Way too early 2018-2019 expectations...

[5DollarPitcher]

I made this thread to hopefully get Scoop to put out expectations that, if not met, will result in boarding the fire Wojo train.  I've already said that if the realistic yet challenging expectations I've laid out are met, I will be the first person to happily jump on the Projo bandwagon.

Problem is the "give him more time" camp won't actually set tangible/challenging benchmarks for a 5th year coach which is why we see threads titled "Good Season" after being ousted in the Elite Eight of the g-dang NIT!

[Boozemon Barro]

Lot of room between near the bubble and sweet sixteen.  I don't think we'll be near the bubble, but you may be setting yourself up for disappointment.

We should be ranked basically the entire year and in the hunt for a conference championship. The Big East is losing a ton of great players to graduation and the draft. The expectations should be high. If they aren't, it's an indictment on how bad of a coach you think Wojo actually is.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Expectations with the current players and incoming players next year will be completely different than if we add a player or two who can play immediately next year (which I expect we will)

I don't expect much more out of the team next year without adding a true PG to the roster. We lose a lot with Rowsey graduating but the improvement I expect from our existing guys plus the addition of our incoming/transfer will make up for some/most of that which puts us right where we were this year on the bubble

Hoping fir two transfers, two ball handlers one a trad n one a grad or two grads a wing n a pg.  then imperative we get a top notch incoming PG or another grad PG for 2019-20 season

[Its DJOver]

We should be ranked basically the entire year and in the hunt for a conference championship. The Big East is losing a ton of great players to graduation and the draft. The expectations should be high. If they aren't, it's an indictment on how bad of a coach you think Wojo actually is.

I think expectations will be high, but considering that only two Big East teams finished the regular season ranked, expecting to be ranked the entire year is a bit much to ask.  I'd settle for being ranked, or getting votes from January through March.

Virginia was not ranked to start the year, rankings in November/December mean absolutely nothing.

[tower912]

Who stays, who goes, who comes, who is healthy?     If everything falls in place, 23-24 wins, top 3-4 in the Big East.   5 seed. If Sam doesn't recover, Joey is hobbled, and a couple of unexpected departures, worse.

[Boozemon Barro]

I think expectations will be high, but considering that only two Big East teams finished the regular season ranked, expecting to be ranked the entire year is a bit much to ask.  I'd settle for being ranked, or getting votes from January through March.

Considering what we have coming back and what we add, I think we'll be either ranked or very close to it before the season. Falling out of the rankings would require losing to teams you should beat. That would not be acceptable to me.

Virginia was not ranked to start the year, rankings in November/December mean absolutely nothing.

[Its DJOver]

Barro

I don't know enough about non Big East teams to predict a pre season top 25.  I think if we go 1-1 in NYC, win our Gavitt game and beat uw we'll be somewhere between 20 and others receiving votes, assuming no other slip-ups.  Would love to be wrong I just know that they love putting teams in the pre season top 25 that have big names or did well the previous year.  Both USC and Northwestern were pre season top 25 to start the year. 

[94Warrior]

There's no reason why we can't have a Xavier-type regular season with a grad transfer PG. 

That said -
Top 2 in Big East
Top 20 ranking Dec-March
Top 4 seed in NCAA
Post season tourneys are a crapshoot.
Single digit losses ~ 26-9 record or better.

No more excuses!

[blikemike2]

These threads are sorta dumb, if Markus or Sam get hurt we easily could miss.

For the people posting fire Wojo scenarios I would like to see your replacement and think about how many players would leave.

See Pittsburgh program

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

I expect those with the highest expectations will be the most disappointed.

[Litehouse]

Expectation.  Double digit conference wins, single digit seed, no one and done.

I can agree with this.
Plus beat Wisconsin.

[5DollarPitcher]

These threads are sorta dumb, if Markus or Sam get hurt we easily could miss.

For the people posting fire Wojo scenarios I would like to see your replacement and think about how many players would leave.

See Pittsburgh program

You're right, we should not set any expectations on the chance that all our players get hurt.  Further, we should stick with Coach Fraidy-Cat because hey we're a solid NIT team now - better that than even attempting to find a better coach!

[brewcity77]

21 regular season wins
10+ Big East wins/Top-3 finish
Comfortable NCAA seed (7 or better)
Statistical & visible defensive improvement

[Boozemon Barro]

These threads are sorta dumb, if Markus or Sam get hurt we easily could miss.

For the people posting fire Wojo scenarios I would like to see your replacement and think about how many players would leave.

See Pittsburgh program

If we use Pittsburgh as the standard, then every coach in America should get a lifetime contract. Basketball only has 12 roster spots, so it doesn't have to take that long to turn a program around. I feel like as a fan base we've been more than patient with Wojo. Year 4 and we miss the tourney, and his seat is room temperature at worst.

[Its DJOver]

You're right, we should not set any expectations on the chance that all our players get hurt.  Further, we should stick with Coach Fraidy-Cat because hey we're a solid NIT team now - better that than even attempting to find a better coach!

You seem pretty set in your anti-Wojo thoughts.  That's fine, I'm just wondering who you would bring in instead of Wojo this off-season, and how you would convince them that MU is a good place for them to work when you just fired the previous head coach after his first season to season regression.

[tower912]

Firing a coach who has just come off 20, 19, and 21 win seasons.   Brilliant.

[Boozemon Barro]

Firing a coach who has just come off 20, 19, and 21 win seasons.   Brilliant.

Would you be happy with 20 wins next year?

[5DollarPitcher]

You seem pretty set in your anti-Wojo thoughts.  That's fine, I'm just wondering who you would bring in instead of Wojo this off-season, and how you would convince them that MU is a good place for them to work when you just fired the previous head coach after his first season to season regression.

Dan Hurley, Eric Musselman, and Nate Oats are all coaches that we could have had a chance at if we were being proactive.  All of whom I'm CONVINCED are lightyears better head coaches than Wojo.

As for convincing them to come here?  Salary, arena, Chicago pipeline, salary, attendance, Big East, salary?

This is really not that hard.  I also believe MU could have had a better COACH upon Wojo's original hiring, but his and the athletics department's sole objective at that time was to clean up the program so that we could exist in the Catholic 10 alongside Cooley and Wright.  Because, let's face it, Buzz was could coach a basketball team, but he was going to stick out in the C10 like a pig in Church.

URI, Nevada, and Buff cannot touch us in any of those areas.

[MomofMUltiples]

My expectation is that we bury Bucky at the new Real Chili Basketball Park in front of a sea of red, seeing as all Marquette fans have either given up on this team, won't renew their higher-priced season tickets or will take advantage of Bucky fans' willingness to pay extortion prices to view the beatdown and make up the higher cost of said season tickets.  Only Chick, Glow, Eng, NoRed, Brew and Microbrew will stand out in Blue and Gold.  Brew will cut up one of his fancy Marquette jackets to make Microbrew a tiny Marquette cheerleading outfit.

Everything after that will just be gravy.

[tower912]

Would you be happy with 20 wins next year?

I've already posted my expectations.  Assuming health and no unexpected departures, 23-24 wins.  If recoveries of Sam, Greg, and Joey go poorly or there are unexpected departures, my expectations will adjust accordingly.

[Its DJOver]

Dan Hurley, Eric Musselman, and Nate Oats are all coaches that we could have had a chance at if we were being proactive.  All of whom I'm CONVINCED are lightyears better head coaches than Wojo.

As for convincing them to come here?  Salary, arena, Chicago pipeline, salary, attendance, Big East, salary?

This is really not that hard.  I also believe MU could have had a better COACH upon Wojo's original hiring, but his and the athletics department's sole objective at that time was to clean up the program so that we could exist in the Catholic 10 alongside Cooley and Wright.  Because, let's face it, Buzz was could coach a basketball team, but he was going to stick out in the C10 like a pig in Church.

URI, Nevada, and Buff cannot touch us in any of those areas.

Money only gets you so far.
The MU job become exponentially less desirable if any potential hires know that they will be fired at the first sign of regression.  That is the message that we would be sending if Wojo were to be dismissed.

[5DollarPitcher]

Money only gets you so far.
The MU job become exponentially less desirable if any potential hires know that they will be fired at the first sign of regression.  That is the message that we would be sending if Wojo were to be dismissed.

I think the three I listed are smart enough to recognize Wojo is not that great of a coach.  The Big East coaches give him props in interviews, but I think they like having him around if you know what I mean.

Also, I wouldn't use the word regression more than I'd use the word stagnation.  Looking at this year versus last year, I'd say we basically had the same result - just barely on either side of the bubble.  The year before, we had a lottery pick and couldn't even make the NIT.

Lots of coaches have done lots more with lots less than Wojo has with some pretty decent players.  So far, he has failed to make this team more than the sum of its parts in any of his 4 seasons which, IMO, is a fair judgement of his coaching ability.

[blikemike2]

How are any of those coaches an improvement over Wojo. Did they lose to Villanova 3 times and Xavier twice?

How did those teams do in the rugged Big East?

We started over after Buzz and the cupboard was absolutely dry, we should ditch Wojo because why?

[Boozemon Barro]

I've already posted my expectations.  Assuming health and no unexpected departures, 23-24 wins.  If recoveries of Sam, Greg, and Joey go poorly or there are unexpected departures, my expectations will adjust accordingly.

Ok, but if he wins 20 +/- 1 games for the next 4 years, is he still safe in your eyes, or would you mock anyone that thinks he should go?

[Its DJOver]

I think the three I listed are smart enough to recognize Wojo is not that great of a coach.  The Big East coaches give him props in interviews, but I think they like having him around if you know what I mean.

Also, I wouldn't use the word regression more than I'd use the word stagnation.  Looking at this year versus last year, I'd say we basically had the same result - just barely on either side of the bubble.  The year before, we had a lottery pick and couldn't even make the NIT.

Lots of coaches have done lots more with lots less than Wojo has with some pretty decent players.  So far, he has failed to make this team more than the sum of its parts in any of his 4 seasons which, IMO, is a fair judgement of his coaching ability.

This year vs last year the difference is about an average of two years experience, the year before we did not have a lottery pick, we did however have a very good freshman that knew he was gone at the end of the year and played so that he could stuff his stats to make himself more appealing to NBA scouts, he was also on a 20 win team.