Hydroxychloroquinine updates (and other potential treatments)

[GooooMarquette]

France hasn't had a great last century or so in the war department...but without them we would probably be singing God Save the Queen.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/fauci-hydroxychloroquine-not-effective-against-142215234.html

And.... hydroxychloroquine takes another hit.   

rocket should be along any time now to poop on "experts".

[Uncle Rico]

rocket should be along any time now to poop on "experts".

This is why treatment plans and tests need to be left to the medical experts and not touted or dismissed by politicians and the media.  Resources, time and energy were wasted because President Pandemic pushed it.  The longer this goes, the madder I get about all his press conferences. 

[TSmith34, Inc.]

This is why treatment plans and tests need to be left to the medical experts and not touted or dismissed by politicians and the media.  Resources, time and energy were wasted because President Pandemic pushed it.  The longer this goes, the madder I get about all his press conferences.

You can draw a straight line from the sketchy French doctor to Dr. "Miracle Cure" Oz to Hannity, Ingraham and the other flying monkeys at Fox to Agent Orange's weird anus shaped mouth. But hey, anyone that said we should maybe see if it actually worked first was shouted down by the Know Nothing chorus.

[tower912]

Easy to take shots.  Really easy.  Like, thank you for making it so easy.    And easy to mock the easily swayed.   But...


The bad news is that one more drug doesn't work.   This isn't something to celebrate.   A bunch of people were caught up in false hope and needlessly used a drug that didn't work and may have even done more harm.  So, crap. 

 Next man (drug) up.   

Give me antibody laced plasma.

[MU82]

Easy to take shots.  Really easy.  Like, thank you for making it so easy.    And easy to mock the easily swayed.   But...


The bad news is that one more drug doesn't work.   This isn't something to celebrate.   A bunch of people were caught up in false hope and needlessly used a drug that didn't work and may have even done more harm.  So, crap. 

 Next man (drug) up.   

Give me antibody laced plasma.

I love your more measured tone and your compassion, tower.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Easy to take shots.  Really easy.  Like, thank you for making it so easy.    And easy to mock the easily swayed.   But...


The bad news is that one more drug doesn't work.   This isn't something to celebrate.   A bunch of people were caught up in false hope and needlessly used a drug that didn't work and may have even done more harm.  So, crap. 

 Next man (drug) up.   

Give me antibody laced plasma.

Who is celebrating it? I am disgusted by the whole charade.

[GooooMarquette]

Give me antibody laced plasma.

At least in the short run, that seems to be the most promising treatment. The key question is whether enough recovered patients volunteer to put a real dent in this thing. Fingers crossed.

[forgetful]

At least in the short run, that seems to be the most promising treatment. The key question is whether enough recovered patients volunteer to put a real dent in this thing. Fingers crossed.

Some news on the antibody front. Rockefeller identifying the most effective antibodies and moving them forward as a treatment.

https://www.rockefeller.edu/news/28079-covid19-antibody-response/

[GooooMarquette]

Some news on the antibody front. Rockefeller identifying the most effective antibodies and moving them forward as a treatment.

https://www.rockefeller.edu/news/28079-covid19-antibody-response/

Sounds promising.

[pacearrow02]

Your friend hydroxy isn’t down and out yet.

https://academic.oup.com/aje/advance-article/doi/10.1093/aje/kwaa093/5847586

[pacearrow02]

Your friend hydroxy isn’t down and out yet.

https://academic.oup.com/aje/advance-article/doi/10.1093/aje/kwaa093/5847586

From the department of chronic disease epidemiology at frickin Yale and published in the American Journal of Epidemiology. But I’m sure somehow they’ve also been corrupted by orange bad man so I should just listen to a bunch of nutty scoopers and move on.  Science has been settled.

[Uncle Rico]

From the department of chronic disease epidemiology at frickin Yale and published in the American Journal of Epidemiology. But I’m sure somehow they’ve also been corrupted by orange bad man so I should just listen to a bunch of nutty scoopers and move on.  Science has been settled.

The science hasn’t been settled.  It likely won’t be for awhile.  It’s a very fluid situation and I’d admire all the men and women working long, hard hours to try and beat this thing.  Their jobs would be a lot easier if the politicians let them work without making statements as fact.

I’d also caution against coming to scoop to get your COVID-19 information.  It’s a discussion spot, not a spot with anyone doing research or publishing reports.  It’s actually a basketball fan site with a section dedicated to the discussion of a worldwide pandemic that has killed over 100,000 in the United States and sickened many more.

[pacearrow02]

The science hasn’t been settled.  It likely won’t be for awhile.  It’s a very fluid situation and I’d admire all the men and women working long, hard hours to try and beat this thing.  Their jobs would be a lot easier if the politicians let them work without making statements as fact.

I’d also caution against coming to scoop to get your COVID-19 information.  It’s a discussion spot, not a spot with anyone doing research or publishing reports.  It’s actually a basketball fan site with a section dedicated to the discussion of a worldwide pandemic that has killed over 100,000 in the United States and sickened many more.

Really??? If only I would have known this months ago, a basketball fan site you say?

And by politicians making statements as facts, I assume you mean those that both have supported the continued look and those that have tried to shut down hydroxy studies. 

[Uncle Rico]

Really??? If only I would have known this months ago, a basketball fan site you say?

And by politicians making statements as facts, I assume you mean those that both have supported the continued look and those that have tried to shut down hydroxy studies.

Yes.  Both sides should support aggressive research on any possible treatments or cures

[pacearrow02]

Yes.  Both sides should support aggressive research on any possible treatments or cures

So when you said yesterday that time, money, and resources were wasted looking into Hydroxy because ORANGE BAD MAN touted the possibility of it working you were just spouting off and now after having a chance to sleep on that hot take you instead have done a complete 180 and support the continued time, money, and resources needed to look into it?  I can’t keep up.

Would love to hear TSmith’s take on this new study cause after being called a no nothing worshipper of the anus shaped mouth President I was really starting to second guess who I might vote for in the fall.

[Uncle Rico]

So when you said yesterday that time, money, and resources were wasted looking into Hydroxy because ORANGE BAD MAN touted the possibility of it working you were just spouting off and now after having a chance to sleep on that hot take you instead have done a complete 180 and support the continued time, money, and resources needed to look into it?  I can’t keep up.

Would love to hear TSmith’s take on this new study cause after being called a no nothing worshipper of the anus shaped mouth President I was really starting to second guess who I might vote for in the fall.

Time, money and resources were wasted.  Hyrdoxy is used for other medical conditions.  People began asking and looking for prescriptions without any knowledge it may work.  The link you provided is a study that says it should be used in high-risk, symptomatic patients.  That doesn’t include Karen in Brookfield who is neither but because President Pandemic kept touting it, she went looking for it

[pacearrow02]

Time, money and resources were wasted.  Hyrdoxy is used for other medical conditions.  People began asking and looking for prescriptions without any knowledge it may work.  The link you provided is a study that says it should be used in high-risk, symptomatic patients.  That doesn’t include Karen in Brookfield who is neither but because President Pandemic kept touting it, she went looking for it

“We have a solution, imperfect, to attempt to deal with the disease. We have to let physicians employing good clinical judgement use it and informed patients choose it. There is a small chance that it may not work. But the urgency demands that we at least start to take that risk and evaluate what happens, and if our situation does not improve we can stop it.”

And if Karen in Brookfield is interested in getting a prescription that she thinks can help her she should meet with her doctor to discuss the pros/cons and potential risks given her health history.  You know like you would do for any other new prescription you would take.

[MU82]

Your friend hydroxy isn’t down and out yet.

https://academic.oup.com/aje/advance-article/doi/10.1093/aje/kwaa093/5847586

You are aware that is simply an online academic "magazine" publishing the opinion of one epidemiologist, right?

It's no different than any of the similar content providers publishing experts' opinion pieces either pro or con HQ or any drug, and it certainly isn't "proof" of anything.

HQ has been studied quite a bit now, and there is absolutely no evidence that it is a "game-changer" -- as your so-called ORANGE BAD MAN kept trying to claim. Scientists are not yet sure the best way to use it regarding this coronavirus, or even if they should use it at all.

But keep trying to "prove" it is wonderful in your desperate attempt to legitimize the scientific chops of President Lysol Injector. I especially liked you immediately following your first post -- which obviously was looking for a fight -- with a second post aimed at stoking even more divisiveness on the issue.

[pacearrow02]

You are aware that is simply an online academic "magazine" publishing the opinion of one epidemiologist, right?

It's no different than any of the similar content providers publishing experts' opinion pieces either pro or con HQ or any drug, and it certainly isn't "proof" of anything.

HQ has been studied quite a bit now, and there is absolutely no evidence that it is a "game-changer" -- as your so-called ORANGE BAD MAN kept trying to claim. Scientists are not yet sure the best way to use it regarding this coronavirus, or even if they should use it at all.

But keep trying to "prove" it is wonderful in your desperate attempt to legitimize the scientific chops of President Lysol Injector. I especially liked you immediately following your first post -- which obviously was looking for a fight -- with a second post aimed at stoking even more divisiveness on the issue.

And you calling him President Pandemic along with 99% of your posts are aimed at bridging the divide right?

And Trumps opinion that this “could” be a game changer falls in line with the thoughts of the epidemiology department at Yale so to try and spin Trump’s encouragement/excitement of the possibility  of it working to help (not cure) as a bad thing is partisan and counterproductive imo.

[Galway Eagle]

And you calling him President Pandemic along with 99% of your posts are aimed at bridging the divide right?

And Trumps opinion that this “could” be a game changer falls in line with the thoughts of the epidemiology department at Yale so to try and spin Trump’s encouragement/excitement of the possibility  of it working to help (not cure) as a bad thing is partisan and counterproductive imo.

One professor = entire epidemiology department?

[Hards Alumni]

So when you said yesterday that time, money, and resources were wasted looking into Hydroxy because ORANGE BAD MAN touted the possibility of it working you were just spouting off and now after having a chance to sleep on that hot take you instead have done a complete 180 and support the continued time, money, and resources needed to look into it?  I can’t keep up.

Would love to hear TSmith’s take on this new study cause after being called a no nothing worshipper of the anus shaped mouth President I was really starting to second guess who I might vote for in the fall.

Yo, who pissed in your cheerios this morning?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

So when you said yesterday that time, money, and resources were wasted looking into Hydroxy because ORANGE BAD MAN touted the possibility of it working you were just spouting off and now after having a chance to sleep on that hot take you instead have done a complete 180 and support the continued time, money, and resources needed to look into it?  I can’t keep up.

Would love to hear TSmith’s take on this new study cause after being called a no nothing worshipper of the anus shaped mouth President I was really starting to second guess who I might vote for in the fall.

I have consistently said it would be great if this (or any other) treatment actually works to save lives, but before touting it as the miracle cure or giving it willy nilly to everyone we should test to see if it actually works. Here is the very first post I made on the subject, which was well after Fox/Trump began touting it:

Let's hope that this drug actually works, it would save a lot of lives.  However, there are a few headscratchers in the account.  First, he talks about great difficulty breathing, but nowhere does it say he was even on a ventilator, so it doesn't sound as if his case was serious enough to require that step.  There is a longer version of this story that I saw where he talks about being on death's door, unable to breathe, but also calling various doctors and specialists personally to get approval for taking the drug.  It just doesn't fully add up.

Best case, I think, is this could help with milder cases or to reduce the effects of COVID-19.  So far, at least, the medical community doesn't think it is a miracle cure though.

But again this was turned into a divisive wedge issue and anyone that said, "hey, shouldn't we test to see if this actually works first?" was pilloried as just wanting to see Trump fail. Rick Bright was fired for resisting efforts to take taxpayer dollars and shovel them to politically connected companies for an unproven drug. The anti-science Know Nothings were going to pour money and resources into this no matter what.

As far as your links, I'll let people with more science backgrounds like Goo and forgetful weigh in. I reiterate, if this or any other drug works, it would be great, but the results to date from other studies and observations have been poor.

As to your description of the Trump, I think "ORANGE" and "BAD" are accurate adjectives, but I'm not sure about "MAN".

P.S. I am under no illusion that anything I or anyone else says will sway your vote. I've been around the interwebs too long to think that is a possibility and seen that verifiable facts don't really have any power of persuasion. I give Trump credit for being absolutely accurate about one thing: he really could shoot somebody on 5th Avenue and not lose a single vote.

[GooooMarquette]

There are frequently dissenting voices in the battle for drug approvals or proposed uses, so the expectation of complete unanimity is futile. The best we can do is go with the overwhelming opinion of the medical community. At this point, that opinion is that the risks of HCQ far outweigh the benefits for COVID.

If that changes, it changes. But it needs to change if and when the data - not the voice of one person - drives the change.

[pacearrow02]

One professor = entire epidemiology department?

Well some have treated one voice in Fauci as the voice of the entire medical community so sure 🤷‍♂️