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Author Topic: OH for Crying Out Loud  (Read 5740 times)

1SE

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #50 on: January 26, 2020, 10:50:01 AM »
Winning a game in the Tourney isn't too much to ask, hey?

It all comes down to this. What happens in the regular season only matters because it makes it more or less likely to win games in mid-March. We've waited 5 years. This breakthrough needs to happen this year.

Real Warriors Demand Excellence

MU82

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #51 on: January 26, 2020, 12:29:41 PM »
My point is that we need to do something, or nothing likely changes.

"We" -- meaning you and me -- can't do anything.

But sure, again, bringing in a "seasoned coach" would be great.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy than Scoop game threads."

-- Obi-wan Kenobi

mileskishnish72

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #52 on: January 26, 2020, 07:32:40 PM »
I have said for last three years that I would be happy with a run like Xavier had for 15+ years. For the record, that is light years from MU ‘70’s success. Many on here think the Al crew is unrealistic, mainly because our posts are not read completely. I think most of us get the big picture quite well

There is no next Al era ever happening at MU again. 43 years has provided a lot of info to confirm that. I am 100% accepting and fine with that.

To me, as stated a couple of weeks ago, I would like us to be in the chased position and not the chaser. Countless posts of “what if’s” on how we get a better seed or move into fourth place in the BE. That is fine for a period of time, but not year in and year out.

Mock me if you want, but I do think the under 40 crew on here deserves to see a better program. I always stress the eye test and looking at computer analytics after every game is not for me. The program should be doing better on the court, regardless of computer stating our numbers.

I had little confidence going into this season and was focused on upcoming recruiting as a benchmark. That said, I have not seen much great basketball played by MU this season. There are countless posts touting individual play by the role players, which is merited, but seems to me it is always looking for a silver lining. My hope is that solid/good individual performances are the norm for the top 7 or do players, not reason for a four page thread.

I do not think what I am hoping for is unrealistic or based off of entitlement. Simply put, on court performance matters.

Goose, I think that's the best post I've ever seen from you.

lawdog77

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #53 on: January 26, 2020, 07:40:33 PM »
Big fan of MU. I’m not the one who thinks the team is soft, that’s what a number of people here claim, despite the facts showing MU is basically anything but soft.

I am starting to definitely understand why more than one media person thinks MU fans are the worst.
agreed

We R Final Four

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #54 on: January 26, 2020, 07:47:15 PM »
It’s official. Sultan has a whopper of a crush on JB.
Ha....not sure the feeling is mutual however.

Shooter McGavin

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #55 on: January 27, 2020, 12:04:08 AM »
hairy
This how the older guys get in trouble. We actually saw a great program firsthand and remember how it feels. I would challenge every younger fan to remember the Wade FF or Buzz’s run and use that as a pint of reference. It was a helluva lot of fun playing at that level.

For those that think it is a personal thing they are flat out wrong, at least in regards to me. I strongly disliked Crean, but actually cried tears of joy when they beat Kentucky to advance to FF. I thought it would never happen again and I embraced the moment to the fullest.

Winning is awfully fun, and to me, hoping Cain has a big game or Purdue beats Michigan is not fun. That is hoping for Easter Bunny to stop by my house. The program should be doing better than that after six years.

I think all of us want to get back to being a winning program with consistent top 10-25 rankings and occasional final fours but over the last two years, at least, there have been multiple opinions on how to get to that point.

Many thought Wojo should have been fired after year four and many more after year five.  Some of us wanted a longer leash for Wojo (myself included) because we saw steady growth and felt like a coach that stayed for longer than 5 or 6 years was a blueprint to get to where we all want to go especially if the recruiting remained strong.

Don’t dismiss the projos as having no desire to succeed at the highest levels.  We will start dropping like flies if the trend of the program starts going down or simply plateaus (which may already be happening).  But some of us will keep from being overly negative until at least the end of the season.

This season could still finish the way we all want it too with a couple of tournament wins.  Then with the strong class for next year the arrow would still be pointing up just not as steeply as some would like.   Consistency in coaching may get us to the promised land sooner than you might think and then we can all be happy. 

I hope so anyway.  Go MU!

4everwarriors

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #56 on: January 27, 2020, 08:30:01 AM »
I have said for last three years that I would be happy with a run like Xavier had for 15+ years. For the record, that is light years from MU ‘70’s success. Many on here think the Al crew is unrealistic, mainly because our posts are not read completely. I think most of us get the big picture quite well

There is no next Al era ever happening at MU again. 43 years has provided a lot of info to confirm that. I am 100% accepting and fine with that.

To me, as stated a couple of weeks ago, I would like us to be in the chased position and not the chaser. Countless posts of “what if’s” on how we get a better seed or move into fourth place in the BE. That is fine for a period of time, but not year in and year out.

Mock me if you want, but I do think the under 40 crew on here deserves to see a better program. I always stress the eye test and looking at computer analytics after every game is not for me. The program should be doing better on the court, regardless of computer stating our numbers.

I had little confidence going into this season and was focused on upcoming recruiting as a benchmark. That said, I have not seen much great basketball played by MU this season. There are countless posts touting individual play by the role players, which is merited, but seems to me it is always looking for a silver lining. My hope is that solid/good individual performances are the norm for the top 7 or do players, not reason for a four page thread.

I do not think what I am hoping for is unrealistic or based off of entitlement. Simply put, on court performance matters.






Solid and spot on, hey?
"Give 'Em Hell, Al"

Goose

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #57 on: January 27, 2020, 09:05:52 AM »
shooter

Us old Nojo's don't drop like flies. We watch, we comment and try to bring "our" perspective to the conversation. From my perspective, five years without a win in March was a pretty long leash. As I noted in another post, I feel that many of the folks on here are looking for silver linings in every game, lost recruit or a transfer.

If you check my posts I am not always doom and gloom. I threw praise to Howard after St. John's game, I have stated I believe Wojo may end up being a top recruiter and I said John was my player of the game a couple of games ago. My premise in most of my posts in based off experience. I have seen programs slide and have seen them thrive, and currently this one is stuck in quick sand. There are countless of programs stuck in quick sand, but they do not pay their coach $2.2m, have private jet at their access and play in a city with one of the world's most popular basketball players.

I have been told countless times to go follow another program or asked why do I bother to follow MU and the answer is simple, I want to see it get done. Would have (possibly might) been great to see Wojo be the guy to get it done, but unless silver linings are spun there is no real success. This idiot will be following MU ball until I am off the air and hoping for better results. Have said it a million times, if MU brass is happy with the entire package of results I can live with that. If they are not, do something about it. You cannot say you want to have a great program on the court and accept an average program on the court. 

« Last Edit: January 27, 2020, 09:09:19 AM by Goose »

rocket surgeon

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #58 on: January 27, 2020, 11:26:38 AM »
shooter

Us old Nojo's don't drop like flies. We watch, we comment and try to bring "our" perspective to the conversation. From my perspective, five years without a win in March was a pretty long leash. As I noted in another post, I feel that many of the folks on here are looking for silver linings in every game, lost recruit or a transfer.

If you check my posts I am not always doom and gloom. I threw praise to Howard after St. John's game, I have stated I believe Wojo may end up being a top recruiter and I said John was my player of the game a couple of games ago. My premise in most of my posts in based off experience. I have seen programs slide and have seen them thrive, and currently this one is stuck in quick sand. There are countless of programs stuck in quick sand, but they do not pay their coach $2.2m, have private jet at their access and play in a city with one of the world's most popular basketball players.

I have been told countless times to go follow another program or asked why do I bother to follow MU and the answer is simple, I want to see it get done. Would have (possibly might) been great to see Wojo be the guy to get it done, but unless silver linings are spun there is no real success. This idiot will be following MU ball until I am off the air and hoping for better results. Have said it a million times, if MU brass is happy with the entire package of results I can live with that. If they are not, do something about it. You cannot say you want to have a great program on the court and accept an average program on the court.


  reading goose posts are like listening to mr miyagi- sweep'in the scoop leg again goose!   8-) 
i'll take ape tit for $200 alex

rocky_warrior

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #59 on: January 27, 2020, 11:30:47 AM »
I can't wait for Marquette to get a couple NCAA wins this year.  If only to see what the next excuse to fire Wojo is...

#UnleashJayce

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #60 on: January 27, 2020, 11:34:54 AM »
I can't wait for Marquette to get a couple NCAA wins this year.  If only to see what the next excuse to fire Wojo is...

This post will either age very well, or very badly. I need to bookmark it.

dgies9156

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #61 on: January 27, 2020, 12:28:02 PM »
As an old-time Warrior who goes back as far as Brother Goose, I’ve conceded that it is unlikely we will have anything like the Al era. Heck, the talent in college basketball is so disbursed relative to what it was in those days (and better too, candidly), that I question whether 95%-plus of the teams in the NCAA could do what we did, along with UCLA and North Carolina back in the days.

Heck UNC probably won’t make the NCAA this year.

The goal should be to consistently be  among the Top 10 percent of all Division 1 basketball playing universities, which would mean that we consistently are 30th or better. That means that once in awhile, we’ll have an off year and periodically, we’ll be a Top 5 team. While I think we have made progress toward this goal, we’re not there yet.

What I suspect has triggered the ire of most of us is that awful post-tournament poll which ranked us 5th in the nation in April. It was before the Hauser boys left but after the Murray State debacle. We’re comparing this year’s team to that expectation. With the exception of Purdue and Villanova, nothing we have done this year measures up to that level of expectation.

The university has three options. It can ride this horse for another year or two (likely scenario) and see if this incoming class is what we think it will be. Particularly if Mr. Mane comes, expectations for next year may be even higher than this year (erroneously, since the core of next year’s team, absent a grad transfer will be freshmen).

We can adjust and bring a new assistant like, say, Steve Lavin, who is on the beach and could help strategize the game-day preparation. They are out there and may be able to help. Maybe.

The third is to start over. We’d be 12-20 next year, at best, and we won’t reach the Top 10 percent goal for at least three years. We would lose the incomings and probably lose momentum elsewhere unless we went out and hired a very dynamic coach — an Al-like personality. That’s not going to fly in the button down world MU is today.

I expect we’ll ride this horse for another two years. Accept it and move on! Cheer our guys on!




Goose

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #62 on: January 27, 2020, 12:33:06 PM »
rocky

We agree!!! I can't wait for MU to get a couple of wins in the NCAA as well.

rocky_warrior

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #63 on: January 27, 2020, 12:40:42 PM »
We agree!!! I can't wait for MU to get a couple of wins in the NCAA as well.

I think all (well, most) agree that would be a good outcome to the season.

lawdog77

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #64 on: January 27, 2020, 12:45:25 PM »
Would you rather:
End the season on a 10 game win streak, finish Second in the Big East, win a couple in NYC, get a 4 seed, and lose first round. or

Finish 8-10 in the league, get an 11 seed, win the first game, lose the second


Too lazy for or a poll, or its not poll worthy

cheebs09

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #65 on: January 27, 2020, 12:48:34 PM »
Would you rather:
End the season on a 10 game win streak, finish Second in the Big East, win a couple in NYC, get a 4 seed, and lose first round. or

Finish 8-10 in the league, get an 11 seed, win the first game, lose the second


Too lazy for or a poll, or its not poll worthy

The first would make me more confident in Wojo going forward.

If the second option was a Sweet Sixteen, I’d maybe lean that way. I think having some real success in March would do wonders to re-energize the program.

TAMU Garcia

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #66 on: January 27, 2020, 12:52:56 PM »
Would you rather:
End the season on a 10 game win streak, finish Second in the Big East, win a couple in NYC, get a 4 seed, and lose first round. or

Finish 8-10 in the league, get an 11 seed, win the first game, lose the second


Too lazy for or a poll, or its not poll worthy

First one, no question. Honestly I'd take the first one over a Sweet 16 or Elite Eight appearance too.
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

RJax55

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #67 on: January 27, 2020, 01:00:24 PM »
Would you rather:
End the season on a 10 game win streak, finish Second in the Big East, win a couple in NYC, get a 4 seed, and lose first round. or

Finish 8-10 in the league, get an 11 seed, win the first game, lose the second

Too lazy for or a poll, or its not poll worthy

Option A. And, for me, that's an easy call.

I understand and agree with the angst on the lack of tourney wins. However, showing a period of sustained success in conference would give me a great deal more confidence in Wojo moving forward.


Markusquette

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #68 on: January 27, 2020, 01:04:37 PM »
First one, no question. Honestly I'd take the first one over a Sweet 16 or Elite Eight appearance too.

Over an elite 8 run? Really? The tournament is what teams play for. An elite 8 appearance makes MU more relevant than a good conference run and win or two in the conference tournament.

RJax55

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #69 on: January 27, 2020, 01:08:26 PM »
Over an elite 8 run? Really? The tournament is what teams play for. An elite 8 appearance makes MU more relevant than a good conference run and win or two in the conference tournament.

Yeah, that's too far for me. Give me that Elite 8 all day.

brewcity77

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #70 on: January 27, 2020, 01:40:27 PM »
Over an elite 8 run? Really? The tournament is what teams play for. An elite 8 appearance makes MU more relevant than a good conference run and win or two in the conference tournament.

Undeserving Elite 8 (or similar) runs are what convince people bad coaches are good. An undeserved Final 4 convinced everyone Shaka was the wunderkind.

I prefer a consistent winner that can do it all season long. Give me a Tony Bennett over a Shaka Smart any day, but to each their own, I guess.

TAMU Garcia

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #71 on: January 27, 2020, 01:44:10 PM »
Over an elite 8 run? Really? The tournament is what teams play for. An elite 8 appearance makes MU more relevant than a good conference run and win or two in the conference tournament.

Can you name all the elite 8 participants from last season? The season before? The season before that? I can't. I can name all the Final Four participants since I was in high school. Elite Eights are fun when they are happening, but they don't really move the need in my opinion. First round loss and elite eight loss doesn't make much difference to me other than a couple of weeks of fun.
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

~Prayer of the Scooper

RJax55

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #72 on: January 27, 2020, 01:47:06 PM »
Can you name all the elite 8 participants from last season? The season before? The season before that? I can't. I can name all the Final Four participants since I was in high school. Elite Eights are fun when they are happening, but they don't really move the need in my opinion. First round loss and elite eight loss doesn't make much difference to me other than a couple of weeks of fun.

Good point. But, I would take the fun. It's been awhile.

hairy worthen

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #73 on: January 27, 2020, 01:49:40 PM »
Can you name all the elite 8 participants from last season? The season before? The season before that? I can't. I can name all the Final Four participants since I was in high school. Elite Eights are fun when they are happening, but they don't really move the need in my opinion. First round loss and elite eight loss doesn't make much difference to me other than a couple of weeks of fun.
I couldn't even tell you the winner, but maybe that another problem.

4everwarriors

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Re: OH for Crying Out Loud
« Reply #74 on: January 27, 2020, 01:54:12 PM »
rocky

We agree!!! I can't wait for MU to get a couple of wins in the NCAA as well.




Eye might toilet paper Woj's crib if dat happens, hey?
"Give 'Em Hell, Al"

 

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