MLB 2018 Season

[SaveOD238]

We are seeing some historically bad seasons this year with quite a few teams opting for a complete rebuild (potentially 5 100 loss teams).  Would that be the case if there were an expanded playoff format in place?  It's true that in the NBA with expanded playoff its easy to get stuck between complete rebuild and legit contender (bucks for the last two years).  However would not be the case in baseball.  In 2011 the team that had the worst record among playoff teams won the World Series, in 2014 neither World Series team had 90 regular season wins.  If teams knew that they could make the playoffs with 80-85 wins there would be less tanking because once you're there, anyone can win, which is not the case in the NBA.  Sure some teams would still pull a 76ers, but you would see more competitive and more meaningful baseball from more teams, which should equal more money.

This.  The reason why teams like the Orioles, Royals, and White Sox made the choice to tank this year was because they knew that even if they spent some offseason money, they couldn’t keep pace with the Red Sox, Yankees, Astros, and Indians.  The mass of tanking and non competitive teams decreased free agent spending (just ask Mike Moustakas) and made fans complacent.  You want more excitement and more revenue...increase the size of the playoffs.  Teams with an outside shot will actually try and their fans won’t see the writing on the wall in April.  Owners will make more money from gate receipts (and more tv eyeballs) while players will make more money in free agency.  This seems like a collective bargaining win-win.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

More playoff teams means more rounds of playoffs.  Unless they are going to play into December, that means fewer regular season games, and I don't see owners willing to give up those games.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

More playoff teams means more rounds of playoffs.  Unless they are going to play into December, that means fewer regular season games, and I don't see owners willing to give up those games.

How much revenue is the Tigers/Twins game today bringing into Tigers management?  Or Blue Jays/O's?  Or any of the other games between 2 dog teams in September (or August, or July, or June, etc. this year)

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

How much revenue is the Tigers/Twins game today bringing into Tigers management?  Or Blue Jays/O's?  Or any of the other games between 2 dog teams in September (or August, or July, or June, etc. this year)

I'd venture a guess it's much more than you think when you take concession sales into consideration. I have zero numbers to back this up but I have to imagine concession numbers at baseball games blow away any of the other major sports.

[GGGG]

I really don't think concessions net revenue brings all that much to the bottom line.

That being said, since the player contracts are a fixed cost, from the owner's perspective they may as well play the games.  Many of the tickets are sold even if people don't show up to the games.  But my guess is that owners would be happy to give up 15 games if it meant increased television contracts for playoffs AND players giving up 15 regular season game checks.

But that isn't happening.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

I'd venture a guess it's much more than you think when you take concession sales into consideration. I have zero numbers to back this up but I have to imagine concession numbers at baseball games blow away any of the other major sports.

19,296 paid attendance at the Tigers game today.  that's paid, not butts in the seats.  Doubt you are going to have much in the way of concessions.

[wadesworld]

Sorry, I kind of stopped paying attention to the standings in the AL since pretty much all the Playoff teams have been decided for quite a while now.  Didn't realize that the Astros had jumped the Yankees by such a wide margin, so the 2nd best record in the AL will not be playing in a Wild Card game.  But my overall point remains.  It's easy to say "win more" but it's also easy to point out that some teams just have an easier situation to "win more" in.

[buckchuckler]

Sorry, I kind of stopped paying attention to the standings in the AL since pretty much all the Playoff teams have been decided for quite a while now.  Didn't realize that the Astros had jumped the Yankees by such a wide margin, so the 2nd best record in the AL will not be playing in a Wild Card game.  But my overall point remains.  It's easy to say "win more" but it's also easy to point out that some teams just have an easier situation to "win more" in.

Did the cubs have an easier situation to"win more?" 

Doesn't seem like it.


And goooooolllly is Joey Votto making a lot of money to hit 12 dingers.

[wadesworld]

Did the cubs have an easier situation to"win more?" 

Doesn't seem like it.


And goooooolllly is Joey Votto making a lot of money to hit 12 dingers.

So you disagree that some teams have an easier path to the Playoffs than others?  Guess we'll agree to disagree.

And if you ask Cubbies fans, even the Reds, who are far and away the worst team in the division, are a "solid" baseball team.  Which is laughable, but when the Cubbies get swept it can't be that they lost to a bad baseball team, it's that the team is solid, just had a slow start.

[buckchuckler]

So you disagree that some teams have an easier path to the Playoffs than others?  Guess we'll agree to disagree.

And if you ask Cubbies fans, even the Reds, who are far and away the worst team in the division, are a "solid" baseball team.  Which is laughable, but when the Cubbies get swept it can't be that they lost to a bad baseball team, it's that the team is solid, just had a slow start.

No, that isn't what I said.  If the Indians were making the playoffs instead of the Brewers, you'd have a gripe. 

If the Brewers end up the wildcard (increasingly likely) it is because the didn't win the games in their division, especially against the team that will likely win the division.  It is as simple as that.

[wadesworld]

No, that isn't what I said.  If the Indians were making the playoffs instead of the Brewers, you'd have a gripe. 

If the Brewers end up the wildcard (increasingly likely) it is because the didn't win the games in their division, especially against the team that will likely win the division.  It is as simple as that.

I’m not really griping. I’m pointing out that the team with the 2nd best record in the NL will probably be playing in the Wild Card game, whether it’s the Brewers (most likely) or the Cubs. Or even the Cards. In what is the best division in the NL (heck, even their worst team is “decent”). That’s probably not the best formula.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I know what you are saying, but I think I disagree.  Teams have so many chances, especially within their divisions.  The Brewers are 3.5 back, and they are 8-11 against the Cubs.  They are 5-11 against the Pirates.  If the Brewers don't win their division, it is most likely due to their play within their division.  They are currently 3 games under .500 in division play.  The Cubs are 5 over in division play.

I think this proves what Wades is trying to say. The Brewers have the second best record in baseball despite playing poorly in their division. You put them in the East or West and they probably have the best record in the NL by a couple of games.

You can't choose your division mates but it is true that teams in the NL East and West have an easier path to the playoffs than teams in the NL Central (this season).

[Dr. Blackheart]

I think this proves what Wades is trying to say. The Brewers have the second best record in baseball despite playing poorly in their division. You put them in the East or West and they probably have the best record in the NL by a couple of games.

You can't choose your division mates but it is true that teams in the NL East and West have an easier path to the playoffs than teams in the NL Central (this season).

Whether it's the Cubs or the Brewers, it will be the 1st or 2nd in the National (which is what you meant).  What's crazier, the Cards would be very close today to leading the other two divisions for the 3rd best record. 

[MU82]

Whether it's the Cubs or the Brewers, it will be the 1st or 2nd in the National (which is what you meant).  What's crazier, the Cards would be very close today to leading the other two divisions for the 3rd best record.

It's not "crazy" at all. If the Cardinals played better, they could have won their division. Zero sympathy.

[Dr. Blackheart]

It's not "crazy" at all. If the Cardinals played better, they could have won their division. Zero sympathy.

Not asking for sympathy just parity.  In today's game, we have many teams tanking to rebuild. Whereas, the top teams (close to top 3), are in the same division.  The MLB playoffs were designed for another era.  If teams are gonna tank on design (worst Orioles team in history), the playoff system needs to adjust and be dynamic.

[RJax55]

Whether it's the Cubs or the Brewers, it will be the 1st or 2nd in the National (which is what you meant).  What's crazier, the Cards would be very close today to leading the other two divisions for the 3rd best record.

Happened back in 2015 as well. The 98 win Pirates hosted the 97 win Cubs in the wildcard game. Both the Cubs and the Pirates would have won either the NL East or West easily.

[buckchuckler]

Not asking for sympathy just parity.  In today's game, we have many teams tanking to rebuild. Whereas, the top teams (close to top 3), are in the same division.  The MLB playoffs were designed for another era.  If teams are gonna tank on design (worst Orioles team in history), the playoff system needs to adjust and be dynamic.

Yeah, the O's weren't a designed tank.  They were just terrible.

And the NL only has what 2 tanking teams?  That hardly throws the balance off completely.   

Parity is impossible.   The teams in the Central divisions have easier travel than the other teams.  Should we fix that?  If you scrap divisions it will only exaggerate that aspect more.

I also don't think you can assume the Brewers would fare better in another division either.  The team that has beat them up the most are the Pirates who arrrrr pretty mediocre. 

This stuff happens.   But it isn't similar to a 103 win team missing the playoffs.  Is this a chronic problem?  Doesn't seem like it at this point.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Yeah, the O's weren't a designed tank.  They were just terrible.

And the NL only has what 2 tanking teams?  That hardly throws the balance off completely.   

Parity is impossible.   The teams in the Central divisions have easier travel than the other teams.  Should we fix that?  If you scrap divisions it will only exaggerate that aspect more.

I also don't think you can assume the Brewers would fare better in another division either.  The team that has beat them up the most are the Pirates who arrrrr pretty mediocre. 

This stuff happens.   But it isn't similar to a 103 win team missing the playoffs.  Is this a chronic problem?  Doesn't seem like it at this point.

I disagree with most of this. 

[wadesworld]

I disagree with most of this.

I agree with this.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

Yeah, the O's weren't a designed tank.  They were just terrible.

Agreed. They were really bad in the first half,  which lead to a firesale.  That made them even worse.

[jsglow]

I, for one, like the unbalanced schedule.  Playing familiar division rivals is more fun in any sport.  The only tweak I would make is to increase the Wild Card to 2 out of 3 OR revert back to a single WC winner.  The second WC is a gimmick to keep the 4th place team 'interested'.  After a 162 game season, fortune shouldn't be settled by one game.  Baseball is too unpredictable for that on any given day.  The reason that a game 7 is so compelling is that two teams have battled through 6 evenly to get there. 

[wadesworld]

I, for one, like the unbalanced schedule.  Playing familiar division rivals is more fun in any sport.  The only tweak I would make is to increase the Wild Card to 2 out of 3 OR revert back to a single WC winner.  The second WC is a gimmick to keep the 4th place team 'interested'.  After a 162 game season, fortune shouldn't be settled by one game.  Baseball is too unpredictable for that on any given day.  The reason that a game 7 is so compelling is that two teams have battled through 6 evenly to get there.

Yup.  If it were up to me it'd be a single Wild Card team and every series would be best of 7.

[buckchuckler]

I disagree with most of this.

Seems like poor analysis.  Where'd I go wrong?

[Its DJOver]

More playoff teams means more rounds of playoffs.  Unless they are going to play into December, that means fewer regular season games, and I don't see owners willing to give up those games.

I've seen this argument a couple time over the course of the season and as long as the owners could convince the players to give up whatever the equivalent of 9 or so games pay (easier said than done) I don't think they would be against it.

There are two professional sports that play exclusively indoors, and thus have the possibility to technically play at any time during the year.  NHL (novelties like the winter classic excluded), and the NBA.  NHL gets a pass because the cost of keeping rinks frozen in Florida, Texas, and Arizona through the summer would be huge.  However if the equation were as simple as more games = more money, wouldn't the NBA owners constantly be pushing for longer seasons?  The NBA players probably wouldn't even be against it, because they could use it as leverage to eliminate road games on back to back nights (which has been a concern for a couple years), as well as the idea that if the season is 10-15% longer, they can get 10-15% more money.

The idea of more games = more money makes sense in theory, but I think it is far more complicated than that.

[WI inferiority Complexes]

After a 162 game season, fortune shouldn't be settled by one game.  Baseball is too unpredictable for that on any given day.

Sh!t happens when you don't win the division.