History of #thething

[GGGG]

When people say "no matter," they mean FT% doesn't impact the outcome of the game as much as other statistics.  So the important statistic isn't that Rowsey is shooting FTs at 93% and went 100% v. LSU, it's that he has a season FTr of .566 and had 16 attempts v. LSU.

[We R Final Four]

They wouldn't have mattered if you would have shot better earlier...or grabbed another offensive rebound...or turned the ball over less.

Yeah....but they didn’t.
So, DO FTs matter if your team had a bad shooting day?
Do FTs matter if your team DIDNT grab that last offensive rebound?
Do FTs matter if your team turned the ball over one more time than usual?
If so, they sure as hell matter in each of those instances.

[Nukem2]

Yeah....but they didn’t.
So, DO FTs matter if your team had a bad shooting day?
Do FTs matter if your team DIDNT grab that last offensive rebound?
Do FTs matter if your team turned the ball over one more time than usual?
If so, they sure as hell matter in each of those instances.

Agree.  Suspect most agree that FTs  matter situationally as what happened earlier becomes rather irrelevant.   From a statistical overview over time, not so much. 

[GGGG]

Yeah....but they didn’t.
So, DO FTs matter if your team had a bad shooting day?
Do FTs matter if your team DIDNT grab that last offensive rebound?
Do FTs matter if your team turned the ball over one more time than usual?
If so, they sure as hell matter in each of those instances.

It always is better to do something good than not.  But that's not the point of the statement.

[MU82]

  scratching my head??  so, ya just won the game, but it doesn't matter?  still scratching my head...is this some sort of twisted joke?  what am i missing here?  if free throws don't matter, why do they offer them on technical fouls? 

     i think there are a few scenarios where they have to matter or else, why not just go to the line and rifle it off the backboard and rim and see what happens?  hell, just throw it out of bounds or hand it back to the opposing player    what about intentional fouls? other team is losing and the whole deal is they want you to miss so they may get the ball back and score , either by getting to the line or hitting a shot-another duhhh   what some are saying here is free throws no matta because you should shoot 100% or get all your offensive rebounds on misses and put them back in, don't turn the ball over...at all.  i think some are minimizing them a little too much, eyn'a?

You know me pretty well, rocket. And yet you apparently forgot I don't use teal. Or do I?
 eyayymasdnmnasdfsdfnasd'a?

[rocket surgeon]

You know me pretty well, rocket. And yet you apparently forgot I don't use teal. Or do I?
 eyayymasdnmnasdfsdfnasd'a?

ok, but i thought i knew b-ball a little so i thought maybe i was missing something all those years.  like when wilt, shaq could barely hit the floor when shooting free-ones everyone took note.  conversely, when rick barry couldn't miss-shooting like a "girlie man".  so he makes his son canyon do it too-only dude in the country who does that, i believe

[We R Final Four]

It always is better to do something good than not.  But that's not the point of the statement.

Your statement of “well just make one more basket and we wouldn’t be in this position” doesn’t hold.

[GGGG]

Your statement of “well just make one more basket and we wouldn’t be in this position” doesn’t hold.

Of course it does.  The point is that shooting the ball better, grabbing rebounds and not turning the ball over is more important than if you hit your free throws.

[#UnleashSean]

1. Great link from the OP. Thanks. The Randy Klotka twitterer desperately wanted it to be "that thing," but "the thing" won out, for whatever reason.

2. Rowsey has gotten the call even when he has leaped into a defender who isn't going forward. A couple times, the defender even seemed to be going backward when Rowsey leaped into him. Several times, he has drawn it from a defender going at him. If you're an MU fan, they're all good. If not, only the last looks like a foul.

FTs no matta! Ever! Even if the team doesn't get a single field goal, goes 100-for-100 from the line and the team wins 100-99, the FTs didn't matta! Learn basketball, everybody!! Free throws should be negative points they matta so little!!!

going backwards is also a foul. If a player has horizontal movement while jumping its a foul.

[Jay Bee]

#FTsNoMatta means Team FT% is irrelevant to winning basketball games.

It’s just a fact.

[We R Final Four]

Of course it does.  The point is that shooting the ball better, grabbing rebounds and not turning the ball over is more important than if you hit your free throws.

Grabbing just one more offensive rebound vs. was not more important than Rowsey going 16 for 16 vs. LSU.

[GGGG]

Grabbing just one more offensive rebound vs. was not more important than Rowsey going 16 for 16 vs. LSU.

I never claimed it was.

[brewcity77]

Grabbing just one more offensive rebound vs. was not more important than Rowsey going 16 for 16 vs. LSU.

Had he gone 8/16 we still win.

Anyone not understanding why free throw percentage doesn't matter in comparison to other game factors simply doesn't understand the game.

And the point is not snapshot scenarios, it is the totality of the game. Having the best or worst free throw percentage in the country will have minimal impact on your wins and losses.

[We R Final Four]

They wouldn't have mattered if you would have shot better earlier...or grabbed another offensive rebound...or turned the ball over less.

Earlier, grabbing one more offensive rebound was so important that FTs wouldn’t matter. You didn’t make that claim?

[We R Final Four]

Had he gone 8/16 we still win.

Anyone not understanding why free throw percentage doesn't matter in comparison to other game factors simply doesn't understand the game.

And the point is not snapshot scenarios, it is the totality of the game. Having the best or worst free throw percentage in the country will have minimal impact on your wins and losses.

Yeah, I get it. I don’t get the “if you just would have made one more shot,or grabbed just one more rebound” excuse

[GGGG]

Earlier, grabbing one more offensive rebound was so important that FTs wouldn’t matter. You didn’t make that claim?

Do you read the situation that was described? It had nothing to do with 16/16.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Just win, baby!

[Nukem2]

#FTsNoMatta means Team FT% is irrelevant to winning basketball games.

It’s just a fact.

How dumb can you be.?  If it’s 1 second to go and......?  F*ck her stats.

[GGGG]

How dumb can you be.?  If it’s 1 second to go and......?  F*ck her stats.

That’s not his point. By this time you already know this and are just playing the intentional Luddite. Or you actually are one because math is hard for you.

[cheebs09]

My understanding is that since a good PPP is 1.0 (at least I think it is), going 50% at the line would keep you at that level. Hence, missing 2 free throws is no different than missing a jump shot or turnover. It’s more important to have a high FTR% assuming you are over 50% since that would help your PPP.

I could be way off but hoping my novice knowledge of advanced stats is at least on the right track.

[GGGG]

My understanding is that since a good PPP is 1.0 (at least I think it is), going 50% at the line would keep you at that level. Hence, missing 2 free throws is no different than missing a jump shot or turnover. It’s more important to have a high FTR% assuming you are over 50% since that would help your PPP.

I could be way off but hoping my novice knowledge of advanced stats is at least on the right track.

You need to account for one and one situations and three point shots but essentially that’s the point.

[warriorchick]

Just win, baby!

Exactly.  If we win, I don't really care if its due to free throws, defense, three-pointers, #TheThing, or anything else.

[We R Final Four]

Do you read the situation that was described? It had nothing to do with 16/16.

Down 2 pts, 1 second on the clock.
Never said anything about 16/16.

[Jay Bee]

My understanding is that since a good PPP is 1.0 (at least I think it is), going 50% at the line would keep you at that level. Hence, missing 2 free throws is no different than missing a jump shot or turnover. It’s more important to have a high FTR% assuming you are over 50% since that would help your PPP.

I could be way off but hoping my novice knowledge of advanced stats is at least on the right track.

You're on the right track. AVERAGE ppp is about 1.05 these days (these days = past couple of years). If you're at 1.10 you're flirting with a top 50 ppp offense.

The reality is teams rarely shoot less than 60% FT over a season (in 2016-17, exactly one team shot worse than 61%).

At 60%, you're scoring around 1.2 ppp when you go to the line (front ends, and-one's, and offense rebounds alter it a bit, but largely offset). 1.2 ppp is elite offense. So, if you're one of the worst FT% teams in college basketball, going to the line is still elite offense. So, as you mentioned... FTrate has some importance (although it's by far the lowest of the four factors)...

FT% and a team's ppp do not correlate well. If I tell you a team is a top 30 eFG% team, it's a good guess that that team has a very good offensive ppp. If I tell you a team is a top 30 FT%, it doesn't tell you jack (e.g., #FTsNoMatta).

A dumb thing many people cry about is their team's FT%. "Team X only shoots 65% from the line! That will crush their season! They are FREE! Oh my gosh, how bad!!"

But the truth is we've seen 69% to 70% average FT% each year for decades. It's actually amazing (slight uptick to 70.4% last season). Free throws aren't free. The origin of the name comes from a time when free throws weren't shot - points were simply awarded based on a foul. Those were truly 'free' points. The name has stuck, but... it's completely bizarre and academically stupid that many argue they are losing games because their team shot 65% at the line instead of an average 70%.... yet many people do it.

#FTsNoMatta

[MU82]

Had he gone 8/16 we still win.

Although I get the "FT no matta" point, really I do, this is not necessarily true at all and Scoopers should stop saying it.

If he had missed a bunch of FTs down the stretch, it would have changed the strategy both teams would have used. Maybe in a close game, MU would have choked away the game.

It's like saying that a football team that won by 17 points "didn't even need" the 2 TDs it scored early in the 4th quarter. With 1:28 to play, the strategy is a lot different in a 34-17 game than in a 20-17 game.