ESPN Get Worse

[Tugg Speedman]

Again, maybe pizza eaters are boycotting the douchenozzle who owns Papa John's.

And I'm with brand ... there is zero chance of me standing during God Bless America.

Papa Johns was started during that Reagan administration and from then until week 1 of this NFL season his politics were a non-issue.  And now, coincidentally, his personal politics is now hurting sales and he is using as an excuse falling NFL ratings.  Nevermind Papa Johns is the official pizza sponsors of 23 NFL teams, the official sponsor of the NFL league and pays Payton Manning more than you'll make in your lifetime to hawk Pizzas on TV.  Yes, this guy is in no position to comment on the NFL ratings.

Meanwhile, Pizza Hut, who is not an NFL sponsor in any way is not being affected and that is proof the guy that sponsors 23 NFL teams doesn't know what he talking about.  This the same Pizza Hut that acknowledged they are falling behind both Papa Johns and Dominos because they don't even have an app yet, is owned by the Chinese (Yum Brands) and embroiled in lawsuits for paying drivers under minimum wage.

Yes, because when lefties like you reject Papa Johns because of the owners' politics you go with a company that plays under minimum wage to get you pie delivered.

Oh, and I suppose the reason that CBS stock is down is their owners politics too?  CBS' stock is down and they said it was falling NFL ratings.  Ditto Disney because their stock is also down and they also cited falling NFL ratings. 

[Hards Alumni]

you are the one deflecting-we are discussing protests during the national anthem.  then you ask about flag code and if i follow the code absolutely to the "T" or something.  once again...i'm talking about the national anthem.  if you want to discuss everyone's personal attitudes toward and decorum, that would be another topic with when did you stop beating your wife

"peaceful protests"? i'd love for all protests to be peaceful...just not during the national anthem-simple.

The entire idea of a protest is that it is inconvenient.  Where and when do you suggest they protest?  At home, in their lawns on a Tuesday?  Would that be at all effective?

[Hards Alumni]

Papa Johns was started during that Reagan administration and from then until week 1 of this NFL season his politics were a non-issue.  And now, coincidentally, his personal politics is now hurting sales and he is using as an excuse falling NFL ratings.  Nevermind Papa Johns is the official pizza sponsors of 23 NFL teams, the official sponsor of the NFL league and pays Payton Manning more than you'll make in your lifetime to hawk Pizzas on TV.  Yes, this guy is in no position to comment on the NFL ratings.

More like 2012, when he was crying about having to pay for his employees health insurance as a result of the ACA.  Have you seen Papa John's commercials not during a football game?  MAYBE he shouldn't have used all of his TV ad time in one place... especially one with a downward trending market!  But I guess, if you want to blame someone, its right out of his playbook to blame the poor and the oppressed.  Payton Manning is a part owner so John doesn't have to pay him.  Its almost as if you enjoy talking completely out of your ass all of the time.

Meanwhile, Pizza Hut, who is not an NFL sponsor in any way is not being affected and that is proof the guy that sponsors 23 NFL teams doesn't know what he talking about.  This the same Pizza Hut that acknowledged they are falling behind both Papa Johns and Dominos because they don't even have an app yet, is owned by the Chinese (Yum Brands) and embroiled in lawsuits for paying drivers under minimum wage.

I don't care if Pizza Hut is an NFL sponsor.  Why the hell should anyone care?  There are Pizza Hut commercials during football games.  Also, YUM! Brands is not a Chinese company.  They are an American company based in Lexington, KY.  Sure, a entirely separate company named YUM! China spun off from the original about a year ago... But if you were being honest, you already knew that... it just didn't fit the narrative you were trying to espouse.  The lawsuit you are referring to affected 130 drivers... so it was more than likely one franchise owner acting out of line since I'm pretty sure that Pizza Hut employs more than 130 drivers total.
ADDITIONALLY, Pizzza Hut DOES have an app... I know this because all I had to do was type in "PIZZA HUT" into my google play on my phone.  Its like you aren't even trying, you clod.

Yes, because when lefties like you reject Papa Johns because of the owners' politics you go with a company that plays under minimum wage to get you pie delivered.

Oh, and I suppose the reason that CBS stock is down is their owners politics too?  CBS' stock is down and they said it was falling NFL ratings.  Ditto Disney because their stock is also down and they also cited falling NFL ratings.

I reject their pizza because the crust is soft and floppy, and the cheese falls off when you try to take a bite.  Plus it tastes like a hangover feels; AWFUL.  I rarely buy chain pizza because I have taste buds and I don't hate my colon.

CBS and ABC stock is down because they also make bad TV shows and network TV market shares have been declining for years.

Stop trying to fool people with your specific line of BS, because no one here will buy it if you are this sloppy. 

[rocket surgeon]

I was just curious if it was the act of kneeling or the message behind the kneeling that was bothering you.

Or was it the fist in the air?  Or was it the fist in the air while kneeling?   Message?  Which message is it today?  Look, what they are doing during the national anthem is purposely provocative and the wrong place to do it, that's all.  No one is saying they CANNOT express their "outrage of the day" but not during the national anthem before the people gathered in their workplace to see them perform. They are hijacking their boss's paying customers and laying a turd down during a short ceremony that most people understand and respect for allowing us to gather. 

You can't just protest anywhere?  As I've been saying, take the protest to the LGBT convention or MLK memorials, spread the word

Can you protest in your office?   

[B. McBannerson]

Meh.  Ratings have been declining for years.

Except, that is a false statement.  NFL ratings in 2015 were up over 2014.   https://www.si.com/more-sports/2016/01/10/media-circus-nfl-playoff-ratings-espn-nbc-cbs

And 2014 ratings were better than 2013.  http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/network-press-releases/nfl-2014-tv-recap-202-million-viewers-game-viewership-nearly-triples-broadcast-primetime/348433/

And 2013 ratings were better than 2012  http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/network-press-releases/nfl-2013-tv-recap-205-million-fans-tuned-in-34-of-35-most-watched-shows-this-fall/227726/


Ratings fell last year big.  The election was blamed.  This year, ratings fall again.   People are blaming Thursday Night football? TNF has existed for many years, just now it's a thing?  How does one explain the sudden drop in Game Pass subscriptions THIS YEAR at NFL or Direct TV Sunday Ticket subscriptions THIS YEAR?  Coincidence?  No. 

[B. McBannerson]

NASCAR ratings are down in 2017. Is that politics related as well? Also, the NFL players are not engaged in a political protest.

Then again, people aren't interested in the truth when it conflicts with their politics/biases.

NASCAR ratings have been down 5 straight years.  NFL ratings were up 2013, 2014, 2015, down in 2016, down in 2017.  Not exactly comparing properly.  NFL is also down in other areas, paid subscriptions, merchandise.  There are other issues in play, but it amazes me how many want to pretend the protests don't impact.  Read some of the comments on this board to last year and a few months ago and there were people here that stunningly said zero impact by the protests and anthem. How absurd.

And yes, some are engaged in political protest.  How else do you define it? Do their own words not matter?  What is taking a knee to bring awareness to what they believe is a societal issue except a political protest?

[rocket surgeon]

The entire idea of a protest is that it is inconvenient.  Where and when do you suggest they protest?  At home, in their lawns on a Tuesday?  Would that be at all effective?

Where and when? On their own dime

At home in their lawns on a Tuesday? Sure

Would that be at all effective?  I don't care.

[TinyTimsLittleBrother]

Or was it the fist in the air?  Or was it the fist in the air while kneeling?   Message?  Which message is it today?  Look, what they are doing during the national anthem is purposely provocative and the wrong place to do it, that's all.  No one is saying they CANNOT express their "outrage of the day" but not during the national anthem before the people gathered in their workplace to see them perform. They are hijacking their boss's paying customers and laying a turd down during a short ceremony that most people understand and respect for allowing us to gather. 

You can't just protest anywhere?  As I've been saying, take the protest to the LGBT convention or MLK memorials, spread the word

Can you protest in your office?   

"Hi!  I am a white man telling you black people how and when to protest racial injustice.  I hope you take my advice to heart."

[B. McBannerson]

The entire idea of a protest is that it is inconvenient.  Where and when do you suggest they protest?  At home, in their lawns on a Tuesday?  Would that be at all effective?

That is true, but that doesn't mean you get to do it on your employers time.  Most of us if we decided to protest with picket signs or whatever at work on our time would be fired. 

If it was such a great idea what they are doing, why are the networks pulling back on showing the national anthem now? Why are they not showing the players kneeling?  Are the networks anti-player?

[B. McBannerson]

Again, maybe pizza eaters are boycotting the douchenozzle who owns Papa John's.

And I'm with brand ... there is zero chance of me standing during God Bless America.

LOL.  How absurd.  This is the year they decided to do this?  This is ALSO the year fans decided to cut Game Pass subscriptions, cut Direct TV NFL Package.  This is also the year fans decided to buy less merchandise and burn stuff they had.  This is the year, what a coincidence, nothing propelled them to do it.

Your last statement, I have to tell you that is why a certain person won a big election because for most people in this country, they believe you stand for the National Anthem and GBA.  For the same reason you would stand for the Canadian Anthem or any other anthem, out of respect.  You are playing into your favorite politician's hands by doing and saying what you are going to do, and the funny thing is you don't even realize it.  RESIST!!!   

[TinyTimsLittleBrother]

That is true, but that doesn't mean you get to do it on your employers time.  Most of us if we decided to protest with picket signs or whatever at work on our time would be fired. 

So what?  I get to wear jeans to work. At other places that would be a dress code violation.

Not every workplace has the same rules.

[B. McBannerson]

So what?  I get to wear jeans to work. At other places that would be a dress code violation.

Not every workplace has the same rules.

The NFL's own rules say players should stand for the national anthem, they just aren't enforcing it.  So if you want to talk about rules.

And if you wore jeans at other places where it is a dress code violation, there would be a punishment. That's the problem, the NFL hasn't done anything of the kind, and they are suffering for it.

You are also making the wrong comparison, but whatever.  End of the day, this is hurting the NFL badly.  Jerry Jones emphatically said last week how bad this hurts the NFL, one would think he would know as well as anyone on the globe.  Ultimately that trickles down to the players and it will stop or the league will be only relevant to pockets of individuals.  Their call. 

[B. McBannerson]

Among the few things more quintessentially American than these acts are...the act of protest. Cf. all of American history.

The fact that people - typically older white guys, who seem to be the angriest people around - try to legislate how and when black people can protest only validates the point of their protest in the first place.

Playing the race card, how am I not surprised.

[B. McBannerson]

Ratings peaked in 2013. 2014 and 2015 showed moderate dips. In 2016 (Kaps 1st protest year, the pig/cop socks, etc.) they fell hard. As many joined the protests in 2017 the ratings continue to fall hard. Occam's Razor.

Not true, ratings were up in each of those years.

[Hards Alumni]

That is true, but that doesn't mean you get to do it on your employers time.  Most of us if we decided to protest with picket signs or whatever at work on our time would be fired. 

If it was such a great idea what they are doing, why are the networks pulling back on showing the national anthem now? Why are they not showing the players kneeling?  Are the networks anti-player?

So then the owners should fire them.  But they can't because they are powerless.  So it will continue.  I don't understand your point.

If anyone is to blame for making the National Anthem protests a huge deal it is the media... including the broadcasts that have a recap of who did and who did not kneel during the NA. 

[B. McBannerson]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/2017/10/10/here-are-the-2017-mlb-prime-time-television-ratings-for-each-team/#12fcd29d3799

Overall, league ratings in prime time were down -6% compared to last season with the Detroit Tigers (down -38%) leading the way in ratings drag from the year prior.

http://variety.com/2017/tv/news/nba-regular-season-ratings-1202031083/

ABC, ESPN, and TNT saw NBA viewership decline slightly in the 2016-17 regular season, the first covered under a multi-billion-dollar contract extension between the league and its television partners that reaches through 2024-25.

National NBA telecasts across the three channels and cable network NBA TV averaged 1.19 million total viewers for the season ending on Wednesday — down 6% from the 2015-16 season, but even with the average from 2014-15. Under a new television deal, the three networks combined to broadcast 19 more games than last season.

Those are local ratings, not national ratings.  Poor comparison. Look at the national ratings.  Also look at the 5 year trend, it looks much different than what is happening to the NFL right now, because baseball isn't taking a knee except for one guy who is now been charged with pointing a gun at a woman for delivering his food to him apparently in the wrong way.

[TinyTimsLittleBrother]

The NFL's own rules say players should stand for the national anthem, they just aren't enforcing it.  So if you want to talk about rules.

And if you wore jeans at other places where it is a dress code violation, there would be a punishment. That's the problem, the NFL hasn't done anything of the kind, and they are suffering for it.

You are also making the wrong comparison, but whatever.  End of the day, this is hurting the NFL badly.  Jerry Jones emphatically said last week how bad this hurts the NFL, one would think he would know as well as anyone on the globe.  Ultimately that trickles down to the players and it will stop or the league will be only relevant to pockets of individuals.  Their call. 

As I said earlier...good. I hope it hurts Jerry. I think he is blind to many of the reasons, but whatever.

[B. McBannerson]

I apologize. I just assumed it was a new account for our friend chicos/4or5. I was kind of correct. Seems he renamed 4or5 to this new "McPherson".

MU82 seems to be naming people different names, so in his honor I will continue stand for the national anthem, stand out of respect for God Bless America and will continue to do so and adopted one of his names.  Smuggles seemed to be available, Yogi and some other ones. 

[rocket surgeon]

Wrong. Here's your original post that I quoted:

I bolded the important part. You included much, much more than just the national anthem in your example of when there is to be "decorum" and if people do not act "with that that decorum" it "is considered disrespectul." In fact, you even explicitly mention presenting of the colors. That is literally the flag itself.

Adhering to the flag code should be part of that process that you state is so important. If someone stood before a game and altered the national anthem, I'm pretty sure you wouldn't think that was very respectful.

So, because you brought up that the whole pomp and circumstance of the important moments before/during games or whenever they present in life.... do you think adherence to the flag code is important? It's a simple yes or no.

I was using those other events as examples, but not to deflect, I believe there is an appropriate decorum to the flag during those events just as there is and should be a certain decorum during funerals , weddings, memorials, etc.  they each have their own solomnity or formality if you will.  Interrupting any of these will produce a reaction of some sort.  Let's just call it kaepernicks thingy, regardless of how they want to portray it, is wrong-simple. 

I don't know how many ways some of you want to skin this cat, but bottom line-it's not the athletes right to do what they are doing where they are doing it.  If the owners and the commish had any testicles, they would start suspending them.  Set the rule and enforce it

[B. McBannerson]

I was using those other events as examples, but not to deflect, I believe there is an appropriate decorum to the flag during those events just as there is and should be a certain decorum during funerals , weddings, memorials, etc.  they each have their own solomnity or formality if you will.  Interrupting any of these will produce a reaction of some sort.  Let's just call it kaepernicks thingy, regardless of how they want to portray it, is wrong-simple. 

I don't know how many ways some of you want to skin this cat, but bottom line-it's not the athletes right to do what they are doing where they are doing it.  If the owners and the commish had any testicles, they would start suspending them.  Set the rule and enforce it

Rule already exists, they simply aren't enforcing it.  Goodell has no testicles and he is in jeopardy of not being renewed as commissioner, but more likely will but with different contractual terms then he had only last month in his extension.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Yeah,  i don't buy the not on your employers time arguement. Is there any other workplace in this country outside of professional sports that forces their employees into participating in the star spangled banner? Participating in the anthem is a political action. I don't think employers have the right to make their employees do that. It's very unamerican

[B. McBannerson]

"Hi!  I am a white man telling you black people how and when to protest racial injustice.  I hope you take my advice to heart."

And the race card comes out again.  Always by the same folks.  Clarence Thomas made some very poignant comments the other day that we simply can't have conversation in this country anymore without others labeling each other as racist, misogynistic, or whatever. Honest debate cannot happen anymore, which is extremely unfortunate and will eventually destroy the country. 

It also gets people elected that the very folks making these absurd claims don't want.  Why?  Because people that aren't racist but being labeled as racist don't like it, and they vote, and they push back.  Maybe that will sink in at some point.

[cheebs09]

As I said earlier...good. I hope it hurts Jerry. I think he is blind to many of the reasons, but whatever.

I agree with this. Isn't it in Jerry's best interest to blame the protests rather than admitting the product is going downhill. The protests play a part, but I'm not sure I'd say it's the biggest reason. Maybe it's the straw that broke the camels back.

Between CTE, Ray Rice, and deflate gate, the NFL has rarely been in the news for a positive thing. It may be that people are just tired of it and this is the year they stopped watching.

[B. McBannerson]

So then the owners should fire them.  But they can't because they are powerless.  So it will continue.  I don't understand your point.

If anyone is to blame for making the National Anthem protests a huge deal it is the media... including the broadcasts that have a recap of who did and who did not kneel during the NA.

All the owners have to do is enforce the rules.  If you violate the rules, you are suspended, fined, cut, whatever.  You want to protest, do it all day on your time.  People want to watch football to escape the every day politics that creep into our lives, sports is an escape. The NFL is not powerless, they choose to do what they are doing and they are reaping what they sow. 

[B. McBannerson]

As I said earlier...good. I hope it hurts Jerry. I think he is blind to many of the reasons, but whatever.

Fine by me, but it also hurts the players.  Ultimately will hurt them much more and in a much bigger percentage.  But whatever.