2020 Coaching Carousel

[5DollarPitcher]

The Missouri Valley winner is only a 14-16 seed when it's won by a team that makes a miracle run, like Bradley has the last 2 years. Otherwise teams like UNI, Witchita State, Loyola, and, when they were in it, Creighton are nowhere close to a 14-16 seed.

Wichita State isn't in the MVC.  Didn't read the rest of your comment because there is no credibility.

[nyg]

Is this supposed to be a knock?  He inherited a team that went 9-24 and 3-15 in conference and went to the CIT once in the previous 6 seasons.

The ceiling for Bradley is typically going to be a conference championship and NCAA appearance (which he has done twice now) because the MVC winner is almost always going to be a 14-16 seed.

He also coaches Bradley basketball from Peoria, Illinois in the Missouri Valley Conference.  You need to scale your expectations to that fact.

Not a knock or I would have said so and I don't care where he coached. It's just a fact, he was not won a single post season game. 

[wadesworld]

Wichita State isn't in the MVC.  Didn't read the rest of your comment because there is no credibility.

Wichita State won the MVC in 2014 and 2017. AKA the MVC champion was a 14 seed...if you remove the 4 from that.

Good idea to not read the rest of the comment, because it just disproves everything you said. SAD!

[5DollarPitcher]

Wichita State won the MVC in 2014 and 2017. AKA the MVC champion was a 14 seed...if you remove the 4 from that.

Good idea to not read the rest of the comment, because it just disproves everything you said. SAD!

0 credibility.  So petty and frustrated in all your posts.

[wadesworld]

0 credibility.  So petty and frustrated in all your posts.

Says the guy claiming the MVC winner is always a 14-16 seed. They had a 1 seed within the last 6 years. Lol. But yeah I have 0 credibility.

Don't want petty? Don't be incompetently dumb.

[5DollarPitcher]

Says the guy claiming the MVC winner is always a 14-16 seed. They had a 1 seed within the last 6 years. Lol. But yeah I have 0 credibility.

Don't want petty? Don't be incompetently dumb.

I said "almost always", and I was talking about the current MVC - not a team that left in 2017.  UNI likely won't make the tourney now.  So for two years running, the MVC is going to send a 14-16 seed. 

Loyola had a dominant run-through conference with a team loaded with seniors and the best the committee could muster for them was an 11.

All of this aside, you've again chosen to zero in on a small semantic in my post, rather than addressing the overall spirit of the post.  Because you know you can't actually argue against that.  That's what makes your posts petty, worthless, and a waste of time.

[muguru]

Is this supposed to be a knock?  He inherited a team that went 9-24 and 3-15 in conference and went to the CIT once in the previous 6 seasons.

The ceiling for Bradley is typically going to be a conference championship and NCAA appearance (which he has done twice now) because the MVC winner is almost always going to be a 14-16 seed.

He also coaches Bradley basketball from Peoria, Illinois in the Missouri Valley Conference.  You need to scale your expectations to that fact.

I will never understand so many people's fascination with hiring Wardle. The ONLY reason I can think of that people want him is the stability he would bring...and for some reason people FEAR, like downright fear things getting "blown up". I just don't think he'd have the recruiting chops needed to succeed at MU. That is my #1 requirement for a Coach...I want someone that has been successful at the high major level preferably and is a known fantastic recruiter.

[wadesworld]

I said "almost always", and I was talking about the current MVC - not a team that left in 2017.  UNI likely won't make the tourney now.  So for two years running, the MVC is going to send a 14-16 seed. 

Loyola had a dominant run-through conference with a team loaded with seniors and the best the committee could muster for them was an 11.

All of this aside, you've again chosen to zero in on a small semantic in my post, rather than addressing the overall spirit of the post.  Because you know you can't actually argue against that.  That's what makes your posts petty, worthless, and a waste of time.

Yes, you said almost always. And you're entirely wrong.

From 1999 through last year, the MVC champion (including Wichita State) has been seeded:

10
10
13
12
6
14
10
11
10
5
12
9
14
8
7
1
5
11
10
11
15

For an average of 9.7. 3 times in the last 21 years they've been seeded 14-16. Almost always baby!

Now please excuse me and my 0 credibility.

[5DollarPitcher]

I will never understand so many people's fascination with hiring Wardle. The ONLY reason I can think of that people want him is the stability he would bring...and for some reason people FEAR, like downright fear things getting "blown up". I just don't think he'd have the recruiting chops needed to succeed at MU. That is my #1 requirement for a Coach...I want someone that has been successful at the high major level preferably and is a known fantastic recruiter.

I don't care if we lose the whole recruiting class.  I'd rather burn the whole thing down if it was the quickest path to getting rid of Wojo.  That's how sure I am that there is no success coming from Wojo in the future short of him recruiting Zion, Barret, and Reddish 2.0.  In which case, I could coach the team to an Elite Eight.

I would also rather have a coach than a recruiter.  We don't know if Wardle can recruit at a high level.  But we also don't know that he can't.  He is getting kids to come to Peoria, Illinois.  I think he'll do fine at Marquette (particularly as an alum).

[HutchwasClutch]

I will never understand so many people's fascination with hiring Wardle. The ONLY reason I can think of that people want him is the stability he would bring...and for some reason people FEAR, like downright fear things getting "blown up". I just don't think he'd have the recruiting chops needed to succeed at MU. That is my #1 requirement for a Coach...I want someone that has been successful at the high major level preferably and is a known fantastic recruiter.

Well, fine, that sounds great to me too over Wardle.  And at the risk of mimicking Cheeky,  this would be whom that's successful and ready to drop a high major gig for MU? 

[5DollarPitcher]

Yes, you said almost always. And you're entirely wrong.

From 1999 through last year, the MVC champion (including Wichita State) has been seeded:

10
10
13
12
6
14
10
11
10
5
12
9
14
8
7
1
5
11
10
11
15

For an average of 9.7. 3 times in the last 21 years they've been seeded 14-16. Almost always baby!

Now please excuse me and my 0 credibility.

Did you miss the part about where I said "current MVC members"?  You're constantly so desperate to disprove one little semantic, that won't help the macro-argument that we SHOULD be having, that your posts are literally not worth reading.

[wadesworld]

Did you miss the part about where I said "current MVC members"?  You're constantly so desperate to disprove one little semantic, that won't help the macro-argument that we SHOULD be having, that your posts are literally not worth reading.

"The MVC winner is almost always going to get a 14-16 seed."

Sorry, you're wrong!

[5DollarPitcher]

"The MVC winner is almost always going to get a 14-16 seed."

Sorry, you're wrong!

Now take a step back and ask yourself how you've furthered the overall thesis/discussion of the Wardle topic.  You can't.  Because if you can't be right, at least you can be petty.  Congrats, manes.

[jesmu84]

I will never understand so many people's fascination with hiring Wardle. The ONLY reason I can think of that people want him is the stability he would bring...and for some reason people FEAR, like downright fear things getting "blown up". I just don't think he'd have the recruiting chops needed to succeed at MU. That is my #1 requirement for a Coach...I want someone that has been successful at the high major level preferably and is a known fantastic recruiter.

What do you see as  the list of candidates that would consider MU at this point with your listed criteria?

[muguru]

Well, fine, that sounds great to me too over Wardle.  And at the risk of mimicking Cheeky,  this would be whom that's successful and ready to drop a high major gig for MU?

I'm not bagging on you for this, but this question has ALWAYS irritated me..It's not my/our job to know that. It is however Bill Scholl's job to know that, to do his due diligence, to get a ton of "no's" until you get a yes. Go at it enough times, you will get someone to say yes, I firmly believe that. I think MU's problem in the past has been not really trying for a "splashy" hire. We, the general public have no way of knowing who might be ready to move on from somewhere, why they might be, how appealing the MU job would be to them etc. But, that being said, I'd be willing to bet a large sum of $$ that SOMEONE meeting my criteria would surface if you go thru the process thoroughly enough. The odds say it would. But you never know if you don't even try.

[HutchwasClutch]

I'm not bagging on you for this, but this question has ALWAYS irritated me..It's not my/our job to know that. It is however Bill Scholl's job to know that, to do his due diligence, to get a ton of "no's" until you get a yes. Go at it enough times, you will get someone to say yes, I firmly believe that. I think MU's problem in the past has been not really trying for a "splashy" hire. We, the general public have no way of knowing who might be ready to move on from somewhere, why they might be, how appealing the MU job would be to them etc. But, that being said, I'd be willing to bet a large sum of $$ that SOMEONE meeting my criteria would surface if you go thru the process thoroughly enough. The odds say it would. But you never know if you don't even try.

I agree completely it's job of AD to figure that out. I just think it's a pie in the sky wish for us. 

[wadesworld]

Now take a step back and ask yourself how you've furthered the overall thesis/discussion of the Wardle topic.  You can't.  Because if you can't be right, at least you can be petty.  Congrats, manes.

Can't be right? Sorry, you're the one claiming the MVC winner is "almost always" going to be a 14-16 seed. When the reality is they've averaged a 9.7 seed in the past 21 years and have been a 14-16 seed three times in that period.

Maybe you meant "almost never?" That'd be accurate. But as it stands, you certainly are not the one who is right here...

[5DollarPitcher]

Can't be right? Sorry, you're the one claiming the MVC winner is "almost always" going to be a 14-16 seed. When the reality is they've averaged a 9.7 seed in the past 21 years and have been a 14-16 seed three times in that period.

Maybe you meant "almost never?" That'd be accurate. But as it stands, you certainly are not the one who is right here...

You're doing it again!  You can't help but be as petty as possible.  How about we stop fighting in the sludge and you actually grow up and try to argue the true macro points that people are making.  Unless you feel you can't?

If you disagree with the overall point - state why and stand that ground.  Don't just play back and forth semantics about trivial elements.  It's nauseating with you.  You should change your handle to "PettyWorld".  You're a bottom 5 MUScoop poster right now in terms of advancing conversation, respect, and rationality.

[LAZER]

Consistently?  Moser has been at Loyola for 9 years and had 2 good seasons.

First 5 years at Loyola:
25-63 in conference (2 of those years were in the easier Horizon), 1 CBI berth

Wardle
First 5 years at Bradley:
39-51 in conference, 1 NCAA, 1 pending

Moser had 4 years of program building before Wardle got to Bradley and outside of 2 senior laden seasons, he's been pretty mediocre.  Outside of 17/18 and 18/19, he's .500 in conference, including this year being 13-5.   He was bad at Illinois St too.

I'm not a Wardle to MU fan, but he has an upward trajectory in his career and programs, Moser has a fluky run and a shared conference title in 17 seasons of being a HC.  Thats the difference

I'll still stand by Moser consistently outperforming Wardle in the MVC since Wardle has been there.  And if you're going to discount Moser's F4 run as fluky you should consider Wardle's NCAA appearances as fluky too.

[JWags85]

I'll still stand by Moser consistently outperforming Wardle in the MVC since Wardle has been there.  And if you're going to discount Moser's F4 run as fluky you should consider Wardle's NCAA appearances as fluky too.

Go ahead and die on that hill then champ.

It's fluky cause it's his only appearance in 16 seasons as a HC.  He returned his 2 top scorers, 3 of the top 5, from that team into last year and didn't even sniff the tournament, not even a top 125 team at the end.

Meanwhile, Wardle's has improved each year he's been in Peoria, culminating in a pair of tourney berths. Who did he beat to last year to get there in St Louis? Moser. Upward trajectory isn't fluky. A random bit of success with regression to the mean? That is

[brewcity77]

I'll still stand by Moser consistently outperforming Wardle in the MVC since Wardle has been there.  And if you're going to discount Moser's F4 run as fluky you should consider Wardle's NCAA appearances as fluky too.

Wardle had better teams in his two years before the MVC in a lesser league than Moser did at LUC.

And if we dismiss each coach's best season, that leaves the three best seasons of their combined careers all belonging to Wardle in about half the time as a coach. There's a reason no one with a coherent coaching search has targeted Moser even after the Final 4.

[LAZER]

Wardle had better teams in his two years before the MVC in a lesser league than Moser did at LUC.

And if we dismiss each coach's best season, that leaves the three best seasons of their combined careers all belonging to Wardle in about half the time as a coach. There's a reason no one with a coherent coaching search has targeted Moser even after the Final 4.

Has anyone looked at Wardle? I just think for every reason you'd want to hire Wardle, you can make a better case for Moser.

I can't believe I started a Wardle vs Moser  debate, and don't care to go any further, so I'll agree to disagree.  It's unfortunate we don't have better things to discuss in March.

[JWags85]

Has anyone looked at Wardle? I just think for every reason you'd want to hire Wardle, you can make a better case for Moser.

I can't believe I started a Wardle vs Moser  debate, and don't care to go any further, so I'll agree to disagree.  It's unfortunate we don't have better things to discuss in March.

I bet he gets a look this offseason potentially.  Otherwise he was in the midst of a rebuild of a mediocre program, that doesn't bring eyes.

I'd love to hear that "better case" for Moser outside of "he took a team to the F4" cause everything about his resume just got obliterated in this thread. Cause that sounds like "I stubbornly think you're wrong, here's another vague comment about how I'm right, but I'd rather end the discussion opposed to actually admitting I'm bested" 

[asdfasdf]

I think the last non-D1 coach to jump straight to a high major position was Kim Anderson at Mizzou. It did not end well.

I think Linc darner up at uwgb was a D2 head coach prior to taking the uwgb job.

[LAZER]

I bet he gets a look this offseason potentially.  Otherwise he was in the midst of a rebuild of a mediocre program, that doesn't bring eyes.

I'd love to hear that "better case" for Moser outside of "he took a team to the F4" cause everything about his resume just got obliterated in this thread. Cause that sounds like "I stubbornly think you're wrong, here's another vague comment about how I'm right, but I'd rather end the discussion opposed to actually admitting I'm bested" 

I think Moser's resume is better, you think Wardle's is better (neither are great), so it's a subjective pissing match at this point, why go any further?