what kind of result this year gets wojo canned?

[Buffalo Gap]

I would not at all be surprised if we lose more than 50 percent of the remaining games.

Missing the NCAA would spare Wojo the shame of another first round blowout to a mid-major.

[Eldon]

So, what's your projection for Year 7 of this masterpiece rebuild?  Isn't it a guards game?  We lose Markus and Sacar.  You excited about next year?

If Wojo has proven one thing, it is that he's not an alchemist capable of extracting more from a roster, nor has he shown he is a good in-game coach. 

We've had other good recruiting classes under Wojo, yet still no breakthroughs.  At this point, what does the program have to lose by giving Stan Johnson a shot?  He's far more compelling/charismatic than Wojo.  Paul Chryst and Bill Belicheck aside, charisma usually is a helpful attribute in a head coach.

FWIW, I have noticed a few times this season that when a player messes up, throws a fit (Koby), etc., it is Stan who gets in their face, shoving the finger into the player's chest, etc.

[1SE]

It won't happen this year, but if/and when it's time to cut bait on Wojo I would like to see it mid-season and give Stan the interim for the remainder. I don't know if it really worked for UW, but you could at least see his chops and maybe have the option of only a semi-rebuild.

[tower912]

It will take a scandal.

[1SE]

It will take a scandal.

Like how missing the NCAA tournament with a first-team all American would be scandalous?

(I don't think that will happen though)

[#UnleashSean]

Watch what you wish for, especially after one Big East game and 17 to go. 

Wojo has nothing to do with Markus's NBA prospect or draft position.  Markus tested the waters last year and in all likelihood was told he was not guarenteed to be drafted in first round and hinted he should return.  Not one mock draft has him going in the first round and that is all on his height.  The NBA is not meant to be for 5 feet 10 players. Markus will be a G-League guy or a European League player.

MU loses Markus, Anim, Morrow and Johnson next year, even though the latter two have contributed basically nothing but extra fouls and turnovers.  If Koby keeps up his offensive deficiencies, he too may be benched.  The 2020 recruiting class may save Wojo, but if they do win like 4 to 5 games, then the pressure would be on.  If he leaves for any reason, then without the above mentioned players, along with the fact and probability that one or more of the 2020 recruits Garcia, King and Oso would move on, then it would be a dumpster fire.  Would Torrence, or Dexter move on also after a Wojo departure?  All these factors would come into play and a major rebuild, start over will begin. 

MU has played one, one Big East game, so revisit halfway thru the season.

Fear of losing recruits should not be a reason to not fire an incompetent coach.

[mubb3434]

Like how missing the NCAA tournament with a first-team all American would be scandalous?

(I don't think that will happen though)

They would have to miss the tournament first. Do people not realize that we would probably be an 8 seed if the season ended today? We will be in the tournament.

[The Sultan]

Fear of losing recruits should not be a reason to not fire an incompetent coach.

Right.  Because bringing in those recruits and ultimately falling short of expectations is worse.  I mean, look how great it worked out with Henry and Joey!!!

[#UnleashSean]

Right.  Because bringing in those recruits and ultimately falling short of expectations is worse.  I mean, look how great it worked out with Henry and Joey!!!

I'm confused on how this statement comes to the defense of wojo at all.

[BM1090]

Coaches at 4 programs in the current KenPom Top 10 have been at their program less than 4 years:

#3 OSU - Year 3
#4 Louisville - Year 2
#7 Butler - Year 3
#9 Dayton - Year 3

Then you have the these programs with coaches at the helm less time than Wojo:

#13 Michigan  (Year 1)
#21 San Diego State  (3rd year coach)
#26 Houston  (Year 6 like Wojo)  They were ranked 18th and 12th to finish each of two prior years.
#27 Xavier (Year 2)
#28 Wisconsin (Year 5)
#29 Memphis (year 1)
#31 Arkansas (year 1)

All true. Lots of missing info but the information is correct. Many programs that are doing much worse, as well.

The last 4 years we've finished 32/33/53 and are 32 this year. That's a solid program.

The same caliber of team with a few March wins and people would largely be satisfied.

[Elonsmusk]

Not saying there's issues with your whole point but X and WI both were long time assistants at their programs. So there's continuity (also you'd be flipping out if we had UW's record right now).

Then there's Memphis which was cheating and Houston who hired someone who's known for cheating.

Again you make a good point that there's better coaches out there getting it done faster but not all your examples are good ones

Sure...and that's why you give Stan a shot.  Unfortunately Stan has sat next to a guy who is clearly not a great coach - as Gard did with Ryan and Steele did with Mack.  But, elevating Stan would absolutely keep the recruiting class in place.  Give him a 2-3 contract and see what he can do.  No real harm.

[mu_hilltopper]

Scenarios:

* MU wins 2, reaches S16.  Wojo is new hot coach, 90% chance hired away to reset his career clock. 
* MU wins 1.  Wojo is new warm coach, 30% hired away to reset his clock. 

So if you want Wojo to remain at MU, hope for a nice bottom half BE finish, of which the odds are 50/50.

#Arbys

[The Sultan]

I'm confused on how this statement comes to the defense of wojo at all.

It doesn't.  My statement was meant to affirm yours.

[skianth16]

Fear of losing recruits should not be a reason to not fire an incompetent coach.

Bingo. The biggest thing Wojo has had going for him since day has always been the prospects of what might happen in the next year or two. At some point, he needs to deliver.

[BM1090]

Bingo. The biggest thing Wojo has had going for him since day has always been the prospects of what might happen in the next year or two. At some point, he needs to deliver.

Sure. And assuming a tournament berth this year he's delivered decent results 3 out of the past 4 years. Not great, but acceptable.

Last night was infuriating and predictable but we don't have to recycle every year old argument after every loss. Rip on the game plan last night? All for it. But let's wait until the end of the year to determine if we actually suck or if this was just 3% of a full data set.

[WarriorDad]

Sure...and that's why you give Stan a shot.  Unfortunately Stan has sat next to a guy who is clearly not a great coach - as Gard did with Ryan and Steele did with Mack.  But, elevating Stan would absolutely keep the recruiting class in place.  Give him a 2-3 contract and see what he can do.  No real harm.

Isn't Stan part of the current staff, game planning and strategy, scouting and recruiting? 

The harm is pushing a program into uncharted waters for 2 to 3 years by promoting someone from a staff that you already believe is underperforming. 

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

Sure. And assuming a tournament berth this year he's delivered decent results 3 out of the past 4 years. Not great, but acceptable.

Last night was infuriating and predictable but we don't have to recycle every year old argument after every loss. Rip on the game plan last night? All for it. But let's wait until the end of the year to determine if we actually suck or if this was just 3% of a full data set.

Yeah, let's wait another year to see if Wojo's team will compete.  5 years of data isn't enough to get an accurate prediction because there's that chance he will one day magically show up as Coach K.   If you can't see the fact that after 5 years Wojo cannot coach defense then the problem lies within your synapses.

[79Warrior]

Yeah, let's wait another year to see if Wojo's team will compete.  5 years of data isn't enough to get an accurate prediction because there's that chance he will one day magically show up as Coach K.   If you can't see the fact that after 5 years Wojo cannot coach defense then the problem lies within your synapses.

Why don't you let this season play out? 

[BM1090]

Yeah, let's wait another year to see if Wojo's team will compete.  5 years of data isn't enough to get an accurate prediction because there's that chance he will one day magically show up as Coach K.   If you can't see the fact that after 5 years Wojo cannot coach defense then the problem lies within your synapses.

I didn't say anything about another year. Read better before you respond.

We finished top 50 in defense last year and are top 50 in defense this year. 2016-2018 were bad defensive teams.

For comparison, our defensive rankings this year and last are both better than all but one of Buzz's teams (2012).

[cheebs09]

Yeah, let's wait another year to see if Wojo's team will compete.  5 years of data isn't enough to get an accurate prediction because there's that chance he will one day magically show up as Coach K.   If you can't see the fact that after 5 years Wojo cannot coach defense then the problem lies within your synapses.

I think most MU fans are ok if the process is a slow build assuming there is a good payoff. That's why you see the Wright, Coach K, and other examples of coaches that took some time to get going.

To me, the worry is this was supposed to be the year we were building to. However, it looks like we are getting more of the same. Solid team with some flaws that is trending towards a first round exit. Then next year we get the "we're a young team" press conferences. Hopefully we turn it around and I'm just being glass half empty right now.

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

I didn't say anything about another year. Read better before you respond.

We finished top 50 in defense last year and are top 50 in defense this year. 2016-2018 were bad defensive teams.

For comparison, our defensive rankings this year and last are both better than all but one of Buzz's teams (2012).

Buzz's teams would have destroyed any of Wojo's.  Any of Wojo's teams would have been lucky to shoot 35% vs. any of Buzz's sweet 16/Elite 8 teams.  Not to mention your comparison is severely flawed.  Buzz's teams played a tougher schedule in the Big (Big East) Louisville, Pitt, Notre Dame, Syracuse, UConn

[#UnleashSean]

It doesn't.  My statement was meant to affirm yours.

Gotcha. I read it in the wrong tone

[#UnleashSean]

I didn't say anything about another year. Read better before you respond.

We finished top 50 in defense last year and are top 50 in defense this year. 2016-2018 were bad defensive teams.

For comparison, our defensive rankings this year and last are both better than all but one of Buzz's teams (2012).

Those comparisons are dumb. Buzz played a lot more competitive teams then wojo.

[Cheeks]

Buzz's teams would have destroyed any of Wojo's.  Any of Wojo's teams would have been lucky to shoot 35% vs. any of Buzz's sweet 16/Elite 8 teams.  Not to mention your comparison is severely flawed.  Buzz's teams played a tougher schedule in the Big (Big East) Louisville, Pitt, Notre Dame, Syracuse, UConn

Buzz's last team played in the same Big East that Wojo's team plays in.  In fact, that was the second worst Big East conference with a +12.26 rating, good for 5th overall that year.  How did Buzz do again?

Wojo's first year in the Big East the conference had a +14.24 rating, good for 2nd best conference
2nd year, +13.94 and the third best conference
3rd year, +14.54 and the third best conference
4th year, +15.33 and the third best conference
5th year, + 10.46 and the fifth best conference
6th year, +15.49 and the 3rd best conference

We know Buzz only coached in one year of this version of the Big East...and he did not fare well....but I get it, he wasn't really trying.


What others don't realize is that the version of the Big East that Buzz and Crean coached in had some insanely good teams, they also had some really bad teams at times....this current version of the Big East top to bottom had outranked some of those older versions of the Big East.  We tend to remember UConn, Louisville, Syracuse, etc and just totally forget Rutgers, South Florida, etc. 

[BM1090]

Those comparisons are dumb. Buzz played a lot more competitive teams then wojo.

I'm not even sure what this means but the stats I used are adjusted for competition and tempo, so....