Markus doubtful for SJU

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Folks, there is no silver lining in MH being hurt and missing playing time. I would not be looking for a better D to overshadow the loss of leading scorer. The zone worked on Saturday, but I would not bet the farm it happening again anytime soon. Howard out is a big time loss for the team.

Goose is absolutely correct on this.

[barfolomew]

That's just not true. It's not preferable, but there is a silver lining evidenced solely by what occurred in the second half on Saturday. We absolutely do not win that game if Markus is still playing. And that's NOT a knock on MH - kid is a flat-out stud - but on the coaching staff. We can be a really good NIT team with Markus and Rowsey playing major/overlapping minutes. We just might be dancing if we stagger their PT with some prudent overlap.

I also agree with Goose. Just because Creighton didn't capitalize on the holes in our zone doesn't mean they weren't there. Davion Mintz is not Shamorie Ponds.
We're better defensively when we have more size on the floor, regardless of whether we are in zone or man.

[Its DJOver]

Lets just be careful in assuming that just because zone worked for one half that MU has suddenly unlocked the magic that is going to carry us into the post-season.  As Goose said, teams will adjust.

Other teams will adjust, but I think that it is easier to do in game defensive adjustments with a zone.  After CU got 2 or 3 alley-oops in a row, Matt stayed deeper, and gave up the 15 foot jumper.  CU wasn't able to take advantage of that shot being available, if other teams can, we will either be in trouble, or we will need to make another adjustment.  What impressed me about the zone was our ability to rebound while playing it.  CU isn't a great offensive rebounding team, but it seemed like they never got second chance opportunities in the second half, which was impressive given the way rebounding numbers typically drop in a zone vs mtm.

[Windyplayer]

Lets just be careful in assuming that just because zone worked for one half that MU has suddenly unlocked the magic that is going to carry us into the post-season.  As Goose said, teams will adjust.

Yes. But, I don't think there was a massive drop-off in offense though (yes, I know, just one half). Marquette did score 49 in the second half, 90 total (failed to hit that in the last 9 games).  Point being, Wojo has to unlock the code to maximize potential using that Zone D and which other four look best with either Rowsey or Howard running the point.

[Windyplayer]

Goose is absolutely correct on this.

Then you are just ignoring what happened on Saturday.

[Goose]

Windy

I would not want to bet a NCAA bid on your analysis. But as you stated, my opinion "is not true".

[MU82]

The beautiful thing is that we'll find out Wednesday.

I know that's not as much fun as each of us proclaiming he or she knows exactly what will happen, however.

[skianth16]

Windy

Agree to disagree. One half of zone D does not overshadow a season of being leading scorer. I think you are a bit over jacked for only one half of zone D to judge from. My guess, is that Chris M. might be more prepared for a zone than the idiot at CU.

I don't think I'd go so far as to call McDermott and idiot, but you're right that other coaches will be more prepared for our zone now. And I'm hoping Mack doesn't have to think about it at all. I'd prefer to avoid X in the BET if at all possible.

[wadesworld]

Since Markus scored 52, he has hardly picked up his head when he's had the ball at all.  This was the first game that I remember thinking the ball actually moved well offensively since the game at Providence.  But I did think the ball was moving better even before Markus got injured in this game.  It just happened to continue throughout the entire game, and the defense improved in the second half.

Our defense isn't going to suddenly be good, whether we're in man or zone.  It comes down to whether we can score, and score efficiently, on our opponents.  If we can, we'll win 3 out of 4 or better.  If we can't, we won't.  But to get it done the ball needs to move, and a lot of times Markus can get us 30 but our offense can be worse off for it.

[We R Final Four]

We don't want Rowsey going bonkers.  We want him to play how he did in the second half at Creighton.  He got others involved.

Yes, and even in a very solid 2nd half from AR, there were 2-3 WTF moments.
He is our best distributor—can find Ge JC SA etc. but one thing is for sure that AR will try to get his.

[Goose]

MU82

I have no idea what will happen. But, if, and I see if, our playing a zone D more often would have proven to be successful, like Sat night, than Wojo should be fired on the spot for not playing it more this season. I think Wojo may have been more surprised with the success than anyone on here was Saturday night.

[PGsHeroes32]

I don't think I'd go so far as to call McDermott and idiot, but you're right that other coaches will be more prepared for our zone now. And I'm hoping Mack doesn't have to think about it at all. I'd prefer to avoid X in the BET if at all possible.

But Chris Mullin might figure it out Wednesday

[Windyplayer]

MU82

I have no idea what will happen. But, if, and I see if, our playing a zone D more often would have proven to be successful, like Sat night, than Wojo should be fired on the spot for not playing it more this season. I think Wojo may have been more surprised with the success than anyone on here was Saturday night.

This is kind of my point. The team and Wojo had to do things out of necessity on Saturday and that was the silver lining in losing Howard (hopefully, for a very short period of time). Even if the only silver lining is that we won on Saturday - that's a huge one! Without it, we are all resigned to the NIT (or worse).

[4everwarriors]

All opposin' coaches gotta due is shut down Rowsey and dair the rest of da team ta beet 'em, hey?

[MU82]

I have no idea what will happen. But, if, and I see if, our playing a zone D more often would have proven to be successful, like Sat night, than Wojo should be fired on the spot for not playing it more this season. I think Wojo may have been more surprised with the success than anyone on here was Saturday night.

That's a fair point, Goose. I think Wojo knows exactly how his team plays zone. He tried it several times earlier this season and it was pretty bad. And as TAMU pointed out in another thread, Wojo went to it almost exclusively after it helped us in the 2nd half against Nova last year, and we went 1-4.

So your comment about Wojo himself being surprised with how well his desperation move worked Sat might be spot-on.

[Jay Bee]

Since Markus scored 52, he has hardly picked up his head when he's had the ball at all.  This was the first game that I remember thinking the ball actually moved well offensively since the game at Providence.

But to get it done the ball needs to move, and a lot of times Markus can get us 30 but our offense can be worse off for it.

#FakeNews

Markus' assist rate post the 52p game is higher than from the start of the year through that game

[GGGG]

Yes. But, I don't think there was a massive drop-off in offense though (yes, I know, just one half). Marquette did score 49 in the second half, 90 total (failed to hit that in the last 9 games).  Point being, Wojo has to unlock the code to maximize potential using that Zone D and which other four look best with either Rowsey or Howard running the point.

No there wasn't a massive drop off in offense.  In fact the offense I believe improved.  (Thanks Sacar!)

But my point is that every game is different.  Just because Howard being out "worked" v. Creighton doesn't mean it will work v. St. Johns.

[skianth16]

But Chris Mullin might figure it out Wednesday

Haha, the other Chris M. My bad.

[mu03eng]

That's a fair point, Goose. I think Wojo knows exactly how his team plays zone. He tried it several times earlier this season and it was pretty bad. And as TAMU pointed out in another thread, Wojo went to it almost exclusively after it helped us in the 2nd half against Nova last year, and we went 1-4.

So your comment about Wojo himself being surprised with how well his desperation move worked Sat might be spot-on.

The major difference between this iteration of the zone and previous is that we was very often playing both Rowsey and Howard at the top of the zone. Too easy to get passes to the middle of the zone with those two. With Howard's injury he was forced to get the perimeter taller so a better zone.

Basically to this point Wojo decided that maximizing both Rowsey and Howard minutes is the way to win no matter the cost on defense. Saturday night forced him out of that.

Personally, I'd like to see them go box and 1 with Sacar/Elliot on Ponds all game. Not sure if the team can learn it that quick, but they need to do something different than they did the first match up.

[Its DJOver]

I think the solution to St. John's is to have Theo go head first into their water cooler, making them dehydrated in the second half.  Its one strategy that should work every game and I have yet to see it implemented since Seton Hall the first time.

[PGsHeroes32]

Haha, the other Chris M. My bad.

Ha yeah, pretty easy to just think of Mack on that one

[The Lens]

I think the solution to St. John's is to have Theo go head first into their water cooler, making them dehydrated in the second half.  Its one strategy that should work every game and I have yet to see it implemented since Seton Hall the first time.

Or what about Theo sharing cups with them and giving them all the Flu?

[jsglow]

I think the solution to St. John's is to have Theo go head first into their water cooler, making them dehydrated in the second half.  Its one strategy that should work every game and I have yet to see it implemented since Seton Hall the first time.

+10.  I had forgotten that. Season highlight at home for sure.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Eeekk. Crutches eh?

No walking boot for hip injuries.

[Benny B]

Windy

I would not want to bet a NCAA bid on your analysis. But as you stated, my opinion "is not true".

I think Goose's opinion is reflective of the conventional wisdom.  That doesn't mean it can't be wrong, but the payoff better be pretty damn big to justify a bet against it.

So unless someone knows something everyone else doesn't, I wouldn't necessarily presume a repeat of Saturday, but being the fan of chaos theory that I am, I would certainly understand if this team turned out to be better off without Marcus and Rowsey on the court at the same time.