Here come the judge...

[silverback]

So, six schools about to fall...

I write about sports from time to time, but I don't cover college sports specifically. So, I reached out to my friends who do focus on hoops out there. After talking it over with those insiders, they're predicting USC, Arizona, Auburn, Kansas, OK St, Louisville.

With Creighton, NC St., Oregon and LSU not far behind...

Still, that's just the NCAA self-policing. There are still federal beefs inbound. I've talked to a couple federal prosecutors about another unrelated story, and this case came up along the way. I can tell you this...

1) The feds have no respect or concern for the NCAA. They didn't tell the NCAA they were investigating because they believed the NCAA would tip off the schools to save face.

2) The feds are not done with college sports because it's rife with bribery, racketeering and extortion (all federal crimes). These crimes also occured across state lines, adding complete jurisdiction. So, any local police in, say, Lawrence KS, won't be consulted or be able to protect the Jayhawks, etc.

3) The Feds take their time and don't move until they've got you absolutely dead to rights. My buddy is a federal prosecutor and hasn't set foot in a courtroom for seven years because every suspect pleaded or rolled. He guarantees the first round of indicted coaches rolled on others. Now, the gears will grind slowly.

4) When the feds proceed, they'll have no regard for anything the NCAA already self-imposed. NCAA regs are not federal laws...

5) Whatever schools are next on the fed's list...They will never see it coming.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I will believe it when I see it with both the NCAA and the feds.

The feds seem real intent on prosecuting assistant coaches while leaving the real money and power brokers (head coaches) untouched.

[GooooMarquette]

The feds seem real intent on prosecuting assistant coaches while leaving the real money and power brokers (head coaches) untouched.

They are limited by the facts. Therefore, if they prosecute assistants but don’t touch head coaches, it would be because the documents point to the assistants but not the head coaches.

IMHO, many top people (head coaches, CEOs, etc) who are involved with wrongdoing give general directions (“get this done”), and the underlings do the deed. That way, if prosecutors ever ask if the top guy was involved, they have plausible deniability. “I didn’t tell our CFO to falsify the tax filings, I just said he had to figure out a way to show a profit that quarter.” That might not get him off the hook, but it makes him a tougher target than the guy who signed the returns.

[brewcity77]

I will believe it when I see it with both the NCAA and the feds.

The feds seem real intent on prosecuting assistant coaches while leaving the real money and power brokers (head coaches) untouched.

This has surprised me. Why does SDNY care if people like Sean Miller or Bill Self go down?

[jesmu84]

If a bunch of assistants are getting nailed by the feds, couldn't the NCAA regulate the head coaches with institutional control penalties?

[79Warrior]

This has surprised me. Why does SDNY care if people like Sean Miller or Bill Self go down?

The evidence directly links the assistants. If the Feds had the evidence to prosecute Miller or Self  they would.

[rocket surgeon]

the feds have over a 90% conviction rate.  that can be good and bad.  once they set their sights on something, right or wrong, lives are ruined.  it's the "wrong" part that scares me.  to me, ya can lose for winning

[Cheeks]

At the NACDA convention today the NCAA spokesman for enforcement said schools will receive consequences. 

We shall see

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

At the NACDA convention today the NCAA spokesman for enforcement said schools will receive consequences. 

We shall see

I’m sure they will receive a stern talk and maybe even a finger wag.

[dgies9156]

At the NACDA convention today the NCAA spokesman for enforcement said schools will receive consequences. 

We shall see

Oh, that means when Arizona is formerly acknowledged as cheating, Prescott Community College will get the death penalty.

[Chili]

Oh, that means when Arizona is formerly acknowledged as cheating, Prescott Community College will get the death penalty.

I think you mean Pima County -- but point is spot on

[bilsu]

All that is going to happen is that schools will have to vacate wins, because of using ineligible players. In some cases a loss of scholarships. Nothing big is going to come out of this.

[MU82]

If a bunch of assistants are getting nailed by the feds, couldn't the NCAA regulate the head coaches with institutional control penalties?

You'd think.

But when the NCAA let Roy Williams off with "Gee willakers gosh darn, I didn't even know those young men were takin' pretend classes, by golly" I don't trust the NCAA being able to recognize/enforce what seems like obvious lack of institutional control here.

[Dr. Blackheart]

So if MU gets the Creighton loss back, can we raise the Big East banner?

[Hards Alumni]

This has surprised me. Why does SDNY care if people like Sean Miller or Bill Self go down?

Simple.  Because of the message it would send.

Incapacitation.
Deterrence.
Retribution.
Rehabilitation.
Restoration.

[muguru]

The evidence directly links the assistants. If the Feds had the evidence to prosecute Miller or Self  they would.

They would have had it for Miller, if the judge wouldn't have ruled that he didn't need to testify.

[muguru]

All that is going to happen is that schools will have to vacate wins, because of using ineligible players. In some cases a loss of scholarships. Nothing big is going to come out of this.

Unfortunately, I think you're right..post season bans are the ONLY thing that will really hurt and send a message. Let's see if the NCAA gets tough after this whole thing.

[Cheeks]

You'd think.

But when the NCAA let Roy Williams off with "Gee willakers gosh darn, I didn't even know those young men were takin' pretend classes, by golly" I don't trust the NCAA being able to recognize/enforce what seems like obvious lack of institutional control here.

Ncaa had no jurisdiction in the North Carolina situation, thus they didn’t let Williams off because they couldn’t.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Unfortunately, I think you're right..post season bans are the ONLY thing that will really hurt and send a message. Let's see if the NCAA gets tough after this whole thing.

Scholarship reductions and show causes for the head coach also would work.

[brewcity77]

Simple.  Because of the message it would send.

Incapacitation.
Deterrence.
Retribution.
Rehabilitation.
Restoration.

Letting the biggest offenders and beneficiaries get away with it does the opposite of that. If their cheating continues to be rewarded, then it would encourage rather than deter such behavior.

[The Lens]

Meh.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Ncaa had no jurisdiction in the North Carolina situation, thus they didn’t let Williams off because they couldn’t.

So, Jae Crowder getting admitted to MU and passing the NCAA Clearinghouse with no chance of graduating in four years because of bad JUCO credits is squirmy, but UNC putting athletes in film flam courses can’t be touched because of no jurisdiction? This reminds me how the NCAA effed up the Miami investigation. At some point the governing body is complicit in this racketeering operation.

If sleaze-balls like Self, Pearl, Miller and Wade are still coaching, the NCAA is dead in the public for the sham and scam that they are, and there is enough groundswell for abiding members this time I get the feeling that they will be blown apart if they are two faced this time around. This is a tipping point for this organization.

[Cheeks]

So, Jae Crowder getting admitted to MU and passing the NCAA Clearinghouse with no chance of graduating in four years because of bad JUCO credits is squirmy, but UNC putting athletes in film flam courses can’t be touched because of no jurisdiction? This reminds me how the NCAA effed up the Miami investigation. At some point the governing body is complicit in this racketeering operation.

Sigh

Try again

[MU82]

Ncaa had no jurisdiction in the North Carolina situation, thus they didn’t let Williams off because they couldn’t.

In past years (fairly distant past by now, unfortunately), the NCAA has widely used the "lack of institutional control" umbrella to penalize institutions.

IMHO, the kind of cheating that took place at UNC -- broad, borderline boastful, academic fraud -- is far worse than money getting spread around. Money goes against amateurism, which basically doesn't exist any more in big-time college athletics; academic fraud attacks the very heart of every university's mission.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Sigh

Try again

Other shoe to drop?  Sounds like you support and do business with a shim sham organization?