Senate and WH Agree on Terms of Stimulus Package

[jesmu84]

As a single person, you should be able to make about $150k and get your AGI under the cap.  Double that for married folks.  Perhaps a lot more if you're really sophisticated - which I'm not necessarily...

OT - any further tips you want to pass off here or provide direction to resources that would further explain?

[Jay Bee]

As a single person, you should be able to make about $150k and get your AGI under the cap.  Double that for married folks.  Perhaps a lot more if you're really sophisticated - which I'm not necessarily...

Wouldn't agree that at $150k "you should be able to get under $100k or you're doing it wrong", but helpful to understand you weren't talking about my situation when you said "....or you're doing it wrong"

Anyway, a lot of people care excluded from this welfare — and the cutoff is such that a lot of people who might "need it" are excluded

[rocky_warrior]

Wouldn't agree that at $150k "you should be able to get under $100k or you're doing it wrong", but helpful to understand you weren't talking about my situation when you said "....or you're doing it wrong"

lol, ok.

OT - any further tips you want to pass off here or provide direction to resources that would further explain?

Last I'll say of it here - probably worth a superbar topic, for those smarter than me with other tips.  If you're making that much, obviously take advantage of 401ks, HSA's, and any other "pre tax" deductions you may have access to. 

https://www.thebalance.com/tax-planning-basics-3193487

That's the easy $25k-ish per person.  I'd also argue, that if you make that much, you should be working your way towards investment property.  Just depreciation, insurance and "management" costs offset a lot - all while you're building equity for essentially "free" - cuz renters are generally paying for the place.

https://www.fool.com/millionacres/taxes/real-estate-tax-deductions/how-real-estate-investing-can-reduce-your-tax-bracket/

Alright - I'll save the rest for a superbar topic, where I'm sure others will educate me!

[The Sultan]

still think they should have just issued across the board. What if my income of, say $125k, is commissions based? Yes, should have saved, yada yada yada, but when the economy freezes, that goes to sh!t.

I also don't think they're done issuing things. What I really don't understand is what political benefit Pelosi seeks to extract from purportedly lifting the SALT cap in the next wave.

The salt cap is just so unpopular in high property tax states.

[real chili 83]

I haven't read this thread completely, so sorry if a repeat.

With the fed unemployment benefit of $600 per week, some people will make more gross income on unemployment versus working. 

In MN, the break even point is approximately $70k. At that point you are "better off" working from a gross income perspective.

This will help those who have to pay for benefits out of pocket. I have no idea if that was the intent.

I've had a young single person state they'd volunteer for a layoff   Doing the noble thing?  Or, seeing perceived personal gain? 

I have no idea of this person's real motives.  Does make for some interesting conversation, though.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

I haven't read this thread completely, so sorry if a repeat.

With the fed unemployment benefit of $600 per week, some people will make more gross income on unemployment versus working. 

In MN, the break even point is approximately $70k. At that point you are "better off" working from a gross income perspective.

This will help those who have to pay for benefits out of pocket. I have no idea if that was the intent.

I've had a young single person state they'd volunteer for a layoff   Doing the noble thing?  Or, seeing perceived personal gain? 

I have no idea of this person's real motives.  Does make for some interesting conversation, though.

Chili I think there will be many anecdotes of abuse of this law for personal gain (people and corps and govt). 

However, with the massive stoppage in labor that we are having, as a business person and citizen I actually don't care on the people side.  If my goal is to keep as many people employed or spending (or living) as possible to keep the economy on life support while the virus puts people on life support--all the scenarios above are a win.

PS: if all this is short-lived and we have a labor 'shortage' due to generous government benefits, there is a way to fix that.

[The Sultan]

I haven't read this thread completely, so sorry if a repeat.

With the fed unemployment benefit of $600 per week, some people will make more gross income on unemployment versus working. 

In MN, the break even point is approximately $70k. At that point you are "better off" working from a gross income perspective.

This will help those who have to pay for benefits out of pocket. I have no idea if that was the intent.

I've had a young single person state they'd volunteer for a layoff   Doing the noble thing?  Or, seeing perceived personal gain? 

I have no idea of this person's real motives.  Does make for some interesting conversation, though.

Does it matter what their motives are?  It's three months of enhanced unemployment.

[GB Warrior]

The salt cap is just so unpopular in high property tax states.

Oh I get it, and it's easy for me to say here in WI vs CA/NY/IL/NJ. But if broad relief is Pelosi's goal, this ain't it. Even in high property tax states, claimants of that deduction who were affected by the cap are predominantly not middle class. Lots are, but a lot are not. 

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Oh I get it, and it's easy for me to say here in WI vs CA/NY/IL/NJ. But if broad relief is Pelosi's goal, this ain't it. Even in high property tax states, claimants of that deduction who were affected by the cap are predominantly not middle class. Lots are, but a lot are not.

I am in one of those states and totally agree overall.  The issue is more local though as these govts rely on property tax from the wealthy to fund....the SALT cap has depressed property values and the next reassessment is coming over the next year for many.  Thereby putting pressure on local services (schools, fire, police, etc).

I advocated for what you are saying in the 08/09 downturn (have govt pay % of all mortgage obligations to keep people in their houses) and think its appropriate here too.  Keep the banks running/funded and get as much money to people that will spend it as possible.  Likely the best way to blunt the impact.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Oh I get it, and it's easy for me to say here in WI vs CA/NY/IL/NJ. But if broad relief is Pelosi's goal, this ain't it. Even in high property tax states, claimants of that deduction who were affected by the cap are predominantly not middle class. Lots are, but a lot are not.

I was totally screwed by the SALT cap limitation.  I'm paying more taxes now than previous.  I'm definitely middle class and I disagree about those affected by the cap are predominantly not middle class.  Not true at all.

As someone else said compounding things, I got sales commisions in 2018 that I sure didn't see in 2019.

[Jay Bee]

I was totally screwed by the SALT cap limitation.  I'm paying more taxes now than previous.  I'm definitely middle class and I disagree about those affected by the cap are predominantly not middle class.  Not true at all.

As someone else said compounding things, I got sales commisions in 2018 that I sure didn't see in 2019.

What is middle class? If you make just $100k some on here think you're in an elite class smh

[Hards Alumni]

Wouldn't agree that at $150k "you should be able to get under $100k or you're doing it wrong", but helpful to understand you weren't talking about my situation when you said "....or you're doing it wrong"

Anyway, a lot of people care excluded from this welfare — and the cutoff is such that a lot of people who might "need it" are excluded

care vs are

[Pakuni]

What is middle class? If you make just $100k some on here think you're in an elite class smh

A person who makes $118K is in the top 10 percent.

https://www.investopedia.com/personal-finance/how-much-income-puts-you-top-1-5-10/

[forgetful]

What is middle class? If you make just $100k some on here think you're in an elite class smh

If you make $100k a year, your take-home pay is likely around $70-75k. If you live in San Fran, the average 1-bedroom apartment cost $4k a month. So before you pay for anything besides a roof over your head, you've spent $48k. You have at most $22-27k for every other aspect of your life.

[jesmu84]

I haven't read this thread completely, so sorry if a repeat.

With the fed unemployment benefit of $600 per week, some people will make more gross income on unemployment versus working. 

In MN, the break even point is approximately $70k. At that point you are "better off" working from a gross income perspective.

This will help those who have to pay for benefits out of pocket. I have no idea if that was the intent.

I've had a young single person state they'd volunteer for a layoff   Doing the noble thing?  Or, seeing perceived personal gain? 

I have no idea of this person's real motives.  Does make for some interesting conversation, though.

I *thought* the expanded benefits say that you can only receive 100% of your pay up to 75k. You can't actually go over what you make.

Anyone confirm?

[The Sultan]

Interesting article today how the enhanced unemployment benefits basically green-lighted companies to let go their employees.  In retrospect, it would have been better to just give small businesses (under 300 employees) grants to pay their employees.  Would have cost $500M for three months.

Then companies could have more easily ramped back up as needed versus going through the hassle of applying for benefits, rehiring, etc.

[jesmu84]

Interesting article today how the enhanced unemployment benefits basically green-lighted companies to let go their employees.  In retrospect, it would have been better to just give small businesses (under 300 employees) grants to pay their employees.  Would have cost $500M for three months.

Then companies could have more easily ramped back up as needed versus going through the hassle of applying for benefits, rehiring, etc.

Aren't small businesses offered loans (that become grants) through the stimulus bill?

[The Sultan]

Aren't small businesses offered loans (that become grants) through the stimulus bill?

Right but why take out a loan when you can just lay-off people instead.

[jesmu84]

Right but why take out a loan when you can just lay-off people instead.

Because you care about your employees?

Also, so that when things return to normal you cAn hit the ground running instead of going through a process of hiring to then be at max capacity

[GooooMarquette]

Because you care about your employees?

Also, so that when things return to normal you cAn hit the ground running instead of going through a process of hiring to then be at max capacity

Yep. And you'd have happier, more dedicated employees.

[Pakuni]

Yep. And you'd have happier, more dedicated employees.

And, by some estimates, it costs almost $1,900 for a small business to recruit, hire and train a new employee.

[🏀]

Here they come!

[Lighthouse 84]

Right but why take out a loan when you can just lay-off people instead.

And if you maintain the employees and payroll, the loan turns into a grant. Win-win.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

And, by some estimates, it costs almost $1,900 for a small business to recruit, hire and train a new employee.

That's way low, for most jobs.  $5-10k easy, new hire training, with ramp up time in training.

[rocky_warrior]

Here they come!

That'll help pay for the redtube and pornhub.  Not sure I believe that pic at all.  Especially withe the IRS saying they'll start around Apr 13...