MLB 2018 Season

[4everwarriors]

CSquared's fook up wuz pullin' Miley wen he did. Looked behind da rong curtain dis tyme, doe, aina?

[MUBurrow]

I wasn’t a fan of Counsell sending Jeffress back out there for a second inning of work after walking in a run with their worst player at the plate. I’m not sure he’s thrown a scoreless inning this entire postseason. There were enough arms still available (Soria, Knebel, Cedeno, even Guerra and Peralta) to get you 6 more outs, especially with the Dodgers having 0 available position players to come off the bench.

But yeah otherwise the Dodgers are simply a good team. You aren’t going to shut them out.

I can see that - tough judgment call. Jeffress was having a little trouble locating, but his stuff had good snap and he was able to locate the fb on the outside corner when he really had to have it. Does that make another inning of him the best option? Hard to say. I think Knebel was going to go no matter what, so it probably boils down to more Jeffress vs Soria.

[GGGG]

I wasn’t a fan of Counsell sending Jeffress back out there for a second inning of work after walking in a run with their worst player at the plate. I’m not sure he’s thrown a scoreless inning this entire postseason. There were enough arms still available (Soria, Knebel, Cedeno, even Guerra and Peralta) to get you 6 more outs, especially with the Dodgers having 0 available position players to come off the bench.

But yeah otherwise the Dodgers are simply a good team. You aren’t going to shut them out.

Yeah agree all around. They can win 2 out of 3 in LA.

[HouWarrior]

Can the Brew Crew take both game 6 and 7 on their home field? That is the question

I am not getting ahead of myself, here. Brewers can steal one back in LA but I do not see them going out there and taking 2 of 3 at Chavez....so...

this series will likely return to Milw and the homefield advantage team Brewers simply need to take care of business in both 6 and 7...totally doable

I look forward to this series....to see who will play my Astros in WS (fingers crossed-lol)

[MU82]

I do not think I would have been able to resist leaving Miley in the game. He was dominant.

Now, I do know that if CC leaves him in and the lead gets blown without the Best Bullpen Ever being deployed, CC would be second-guessed out the wazoo there, too. And there is safety in dancing with the girl who brung ya.

Still, while folks talk all the time about pitch counts for a starter, but they hardly ever talk about the wear and tear on a reliever who gets used day after day after day after day in stressful situations - and the Brewers have several of those.

Here the Brewers had a starter who was in total control of the game; CC could have given more than Hader a break - or at least considered it.

Obviously, just my opinion.

[CTWarrior]

I do not think I would have been able to resist leaving Miley in the game. He was dominant.

That was my thought.  I don't watch the Brewers regularly, but at the time I was thinking "Why are you taking this guy out?  He's cruising!"  Counsell knows his team way better than I do, but I always prefer leaving in a guy who I know has it going well, rather than going to the bullpen for a guy who may or may not have it that day. 

[buckchuckler]

That was my thought.  I don't watch the Brewers regularly, but at the time I was thinking "Why are you taking this guy out?  He's cruising!"  Counsell knows his team way better than I do, but I always prefer leaving in a guy who I know has it going well, rather than going to the bullpen for a guy who may or may not have it that day.

That is the prevailing thought in (playoff -- well mostly anyways) baseball right now.  Get the starter through 4.  Anything else is a bonus.  I don't get it.  I know relievers are more dominant than they have ever been, but outside a couple guys on each team (a couple if they are lucky), most of these guys aren't relief aces, and there is a reason they are not starters.  Maybe the stuff plays up a bit in shorter stints, but still, the starters are for the most part, just simply better pitchers.  I am certainly rooting against bullpenning becoming more of a thing.  I understand the attraction and how it can pay off, but it just isn't as compelling to see Chris Sale (even not vintage Chris Sale) come out after 4 innings, 1 hit and 86 pitches to bring Joe Kelly (who they then tried to stretch for 2 innings which he hasn't done since May) confuses the crap out of my baseball sensibilities. 

[jsglow]

That is the prevailing thought in (playoff -- well mostly anyways) baseball right now.  Get the starter through 4.  Anything else is a bonus.  I don't get it.  I know relievers are more dominant than they have ever been, but outside a couple guys on each team (a couple if they are lucky), most of these guys aren't relief aces, and there is a reason they are not starters.  Maybe the stuff plays up a bit in shorter stints, but still, the starters are for the most part, just simply better pitchers.  I am certainly rooting against bullpenning becoming more of a thing.  I understand the attraction and how it can pay off, but it just isn't as compelling to see Chris Sale (even not vintage Chris Sale) come out after 4 innings, 1 hit and 86 pitches to bring Joe Kelly (who they then tried to stretch for 2 innings which he hasn't done since May) confuses the crap out of my baseball sensibilities.

I'm no expert but the analytics maybe suggest otherwise.  There is clearly a trend in baseball to shorter and shorter starts and mostly avoiding the '3rd time through the order'.  Obviously each situation and pitcher is unique but many teams these days are mostly built with bullpens.  Perhaps it has something to do with 7 year, jillion dollar contracts for those true #1 starters.  The Crew was assembled for defensive position flexibility/substitution while taking advantage of a solid 6 man pen.  Often they save at least 1-2 ABs from their 27 outs compared to others that ask pitchers to hit more.  It got them this far and won the NL Central.  Is it enough?  Time will tell.  But they're doing it with roughly half the payroll of their more superstar laden rivals and maybe the only way they can in MKE.

[MUBurrow]

I was okay with Miley getting pulled when he did, so it would be disingenuous for me to criticize now (regardless of my curiosity of how it would've worked out!) Miley's stuff isn't overpowering, but he was doing a good job keeping LA off balance - primarily with the cutter. CC pulled him after giving up a hit to Taylor, and if Miley gives up an extra base hit to a right-handed Turner on the next AB, CC would've been forced to bring in a cold pitcher in with the tying run on second. Even if he left Miley in and he'd gotten Turner out, there was no way that Miley was going back out for the 7th having thrown 80 pitches to face an all righty order of Freese-Machado-Bellinger.

[ChuckyChip]

I go back to game one and the pitching decisions made in that game that may have caused some of the game two issues.

You have two pitchers on the roster (Guerra and Peralta) who are there only to pitch in blowouts, extra innings, or due to injury.  You're up five runs in the eight inning, which is kind of a blowout.  I wanted to see Guerra come in and try to get the last six outs.  He's been an effective reliver in September.  If it works, you save Cedeno, Jeffress, Soria and Knebel for game two (fresh).  Worst case is Guerra gives up a couple of hits and you bring the big guns in.  As it was, the "big guns" gave up four runs and almost blew the game.  Guerra pitched a scoreless inning in game two.

[buckchuckler]

So, this is just one case obviously, but in the case of Chris Sale (another wild card is how Sale was bafflingly used in relief in Game 5 of the ALDS) and the 3rd time through, teams hit .189/.245/.364 off of Sale for an OPS against of .608.  That is the 3rd time through.  Kelly's numbers are .234/.330/.332.

Now who knows what data the Red Sox have and what they were looking at, but it is no secret their pen isn't good.  It is also odd that they would try to stretch Kelly into a second inning.  It doesn't seem like good planning. 

Miley, was rarely allowed to get to the 3rd time through the order.  In the opportunities he received, he did quite well.  Teams hit .213/.290/.328 off of him the 3rd time he faced them. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

This Buehler kid can pitch.

[buckchuckler]

This Buehler kid can pitch.

Yeah.  No joke.  The Sox taking one of his teammates over him in the draft is a huge miss by the scouting department.  Especially because the guy they did pick can't throw strikes.  Like at all.

Chacin being the ace the Brewers need.  Heck of an outing.

[4everwarriors]

This Buehler kid can pitch.

Nah, dis Knebel kid kan pitch, aina?

[wadesworld]

Brewers should be all hands on deck tomorrow. Everyone in the pen should be available. Hill has dominated the Brewers, but I think they can get to him.

3-0 would look real nice. But 2-1 having faced Kershaw, Ryu, and Buehler is nice.

Get me 2 of the next 4 Crew.

[Benny B]

Brewers should be all hands on deck tomorrow. Everyone in the pen should be available. Hill has dominated the Brewers, but I think they can get to him.

3-0 would look real nice. But 2-1 having faced Kershaw, Ryu, and Buehler is nice.

Get me 2 of the next 4 Crew.

I’ll take 2 of 2.  We get the good result and I don’t have to pa for two more NLCS games. 

[MU82]

Chacin being the ace the Brewers need.  Heck of an outing.

Again, I would have let Chacin finish that inning. Then bring in Knebel to pitch the 7th and 8th ... and I might never need Hader. Then you've got a fresh Hader for the next 2 games.

But congrats to the Crew for hanging on and taking a 2-1 lead. Coulda been 3-0, but 2-1 is still great.

[jsglow]

Again, I would have let Chacin finish that inning. Then bring in Knebel to pitch the 7th and 8th ... and I might never need Hader. Then you've got a fresh Hader for the next 2 games.

But congrats to the Crew for hanging on and taking a 2-1 lead. Coulda been 3-0, but 2-1 is still great.

Hader threw 8 pitches.  He's fine for both these games if the proper situation presents itself.

[CTWarrior]

So, this is just one case obviously, but in the case of Chris Sale (another wild card is how Sale was bafflingly used in relief in Game 5 of the ALDS) and the 3rd time through, teams hit .189/.245/.364 off of Sale for an OPS against of .608.  That is the 3rd time through.  Kelly's numbers are .234/.330/.332.

Now who knows what data the Red Sox have and what they were looking at, but it is no secret their pen isn't good.  It is also odd that they would try to stretch Kelly into a second inning.  It doesn't seem like good planning. 

Miley, was rarely allowed to get to the 3rd time through the order.  In the opportunities he received, he did quite well.  Teams hit .213/.290/.328 off of him the 3rd time he faced them.

Chris Sale is not Chris Sale right now.  He had only allowed one hit, but he was wild, and as it turned out, he was in the hospital with illness the next day.  I was pretty confident he was coming out, though I thought they might try to stretch him another inning.  Kelly is a he has it or he doesn't guy.  When he is bad, he is really bad.  When he pitched well in the first inning, it made sense to keep him out there a second.  He was a starter for many years and can handle the work.  The Sox bullpen has three solid guys, Brasier, Barnes and Kimbrel.  Getting through the sixth meant they probably wouldn't have to go to the weaker part of the bullpen, which they surprisingly did in the ninth and it cost them a chance in the bottom of the ninth.

[mu_hilltopper]

Anyone else voting to not let Jeffress pick up his 3rd blown save this month?

[jsglow]

Anyone else voting to not let Jeffress pick up his 3rd blown save this month?

Absolutely not.  The Crew is 2 games away from the pennant and 6 games away from the WS Championship.  You dance with the date you brung.  They ain't doing it without him.  I absolutely LOVED Cous' approach last night.  We're 25 strong.  That's how we roll. (But I'm sure glad it wasn't a 1 run lead!)

[GGGG]

Again, I would have let Chacin finish that inning. Then bring in Knebel to pitch the 7th and 8th ... and I might never need Hader. Then you've got a fresh Hader for the next 2 games.

But congrats to the Crew for hanging on and taking a 2-1 lead. Coulda been 3-0, but 2-1 is still great.

This is how the Brewers have won all year.  No need to change that up now.

[Its DJOver]

Absolutely not.  The Crew is 2 games away from the pennant and 6 games away from the WS Championship.  You dance with the date you brung.  They ain't doing it without him.  I absolutely LOVED Cous' approach last night.  We're 25 strong.  That's how we roll. (But I'm sure glad it wasn't a 1 run lead!)

JJ will still log innings, but I wouldn't be opposed to sliding Knebel back to closer, especially if you know you're only going to get 1 ip out of him anyways.  Much better stuff right now, and certainly has experience closing.

[GB Warrior]

JJ will still log innings, but I wouldn't be opposed to sliding Knebel back to closer, especially if you know you're only going to get 1 ip out of him anyways.  Much better stuff right now, and certainly has experience closing.

This I think is right. I'm actually fine with using Jeffress in the 9th - just not against the Dodgers best hitters. If the batters for Knebel and Jeffress were switched, I'd have felt better

[GGGG]

They brought Knebel in during a much higher leverage situation - runner on second with one out and up 2-0.  Jeffress was brought in 4-0 at the beginning of the 9th.