago, who wasn’t at all puritanical or button up otherwise, who told me she could never date someone who used marijuana or similar products regularly cause she was attracted to work ethic and ambition and she knew where that stuff would lead 

[Galway Eagle]

  Well played. Lets just say I have people I know who still view marijuana usage with that absurd of a lens.  Hell, I dated a girl in her 20s not long ago, who wasn’t at all puritanical or button up otherwise, who told me she could never date someone who used marijuana or similar products regularly cause she was attracted to work ethic and ambition and she knew where that stuff would lead 

It is astonishing. One of my best friends is quite the avid user and has issues dating because of his consistent use of a dab pen. This guy who runs his own contracting business, has flipped 2 houses himself, is my business partner for making our whiskey, is a landlord and graduated from MU. But just because of the stigma of weed girls won't give him a second date. Now it's probably also because he's hitting the pen at the table while on said date but that's a different issue.

[DegenerateDish]

If Wisconsin is smart, they would set a tax rate on pot below Illinois rates. It’s ridiculous how high the rates are in Illinois.

[Uncle Rico]

If Wisconsin is smart, they would set a tax rate on pot below Illinois rates. It’s ridiculous how high the rates are in Illinois.

Well, we aren’t smart, so..

[Hards Alumni]

Well, we aren’t smart, so..

But we're cheap as hell, so...

[Johnny B]

more and more studies are showing pot to be a gateway drug.

lets say maybe it is. my question is where is the line drawn between the idea of personal freedom/liberty to use or do somthing and somthing being so unhealthy it needs to be banned?? and why? heart disease will kill drastically more than weed will lead to hard drug ODs. should fast food be banned?? goofy argument. its so random and inconsistant. explain the logic please.

[jesmu84]

If anyone truly values freedom and liberty, then they support legalization of all drugs.

If you're against legalization of all drugs, then you don't actually support freedom in this country.