More games at the Al

[GGGG]

Going back to the Arena would be a terrible mistake.  Stay at the new place or build your own.

[jsglow]

Exactly.  The only way MU has any bargaining power with the NYC Bucks is if, or when, MU has an alternative location.  When does UWM's deal with the Arena expire?

2024 with an option for 5 more.

[GGGG]

And no ability to raise enough funds for his vision.

Colleges and universities always plan beyond their immediate ability to secure funding.  It's how you prioritize for your future.  That being said, money and circumstances make those priorities change if they have to.

And they are in the process of hiring a new VP for Advancement.  I wouldn't doubt that this person's primary responsibility is to assess the feasibility of a major fundraising campaign in the near future.

[jsglow]

Colleges and universities always plan beyond their immediate ability to secure funding.  It's how you prioritize for your future.  That being said, money and circumstances make those priorities change if they have to.

And they are in the process of hiring a new VP for Advancement.  I wouldn't doubt that this person's primary responsibility is to assess the feasibility of a major fundraising campaign in the near future.

Done.  I had a nice chat a few weeks back.

[GGGG]

Done.  I had a nice chat a few weeks back.

OK good.  I didn't know where that stood.  Turns out they named her to the position months ago!

https://urbanmilwaukee.com/pressrelease/marquette-names-new-vice-president-for-university-advancement/

[Benny B]

Pro-Thunderdome Counterarguments:

"Waste of Money/Should be Spent Elsewhere" Sentiment (i.e. Ma's Opposition)

This one is simple... the capital is either there, or it's not.

In fundraising there are typically three pools of money you can go after: 1) "earmarked," i.e. the amount that people set aside for a given period that they will donate regardless, 2) "stretch," i.e. the amount in excess of earmarked that people are willing to give for special projects (capital campaigns) or needs (natural disasters), and 3) "shadow," i.e. an indefinite amount that people are willing to donate to a specific project (or very narrow band of potential projects).

Shadow money is typically not even ascertainable.  For example, consider a hypothetical where an MU benefactor named Larcus Memonis is willing to donate $20M to an on-campus arena effort... the second he announces that, if MU has no plans or intent to build an arena, MU Advancement is going to be all over him trying to convince him to spend it on something else.  So Larcus keeps his mouth shut, but as soon as MU announces the plans and shows the Thunderdome renderings, Larcus - and all of his other high$ benefactor brethren - won't be able to write their checks fast enough.

It's a bit of a cat and mouse game, because MU can't plan for an arena without knowing if there's enough backing, and the backers are going to play close to the vest until plans are announced.

"There's No Room"

There's always room.  Have you seen Marquette's campus lately?  It isn't exactly Lincoln Park now, is it?  If MU can come up with the coin to build the Thunderdome's physical structure, MU is going to find the coin for the land.  Google Earth is your friend... be creative.

"The FoxHole/Chaluparena is Right Down the Street"

Yes, but for how long?  No seriously, how long?

Part of being a world class organization means being in control of your own destiny.  The landscape has changed... the confluence of factors that has made MU comfortable simply being a tenant at the BC is gone.  History.  Sayonara.  No longer is MU dealing with a three-way partnership between a philanthropic, locally-focused NBA owner, stadium district and City... you want rights at the FoxHole, meet the gatekeepers: Lasry and Edens.  If anyone needs an example of how that new relationship between the Bucks and MU is going to work out, look no further than their joint-sponsored sports medicine/athletics research center partnership.  Didn't work out as well as we thought, did it.

Point being, MU has no right, no entitlement to the new arena.  Unlike before, the Bucks are now in complete control of any sub-tenancy at the FoxHole... even in the best case scenario where the Bucks prosper and become deeply entrenched into Milwaukee such that Edens and Lasry decide to keep them here, they could find themselves in a situation where they just tell MU to go pound sand.  And the worst case is the Bucks skip town (much more likely), in which case....

"MU Can Negotiate a Better Deal (if the Bucks skip town)"

Does MU really want to be the primary tenant at an NBA facility 20 years from now?  Should they be?  Can they afford to be?

How many suppliers has Wal-Mart put out of business because they drove their prices so low that their suppliers' models became unsustainable?  Likewise, if a tenant takes advantage of a landlord such that the landlord is losing money, the landlord isn't going to be the landlord very long, let alone put money into basic repairs and maintenance.  This is what happened between the Bucks and BC for many years... the Bucks negotiated their rent so low that the WCD couldn't afford to keep up with basic maintenance until the point where walls literally started cracking and critical equipment was failing.  So as a sub-tenant MU could leverage a Bucks departure with the stadium district into better lease terms at the FoxHole, which will turn the building a financial (and perhaps structural) time-bomb, or MU could pay more money to keep the FoxHole sustainable.

If the Bucks leave town in 20 years, MU would be no better off than if Edens and Lasry moved the team to Seattle a couple years back and MU was today stuck with the BC as it falls apart.

"Where's the Money Going to Come From"

Capital comes from donations and bonds.  Maybe some TIF money.  Who knows?  Multiple ways to skin the cat

Operating costs come from elsewhere.  As others surmised... turn this into something more than an arena, and the arena part might just pay for itself.  Simply figure out how to pay for everything else, and you're there.

Let me say that again.... the arena can pay for itself.  Not saying it will pay for itself, but if it can, you build it.

"Will I Get Tickets?  What About STH's?"

I'll be honest... this is the keystone to the whole project.  Not the fundraising, not the Bucks' destiny, not the hotel.... how do you balance supply with demand without alienating any portion of your (relatively) small alumni base.  If you have 10k+ STH's today, you're going to have even more with a brand new on-campus arena.  And it's right around that 10k capacity mark that marginal costs start rising exponentially.  The sweet spot seems to be right around 9k-10k or so... anything more than that and you're going to have to build a second deck, and that's how a $60M arena can rise to $100M very quickly.

So either you build small and deal with the angst, or you wait for demand to wane to the point where nobody will feel bad.  Neither seems like a real good idea.

[4everwarriors]

When looking to the future, think of Xavier's on campus facility and all of its uses as a model to emulate.

[GGGG]

When looking to the future, think of Xavier's on campus facility and all of its uses as a model to emulate.

Yeah I mean that's what it would look like.  And they are only 5 miles from the old Riverfront Coliseum. 

Again, not saying this is even likely, but I don't think the idea should be written off entirely.

[Litehouse]

When looking to the future, think of Xavier's on campus facility and all of its uses as a model to emulate.

See, this just doesn't get me excited.  It would be a disappointment going from the new Bucks Arena to something like the Cintas Center.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

To summarize this thread for this who don't want to read the whole thing:

1) An anonymous female benefactor is donating $100 million to fund our new on campus arena.

2) The Arena will be named "Innovation Alley" and will be located where the rec center currently sits.

3) The new arena will also be home to our resurrected varsity football team.

[THRILLHO]

I seem to remember that during the planning stages of the new Bucks arena there was some discussion of involvement with MU and possible pitching in for some of the price. Now, from my outsider perspective I don't think it was particularly serious or close to happening, but in the contrived "Mystery donor shows up with $100 million and will only spend it on men's college basketball" scenario, wouldn't it be smarter for MU to redirect it to getting a better deal out of an existing state of the art arena rather than building a new smaller one a few blocks away? If it was in the realm of possibility wouldn't it have occurred during the planning phase?

[Anti-Dentite]

See, this just doesn't get me excited.  It would be a disappointment going from the new Bucks Arena to something like the Cintas Center.

Same here, very excited about moving to the new arena both for the amenities and the effect it could have on recruiting, unless at some point the economics make on campus necessary I’m for staying put.

[Goose]

Lazar

I hope that the anonymous female benefactor uses that $100 million to give everyone free tuition. That would be a better long term use of the money.

[Benny B]

Lazar

I hope that the anonymous female benefactor uses that $100 million to give everyone free tuition. That would be a better long term use of the money.

Rhetorical question:  In a world where college football dictates much of the landscape, what is the cost of basketball-only relevance?

Another way to look at it... can MU survive on an academic identity by boosting its reputation in that regard?

[4everwarriors]

Nearly peed myself readin' dis, hey?

[MUfan12]

See, this just doesn't get me excited.  It would be a disappointment going from the new Bucks Arena to something like the Cintas Center.

Same.

[TallTitan34]

I would prefer to play in the new arena as well, but the Cintas Center is damn nice.  I wouldn't mind playing in that.

[Mr. Nielsen]

New Marquette Arena photos
http://www.nba.com/bucks/gallery/milwaukee-tool-construction-site-update-31418

[Eldon]

“As Marquette University enters its second century of basketball, today marks another historic milestone for our community and passionate alumni. They’ll now experience elite-level basketball in one of the most innovative arenas in the world,”
-Michael Lovell

The Bucks have been such great partners throughout this process, and we’re so proud to continue that relationship with today’s agreement. It’s such an exciting time for basketball fans in Milwaukee right now...When the doors open and the lights go on in this building, we believe it will be the best basketball arena in the world. Playing here will be a privilege for our student-athletes, and the experience will be such a thrill for our fans.”

-Bill Scholl

“The construction of the new arena has generated a tremendous amount of excitement within our program and we are thrilled by today’s announcement,”
-Steve Wheresyourhousekey

_____

Thrilled with the announcement of a 7-year deal.  Bucks have been great partners.

[Benny B]

To be sure, I don't think anyone is balking at the idea of playing in a brand new arena, much less MU suckling on that cow as long as we can. 

Those of us who are pro-Thunderdome simply want to be prepared for when that teat runs dry.

[Coleman]

I think we measure up fairly well with schools in our mission and our size

Marquette endowment $550.1M

Creighton  $448.5M
Depaul $492.3M
Xavier $169.4M
Georgetown $1.484B
Villanova $645M
St. John's $647.9M
Seton Hall $242.7M
Providence $213M
Butler $174M

Gonzaga  $181.4M
Temple $513.6M
Loyola Marymount $454M
Loyola Chicago $750M

Really makes you respect what Fr. Garanzini did at LUC. The place was on the brink of closing down when he showed up. It is a different campus now, and their coffers are (relatively) full.

[GOO]

To be sure, I don't think anyone is balking at the idea of playing in a brand new arena, much less MU suckling on that cow as long as we can. 

Those of us who are pro-Thunderdome simply want to be prepared for when that teat runs dry.

Thanks Benny.  Well said.  The board better be doing their due diligence and starting early negotiations with the Bucks on a longer term extension or options to extend.  If it is true that the Bucks wanted to offer us a 3 year lease and ended up at 7, that tells me a lot.  We are not key to them. I wouldn't start a sub shop with a 7 year lease unless there were additional lease options.

We need to be in a situation where it isn't "please treat us well Bucks" or "we will play at the Al..."  That could be a big looser scenario:  (1) The bucks may just say bye, unless you pay X because you have no other option or (2) the Bucks may just say bye or (3) sure at X amount, but don't expect any Saturday games or Sunday afternoon games because we are keeping the dates open for other things and to allow concerts to set up early and take down late... etc...

I hope the Bucks are our long term solution and they probably are... but we better have a real plan B ready to roll, in case they are not...

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I would prefer to play in the new arena as well, but the Cintas Center is damn nice.  I wouldn't mind playing in that.

It's owned by the Cintas Corporation outright and is just located on the Xavier Campus.  I was not aware of the arrangement until my kid toured XU this past fall.

[MU82]

As long as the old MECCA Arena is still standing, we wouldn't be left high and dry if the Bucks told us to "pound sand."

If we're good, we'd pack the Arena while we build our on-campus masterpiece!

I'll be excited to see the new place next season, will definitely do what I can to get to a game or two.

[Pakuni]

So, I haven't read the whole thread, but I read Benny's post, which was excellent, but seems to be leaving out a key point/question ... would yet another arena in downtown (ish) Milwaukee, aka the 39th largest metro market in the U.S., be able to draw enough events to make it financially sustainable?
I'm very skeptical of that. It's notoriously difficult to run an arena at a profit, and unlike a lot of public venues, MU wouldn't have the luxury of government subsidies to fall back on when the arena loses money.

Also, why would the Bucks tell MU to pound sand? It's 20+ guaranteed dates every year. Again, making money off an arena can be hard, and they'd be foolish to turn away that kind of guarantee.