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Author Topic: College Football is back  (Read 129110 times)

shoothoops

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #650 on: December 08, 2019, 07:11:47 PM »
I would have tried for Luke Fickell at Cincinnati.  He's a great recruiter who has developed into a solid coach.

Fair enough, but, the challenge is that middle tier SEC or Power 5 programs are having trouble hiring coaches at that level. They are waiting winning, making good money where they are and want the cream of the crop of jobs. An AD with knowledge of the situation said Harsin wants minimum $5 million a year to leave Boise St. for example.

Ole Miss hired the Florida Atlantic Coach. Arkansas hired an Offensive Line Coach at Georgia. etc....

Back to Fickell, Sterk was determined to hire an offensive coach. Fickell was born and raised in Columbus Ohio, played there and spent 15 years as an assistant there. His next stop will likely be a higher profile position than Mizzou. Norvell left Memphis for Florida St. Perhaps Fickell would go to a USC type position in the future. Until then he can be content to wait and pick and choose as long as he has success st UC. The only way otherwise is if someone like Fickell has a personal friendship with someone like Sterk and even then it is reaching a little bit. If Fickell's success slips he will be less picky. If it continues, he will get even more choosy.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2019, 07:15:37 PM by shoothoops »

cheebs09

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #651 on: December 08, 2019, 07:11:52 PM »
I think it was more like OSU took it soft, weren't ready at the start....injured QB.  Wisconsin did the best they could, but are simply outclassed in that matchup.  Just don't send the Badgers out here to Pasadena please.

Who is going to tell him?

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #652 on: December 08, 2019, 07:13:57 PM »
Fair enough, but, the challenge is that middle tier SEC or Power 5 programs are having trouble hiring coaches at that level. They are waiting winning, making good money where they are and want the cream of the crop of jobs. An AD with knowledge of the situation said Harsin wants minimum $5 million a year to leave Boise St. for example.

Ole Miss hired the Florida Atlantic Coach. Arkansas hired an Offensive Line Coach at Georgia. etc....

Back to Fickell, Sterk was determined to hire an offensive coach. Fickell was born and raised in Columbus Ohio, played there and spent 15 years as an assistant there. His next stop will likely be a higher profile position than Mizzou. Norvell left Memphis for Florida St. Perhaps Fickell would go to a USC type position in the future. Until then he can be content to wait and pick and choose as long as he has success.


Don't disagree with any of this.
“True patriotism hates injustice in its own land more than anywhere else.” - Clarence Darrow

shoothoops

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #653 on: December 08, 2019, 07:28:41 PM »

Don't disagree with any of this.

Clearly Sterk wanted Odom out more than having a slam dunk hire in his back pocket. This will decide and define his AD tenure at Mizzou. Rolling the dice.

jsglow

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #654 on: December 08, 2019, 07:31:51 PM »
I think it was more like OSU took it soft, weren't ready at the start....injured QB.  Wisconsin did the best they could, but are simply outclassed in that matchup.  Just don't send the Badgers out here to Pasadena please.

Sorry you're unhappy.  They earned the trip more than PSU.  A good, but not great football team.

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #655 on: December 08, 2019, 07:50:28 PM »
Sorry you're unhappy.  They earned the trip more than PSU.  A good, but not great football team.

Yep.  Relatively similar overall schedules.  Six common opponents.  PSU went 4-2, UW went 5-2.  It came down to UW beating Minnesota.
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GrimmReaper33

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #656 on: December 08, 2019, 08:19:11 PM »
I prefer college football to the NFL, but the lack of parity in the game kind of sucks.  Since the 4 team playoffs have started there have only been 10 programs that have made it.

Just hard for schools to catch up to the bluebloods.  They're each just loaded with 5 stars year after year.

Mr. Nielsen

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #657 on: December 08, 2019, 08:58:21 PM »
Yep.  Relatively similar overall schedules.  Six common opponents.  PSU went 4-2, UW went 5-2.  It came down to UW beating Minnesota.
Also, higher ranked.
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wadesworld

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #658 on: December 08, 2019, 09:14:34 PM »
The infallible Chicos eye test says Penn State > Wisconsin and Clemson is overhyped.
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MU82

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #659 on: December 09, 2019, 06:30:38 AM »
Drinkwitz had a very experienced Defensive Coordinator at Appalachian St St, Ted Roof. Roof was DC for Gus Malzahn for National Champion Auburn  He was with Georgia Tech twice, Minnesota, etc...lots of experience. And the running backs coach at Appalachian St is Garrett Riley, brother of Oklahoma HC Lincoln Riley.

It's  apparently a done deal now, Drinkwitz to Mizzou.

I respect Drinkwitz for being honest about it when asked.

"We're very excited about what we're doing here at App State. But at the same time, with every opportunity, I owe it to my family to see if that's something we're interested in."

That beats the heck out of Lou Holtz saying he wouldn't leave Minnesota and then taking the ND job the next day or Gary Barnett saying "I bleed purple" and then bolting Northwestern for Colorado that same week.
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MU82

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #660 on: December 09, 2019, 06:59:21 AM »
Where would you draw the line, Mike? Should a guy who's assured of being a #1 draft choice by, say game 4 (football) or game 10 (basketball) quit to protect his status? Can't these guys get insurance policies?

Lenny:

Well, one of many Scoopers' favorite ways to revere Saint Al is to remind everybody how he practically pushed Jim Chones out the door only 3/4 of the way through Chones' second season at Marquette. Al told the player to worry about himself, not the team. Although many Scoopers lament Chones' departure as the event that kept the team from winning the national title, they use the situation as yet another way to voice their admiration for Al.

So was it OK for Chones to leave just weeks before the NCAA tournament so he could better himself financially? Or was Saint Al wrong?

If the Stanford coach had no problem with McCaffrey leaving would it have made it "right," and if the coach did have a problem would it have made it "wrong"?

Butt did have an insurance policy, and he cashed in on it. It still only paid him a fraction of what he would have made as a top-50 draft pick. And now that he is hurt, he might never see any of the $$$ he would have made. But that's OK. It was his choice to not skip the exhibition game, and I don't criticize him for it.

Top athletes have finite careers -- especially in the NFL, which chews them up and spits them out and says, "OK, next man up!" College football players aren't even allowed to leave for the NFL until they've been around for 3 years, meaning that Trevor Lawrence has to risk serious injury all next season -- just as Tua did this year.

So to answer your question ... I think it's an extreme example, one that very, very few players would even consider. But yes, if an athlete decided to leave at the point you name, I would support his right to protect his financial future. If Lawrence decides to sit out all next season, or to leave after 4 games, that wouldn't bother me in the least.

We had an athlete faced with that kind of decision just last March -- when Zion Williamson decided to risk injury to try to help Duke play for a national title. I think very few would have begrudged him if he had decided not to return, but he wanted to play. Many commentators said he was foolish to do so, but it was his choice.

Of course, the difference between Zion and McCaffrey is that one was playing for a national title and the other would have been playing in an exhibition football game. Were I a premier football player, it would be a no-brainer decision to skip a non-playoff bowl game. McCaffrey's dad played in the NFL for a decade, and he knew skipping that bowl game was the right thing to do.

Now, if one wants to say that a player leaving early to protect himself should have to forfeit/repay some or all of his scholarship, that's a discussion that might have merit. Still, I don't think many coaches would want to tell a recruit that was a possibility.

Al not only said it was OK for Chones to go; he told Chones to leave. I think Al was right. I think McCaffrey was right, too.
“It’s not how white men fight.” - Tucker Carlson

jsglow

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #661 on: December 09, 2019, 07:55:19 AM »
Lenny:

Well, one of many Scoopers' favorite ways to revere Saint Al is to remind everybody how he practically pushed Jim Chones out the door only 3/4 of the way through Chones' second season at Marquette. Al told the player to worry about himself, not the team. Although many Scoopers lament Chones' departure as the event that kept the team from winning the national title, they use the situation as yet another way to voice their admiration for Al.

So was it OK for Chones to leave just weeks before the NCAA tournament so he could better himself financially? Or was Saint Al wrong?

If the Stanford coach had no problem with McCaffrey leaving would it have made it "right," and if the coach did have a problem would it have made it "wrong"?

Butt did have an insurance policy, and he cashed in on it. It still only paid him a fraction of what he would have made as a top-50 draft pick. And now that he is hurt, he might never see any of the $$$ he would have made. But that's OK. It was his choice to not skip the exhibition game, and I don't criticize him for it.

Top athletes have finite careers -- especially in the NFL, which chews them up and spits them out and says, "OK, next man up!" College football players aren't even allowed to leave for the NFL until they've been around for 3 years, meaning that Trevor Lawrence has to risk serious injury all next season -- just as Tua did this year.

So to answer your question ... I think it's an extreme example, one that very, very few players would even consider. But yes, if an athlete decided to leave at the point you name, I would support his right to protect his financial future. If Lawrence decides to sit out all next season, or to leave after 4 games, that wouldn't bother me in the least.

We had an athlete faced with that kind of decision just last March -- when Zion Williamson decided to risk injury to try to help Duke play for a national title. I think very few would have begrudged him if he had decided not to return, but he wanted to play. Many commentators said he was foolish to do so, but it was his choice.

Of course, the difference between Zion and McCaffrey is that one was playing for a national title and the other would have been playing in an exhibition football game. Were I a premier football player, it would be a no-brainer decision to skip a non-playoff bowl game. McCaffrey's dad played in the NFL for a decade, and he knew skipping that bowl game was the right thing to do.

Now, if one wants to say that a player leaving early to protect himself should have to forfeit/repay some or all of his scholarship, that's a discussion that might have merit. Still, I don't think many coaches would want to tell a recruit that was a possibility.

Al not only said it was OK for Chones to go; he told Chones to leave. I think Al was right. I think McCaffrey was right, too.

82, your comparison to the Chones situation is somewhat misleading and I'm surprised you don't already know it.  Today, athletes are opting out of bowl games etc to avoid the risk of injury.  That absolutely was not the case with Chones.  The vagaries associated with the timing of the ABA draft at the time and the fact that they were paying top dollar meant that Chones would have absolutely sacrificed significant upfront money had he stayed to complete the season, guaranteed.  I'm not going to go refresh my memory on the details but the situational difference is significant.   

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #662 on: December 09, 2019, 07:57:08 AM »
Where would you draw the line, Mike? Should a guy who's assured of being a #1 draft choice by, say game 4 (football) or game 10 (basketball) quit to protect his status? Can't these guys get insurance policies?

It wouldn’t bother me in the least. The downside risk is too great.
“True patriotism hates injustice in its own land more than anywhere else.” - Clarence Darrow

MU82

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #663 on: December 09, 2019, 08:10:10 AM »
82, your comparison to the Chones situation is somewhat misleading and I'm surprised you don't already know it.  Today, athletes are opting out of bowl games etc to avoid the risk of injury.  That absolutely was not the case with Chones.  The vagaries associated with the timing of the ABA draft at the time and the fact that they were paying top dollar meant that Chones would have absolutely sacrificed significant upfront money had he stayed to complete the season, guaranteed.  I'm not going to go refresh my memory on the details but the situational difference is significant.

I know there were differences in the situations.

In each case, however, the athlete left his team before his season was over to ensure his financial future, and I fully support each athlete's decision.

Chones left a team that had a realistic shot at its first-ever national title. McCaffrey (and others like him) are skipping exhibition football games.
“It’s not how white men fight.” - Tucker Carlson

lawdog77

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #664 on: December 09, 2019, 08:47:25 AM »
I know there were differences in the situations.

In each case, however, the athlete left his team before his season was over to ensure his financial future, and I fully support each athlete's decision.

Chones left a team that had a realistic shot at its first-ever national title. McCaffrey (and others like him) are skipping exhibition football games.
agree with you except for the fact that these are not exhibition games, which are warm ups to a season. These are complete money grabs.  But hey, the kids will get a bowl ring.

Uncle Rico

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #665 on: December 09, 2019, 08:48:31 AM »
agree with you except for the fact that these are not exhibition games, which are warm ups to a season. These are complete money grabs.  But hey, the kids will get a bowl ring.

They also get Bowl swag.  And the bowl committee people have a great gig.  It’s one of the greatest rackets in sports.  To be a Bowl chairperson!
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MU82

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #666 on: December 09, 2019, 08:53:35 AM »
agree with you except for the fact that these are not exhibition games, which are warm ups to a season. These are complete money grabs.  But hey, the kids will get a bowl ring.

Fair enough.

Money Grabs it is!

I have no problem with a kid opting to risk injury and play in one. And why should I? It's his life.

But I certainly understand why a big-time pro prospect wouldn't want to play in a Money Grab. And why should anybody else? It's his life.
“It’s not how white men fight.” - Tucker Carlson

Pakuni

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #667 on: December 09, 2019, 09:18:41 AM »
agree with you except for the fact that these are not exhibition games, which are warm ups to a season. These are complete money grabs.  But hey, the kids will get a bowl ring.

All of major college football is a money grab.
I still watch.

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #668 on: December 09, 2019, 09:53:06 AM »
The infallible Chicos eye test says Penn State > Wisconsin and Clemson is overhyped.


To be fair, he very well could be right.  I would guess that if Penn State played UW at a neutral site, PSU would likely win.  But that's not how this works. 
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lawdog77

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #669 on: December 09, 2019, 10:29:04 AM »
All of major college football is a money grab.
I still watch.
not 100%. Some of it is to win championships

Billy Hoyle

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #670 on: December 09, 2019, 03:03:24 PM »
I respect Drinkwitz for being honest about it when asked.

"We're very excited about what we're doing here at App State. But at the same time, with every opportunity, I owe it to my family to see if that's something we're interested in."

That beats the heck out of Lou Holtz saying he wouldn't leave Minnesota and then taking the ND job the next day or Gary Barnett saying "I bleed purple" and then bolting Northwestern for Colorado that same week.

The brother of one of my best friends was Holtz's first recruit to Minnesota. Holtz stood up in the locker room and told the entire team the ND talk was untrue, he would never leave  Minnesota. The next day he was in South Bend being introduced as coach. The brother held a grudge against Holtz until the day he died. A true weasel if there ever was one (not name Buzz Williams, or course).
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Cheeks

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #671 on: December 09, 2019, 05:29:25 PM »
The infallible Chicos eye test says Penn State > Wisconsin and Clemson is overhyped.

If I was Lenny or MU82 I would call you a liar.  But I am not them.

Tell us again what I said in totality about Clemson...please.

As for Penn State...they went to OSU and lost by 11.  Becky went to OSU and got destroyed.  Becky tried again on a neutral field and lost by 13.

Good day.
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wadesworld

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #672 on: December 09, 2019, 05:45:24 PM »
If I was Lenny or MU82 I would call you a liar.  But I am not them.

Tell us again what I said in totality about Clemson...please.

As for Penn State...they went to OSU and lost by 11.  Becky went to OSU and got destroyed.  Becky tried again on a neutral field and lost by 13.

Good day.

Oh, you didn't say Clemson was overhyped?  Hmm.

How'd Penn State do against Minnesota?
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JWags85

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #673 on: December 09, 2019, 06:42:04 PM »
Back to Fickell, Sterk was determined to hire an offensive coach. Fickell was born and raised in Columbus Ohio, played there and spent 15 years as an assistant there. His next stop will likely be a higher profile position than Mizzou. Norvell left Memphis for Florida St. Perhaps Fickell would go to a USC type position in the future. Until then he can be content to wait and pick and choose as long as he has success st UC. The only way otherwise is if someone like Fickell has a personal friendship with someone like Sterk and even then it is reaching a little bit. If Fickell's success slips he will be less picky. If it continues, he will get even more choosy.

FWIW, Mrs Fickell is also a Mrs Shaka situation. Not so much from a professional standpoint, but opinionated and influential all the same. Fickell supposedly got sniffs for years before taking the UC job, but his wife was a Columbus/OSU lifer and loved the prestige and big fish in a little pond socially of Columbus and apparently thought if they just stuck it out, he’d eventually be given OSU. Cincinnati was a concession. So he can be picky due to his pedigree and success, but will also likely be picky for that reason.

MU82

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Re: College Football is back
« Reply #674 on: December 09, 2019, 07:37:25 PM »
If I was Lenny or MU82 I would call you a liar
I wouldn't call wades  a liar because, unlike you, he us not a pathological liar.

So you're a liar for suggesting it!
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