Hong Kong

[BM1090]

Goose

That long, anguished wail you are hearing is the pain of a man who knows he is not fulfilling his promise and destiny.

Some of us break bread at Va Bene then trade thoughts over grappas in Lan Kwai Fong. Others hit the Arby's drive through in Pewaukee for a night of reality TV before bed.

A man lives. A fool exists.

What is the difference between living and existing? Financial success? Learning?Traveling and immersing yourself in other cultures? Developing meaningful, lifelong relationships?

Are there multiple ways to "fulfill your promise and destiny?" When is the exact point that a fool becomes a man? Who defines this?

Apologies if this comes across as condescending but I'm genuinely trying to understand your opinion of what makes someone successful.

[Cheeks]

Sure, as long as their markets were truly free and reflected the actual worth of their labor.
But as we know, that's not often the case.
Most star athletes' wages, for example, are deflated by things like salary caps, financial fair play regulations and luxury taxes.
CEO compensation doesn't often reflect actual value, but often is dictated by easily-reached benchmarks that are controlled by the CEO him/herself.
Actors I would think are the closest thing to being paid by what the market dictates.

All true, but those are the market realities that exist in a market place system.  Everyone cannot be the CEO, when one becomes one they are compensated based on market conditions that other companies are compensating for their companies.

Dak isn’t worth $30 to $40M per year, and I say this as someone who works with him, really likes him, but if someone pays him that....then that is all that matters and I wish him the success he has achieved.  All it takes is a buyer.  Rodgers is a much better QB, so are 5 to 8 other guys.  That’s the way it goes.

I do not think money is the only way to measure success and if I had, would be doing something else.  It can be important without ruling one’s life.  There is also no doubt in my mind the high paid people I do come across are often very elite intellectuals, 4D chess types...I wish them well.  I also believe there are numerous successful people that make $40k a year and are doing great work to drive humanity forward in a different path.

Where I find trouble is the constant bashing of people who do make money.  Making money is not inherently evil or greedy, but way too many position it that way out of envy, or posturing. In some cases it is legitimate, but all to often is what the market will bear.

[Pakuni]

Where I find trouble is the constant bashing of people who do make money.  Making money is not inherently evil or greedy, but way too many position it that way out of envy, or posturing. In some cases it is legitimate, but all to often is what the market will bear.

I don't disagree with this much.
But, on the flip side, I would hope that you understand that a lot of the bashing comes from an understanding that the system (read: market) is rigged in favor of the wealthy, for the purpose of maintaining and expanding their wealth, and this rigging occurs to the detriment of most people outside that sphere.
This doesn't make all wealthy individuals evil. Most are products of the system more than purveyors of it. But so long as this system exists and worsens, as it has significantly over the past 30 years, the bashing will only get worse (and calls for socialistic policies will only grow louder).

[muwarrior69]

I don't disagree with this much.
But, on the flip side, I would hope that you understand that a lot of the bashing comes from an understanding that the system (read: market) is rigged in favor of the wealthy, for the purpose of maintaining and expanding their wealth, and this rigging occurs to the detriment of most people outside that sphere.
This doesn't make all wealthy individuals evil. Most are products of the system more than purveyors of it. But so long as this system exists and worsens, as it has significantly over the past 30 years, the bashing will only get worse (and calls for socialistic policies will only grow louder).

...and the systems in China, Venezuela, and the EU are not rigged? At least here, one can become a 1 percenter if you can find a product or service people want to buy, not  the government dictating the price of what one can sell or buy (healthcare?).

..as long as the communist run China it is not going to end well for Hong Kong.

[Cheeks]

Jams

We have a couple major infrastructure projects in China that have been on hold since April because of the trade tiff. And while we have a lot of capital tied up that is not generating a return we, both US and London, are pleased that there is an effort to address Beijing's unfair trade practices.

China has gotten away with murder for far too long. It's about time we evened the playing field. Frankly, while it is hurting our returns we support the greater principal of fair trade.

Yup, someone had some stones to finally do something.  And it does hurt, but it is hurting both sides which hopefully will bring about change.  Just as the Trade pact with US MX CA should be voted on, but of course it won’t because this is how it things work.

[Cheeks]

I was going to nominate Marilyn Monroe and JFK to the conspiracy thread but t was crap down. 

[Pakuni]

...and the systems in China, Venezuela, and the EU are not rigged? At least here, one can become a 1 percenter if you can find a product or service people want to buy, not  the government dictating the price of what one can sell or buy (healthcare?).

..as long as the communist run China it is not going to end well for Hong Kong.

I hate these kinds of posts.
The fact you can name somewhere that's worse doesn't mean we shouldn't be trying to do better. I mean, China? Venezuela? Way to set a high bar.
Imagine if the Founding Fathers, the abolitionists, MLK or any other leaders of a great American movement took this attitude.

[4everwarriors]

Wheel all neva bee friends, hey?

[withoutbias]

ge = enron?

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

I am loving the Scoopiness of this thread.

[jesmu84]

ge = enron?

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/15/ge-shares-drop-after-madoff-whistleblower-harry-markopolos-raises-red-flags-on-its-accounting.html

[Hards Alumni]

What is the difference between living and existing? Financial success? Learning?Traveling and immersing yourself in other cultures? Developing meaningful, lifelong relationships?

Are there multiple ways to "fulfill your promise and destiny?" When is the exact point that a fool becomes a man? Who defines this?

Apologies if this comes across as condescending but I'm genuinely trying to understand your opinion of what makes someone successful.

You're in the club or you aren't.  That being the old boys club.  Where casual racism isn't addressed, but brushed aside.  Where excuses are made for insults, and "I'm sorry if you were offended" is the mantra.  Where lives are measured on a balance sheet.  And you dont get a seat at the table unless you kiss the ring.  I've never wanted to be in their "club", but hey we cant all aspire to become such admirable blokes.  Just ask each of them, they'll tell you who they know, how much they make, basically, why they're the hotness.  Me, I just sit back and laugh at how pathetic it all sounds.  Trying to convince internet strangers of their importance.

[4everwarriors]

Honest question, Hards. What year did you graduate undergrad from Marquette?

[tower912]

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/15/ge-shares-drop-after-madoff-whistleblower-harry-markopolos-raises-red-flags-on-its-accounting.html

Waiting to see if it has legs or just one big short sell ploy.  Like going after Apple or Disney.

[21Jumpstreet]

You're in the club or you aren't.  That being the old boys club.  Where casual racism isn't addressed, but brushed aside.  Where excuses are made for insults, and "I'm sorry if you were offended" is the mantra.  Where lives are measured on a balance sheet.  And you dont get a seat at the table unless you kiss the ring.  I've never wanted to be in their "club", but hey we cant all aspire to become such admirable blokes.  Just ask each of them, they'll tell you who they know, how much they make, basically, why they're the hotness.  Me, I just sit back and laugh at how pathetic it all sounds.  Trying to convince internet strangers of their importance.

This is kind of the same thing you don’t like/respect, it’s just a different currency. It’s too bad people connected as we all are can’t be genuinely curious in what others think instead of all the bashing.

[forgetful]

Where I find trouble is the constant bashing of people who do make money.  Making money is not inherently evil or greedy, but way too many position it that way out of envy, or posturing. In some cases it is legitimate, but all to often is what the market will bear.

I really don't see this happening. People criticize a system rigged to benefit the wealthy, but they typically are not criticizing the wealthy themselves. There are exceptions, e.g. Martin Shkrelli, but in general people are not bashing the wealth, they are bashing a rigged system.

[forgetful]

The moment this happened was pretty jaw-dropping for me

Agreed, it honestly was sickening.

[Cheeks]

I don't disagree with this much.
But, on the flip side, I would hope that you understand that a lot of the bashing comes from an understanding that the system (read: market) is rigged in favor of the wealthy, for the purpose of maintaining and expanding their wealth, and this rigging occurs to the detriment of most people outside that sphere.
This doesn't make all wealthy individuals evil. Most are products of the system more than purveyors of it. But so long as this system exists and worsens, as it has significantly over the past 30 years, the bashing will only get worse (and calls for socialistic policies will only grow louder).

Yes, it is “rigged” in the sense of you have money it is easier to make more. No question.  If you are tall, good looking...easier to get a job, girls.  If you are a pretty woman, you will buy less drinks.  My sarcasm is there only to show that a lot of things are tilted for all kinds of reasons, some of which are blatantly wrong and some in our subconscious.

The problem as I see it with attacking g the wealthy is they are still going to get theirs. If you penalize them, they will trickle down the pain to everyone else.  They have that ability through commerce, investment decisions, payroll, etc.   I’m not so sure people that blindly hate the well to do realize when they say to kill the rich dude or penalize to the hilt, they don’t realize they are killing the golden goose for their livelihood...or maybe they just don’t care out of spite.

[ATL MU Warrior]

Yes, it is “rigged” in the sense of you have money it is easier to make more. No question.  If you are tall, good looking...easier to get a job, girls.  If you are a pretty woman, you will buy less drinks.  My sarcasm is there only to show that a lot of things are tilted for all kinds of reasons, some of which are blatantly wrong and some in our subconscious.

The problem as I see it with attacking g the wealthy is they are still going to get theirs. If you penalize them, they will trickle down the pain to everyone else.  They have that ability through commerce, investment decisions, payroll, etc.   I’m not so sure people that blindly hate the well to do realize when they say to kill the rich dude or penalize to the hilt, they don’t realize they are killing the golden goose for their livelihood...or maybe they just don’t care out of spite.

That’s not why people say it’s rigged.

[Hards Alumni]

Honest question, Hards. What year did you graduate undergrad from Marquette?

04, love.

Weaponize it as you and no doubt the others see fit.

[Cheeks]

I really don't see this happening. People criticize a system rigged to benefit the wealthy, but they typically are not criticizing the wealthy themselves. There are exceptions, e.g. Martin Shkrelli, but in general people are not bashing the wealth, they are bashing a rigged system.

We will agree to disagree.  When I hear Soak the Rich, kill the rich, F the Rich, screw the rich, that would seem like criticizing.  Or personal attacks because someone donated to the wrong cause or the wrong pol.

[Goose]

Hards

You paint with a very wide brush. I can tell you that I am part of a club of one. I judge each person individually and on their merit. I have enjoyed the company of people from all walks of life and learned a ton along the way. Honestly, I am more comfortable in a corner tap than any with a group of fat cats. I judge people by their heart and their knowledge. Some of the smartest people I have ever met are folks that never made a great deal of money.
The guys you judge on here I have no idea if they are wealthy or not. They have reached out to me in difficult times in my life and have offered help and kindness. I believe there is good in everyone if you look hard enough.

[Cheeks]

The moment this happened was pretty jaw-dropping for me

Most are, except for the ones that scam the system....we’ve had a problem with that out here in So Cal that is unfortunate, but well known to many a local resident and it has caused resentment for people that generally want to like those that do a job that is positive for the community.  As is usually the case, comes down to money and how to game the system.

https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-drop-new-enrollment-20180413-story.html


And this

https://reason.com/2018/05/21/firefighter-earned-300k-in-overtime-by-w/


I grew up in neighborhoods dominated by cops and firemen, so they were like family.  A blast to be around.  I feel bad that they have a bit of an image problem on their hands, but reforms needed because of the bad apples.

[Cheeks]

That’s not why people say it’s rigged.

Please illuminate why you think they do.  I provided what I hear.

[forgetful]

We will agree to disagree.  When I hear Soak the Rich, kill the rich, F the Rich, screw the rich, that would seem like criticizing. 

None of which was said on here.

Or personal attacks because someone donated to the wrong cause or the wrong pol.

Again, none of which was said on here, and your statement can be equally applied to all walks of life and the entire political and economic spectrum.