Chones

[CAGASS24]

Presenting the eastern conference trophy to the cavs tonight / MU power!!!

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Why has MU not honored him with a jersey retirement?

[GGGG]

Probably because he left mid-season and never graduated.  But they broke that precedent when they retired Wade's so I think they should do it for him as well.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

What number was Chones?

[Galway Eagle]

If freshmen couldn't play back then didn't he only play a year and a half for us? Seems a little short to warrant a jersey retiring.

[jsglow]

If freshmen couldn't play back then didn't he only play a year and a half for us? Seems a little short to warrant a jersey retiring.

What number was Chones?

#22 Jim Chones played almost two full seasons (so a few games short of DWade).  I sincerely believe that he would have led Marquette to the Final Four in 1972.  To accomplish that we would have needed to defeat both Kentucky (who we actually lost to) and Florida State to win the regional.  Some have argued that MU was a national championship contender with Chones.  All I know is that the war in the national championship game between he and Bill Walton would have been epic.  It was a different era back then and not to take away from any great players of today but basketball goes back a long way and every era includes superstars, those two included.

Would I retire his jersey?  Yes.  Remember that he asked McGuire what to do and when Al saw his family's empty refrigerator he advised him to go.  Here's one other thought.  Chones was probably a better college player than Lucas.  And that's saying a lot.

[The Lens]

No, no, no, no, no!

I have no problem with Jim leaving early and I appreciate just how good he was.  I'm glad we had a coach who did the right life thing and helped him leave.  But you do not retire the number of a someone who leaves in the middle of a season.  Yes Wade only played half a season more but if Dwyane went pro after the Wake Forest game would you have retired his number?  Retired numbers are for achievements, not for "what ifs".

These are not participation trophies, getting your number retired should be the greatest honor a team can bestow on someone (unless you're Brute Force, then it just becomes a way for MU to mind-f##k you).

[Galway Eagle]

#22 Jim Chones played almost two full seasons (so a few games short of DWade).  I sincerely believe that he would have led Marquette to the Final Four in 1972.  To accomplish that we would have needed to defeat both Kentucky (who we actually lost to) and Florida State to win the regional.  Some have argued that MU was a national championship contender with Chones.  All I know is that the war in the national championship game between he and Bill Walton would have been epic.  It was a different era back then and not to take away from any great players of today but basketball goes back a long way and every era includes superstars, those two included.

Would I retire his jersey?  Yes.  Remember that he asked McGuire what to do and when Al saw his family's empty refrigerator he advised him to go.  Here's one other thought.  Chones was probably a better college player than Lucas.  And that's saying a lot.

Not diminishing what he did or that he was great. Just seems like 1.5 seasons is a bit light for retirement. Maybe if in his full one we had a FF I could see it like Wade but there's lots of great players and only the ones who have brought us success in our three ff should be retired in my opinion.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Probably because he left mid-season and never graduated.  But they broke that precedent when they retired Wade's so I think they should do it for him as well.

Per the interview and article below the degree comment is N/A.  Seems like something MU should correct.

http://www.scout.com/college/marquette/story/545125-celebrating-alumni-jim-chones

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/2004-02-05-choneses_x.htm

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

#22 Jim Chones played almost two full seasons (so a few games short of DWade).  I sincerely believe that he would have led Marquette to the Final Four in 1972.  To accomplish that we would have needed to defeat both Kentucky (who we actually lost to) and Florida State to win the regional.  Some have argued that MU was a national championship contender with Chones.  All I know is that the war in the national championship game between he and Bill Walton would have been epic.  It was a different era back then and not to take away from any great players of today but basketball goes back a long way and every era includes superstars, those two included.

Would I retire his jersey?  Yes.  Remember that he asked McGuire what to do and when Al saw his family's empty refrigerator he advised him to go.  Here's one other thought.  Chones was probably a better college player than Lucas.  And that's saying a lot.

Thanks. So who gets their 22 retired first: Chones or McNeal?  Do they join Ellis and Rivers to become the second duo to have their number retired?

Marquette went 50-1 with Chones.  I'd have no problem if his number is retired. But I also see the point about him leaving early and not quite meeting the threshold for number retirement.

[muwarrior69]

Per the interview and article below the degree comment is N/A.  Seems like something MU should correct.

http://www.scout.com/college/marquette/story/545125-celebrating-alumni-jim-chones

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/2004-02-05-choneses_x.htm

It seems to me that Jim was way more successful off the court than on. Retire his number and it"s time that MU embrace its mission statement and "be the difference" as  Jim is.

[4everwarriors]

I stood next ta #22 in the Varsity lobby in August of 1969 during freshman week. He was wearin' a green Michigan St. shell windbreaker. Skinny, tall dude from Racine who matured to be da Warriors' first aircraft carrier, a dominant college playa, and All-American. I, for one, believe we woulda beaten da Bruins, had we met. Da younguns, here, can't possibly understand just how talented and dominant some of Al's teams were. Later, got ta know Jimmy a bit from our time in John Pick's english class. Da pressure on deez kids to perform, on and off da court, is immense. Particularly, when all the shekels are factored in, hey?

[Warrior Code]

Has any NCAA coach - with a real shot at a Final Four/National Championship - ever encouraged their star player to leave school early, before or since? It's almost mind-boggling to think about, with how high the stakes are for these coaches today.

[We R Final Four]

John Calipari

[Warrior Code]

Touché. But they don't leave in the middle of the season.

[jsglow]

Not diminishing what he did or that he was great. Just seems like 1.5 seasons is a bit light for retirement. Maybe if in his full one we had a FF I could see it like Wade but there's lots of great players and only the ones who have brought us success in our three ff should be retired in my opinion.

Your point is valid.  Let's put it this way.  IF (and it'll never be even considered so this is a pure hypothetical) they were ever to consider anything for any 'one and done', then a very loud chorus for Jim should be initiated by all of us here on Scoop.

[Goose]

4ever

Agreed on beating the Bruins. Jimmy and that team were very, very special. Talented and dominant describes a decade of ball at MU.

[jsglow]

Here's one thing you young guys might not understand.  And I know we've had this discussion before but I'm too lazy to go find the thread.  Chones is right near the very top in terms of being the most dominant player that ever put on a Marquette uniform.  A couple years ago we did that Top 5 all-time thread.  He's right there.  The only guy from this century in the same sentence is DWade.  Not Jimmy, Jae, Jerel, Wes or anyone else.  That's how great he was, especially in college.

Again, I'm not arguing that we should necessarily retire his jersey.  I personally would but understand why others wouldn't.  But I do want you guys to appreciate that as I recall the timing of the ABA draft (then in competition with the NBA) was such that Chones didn't screw over Marquette.  He left with Al's blessing as one of the very first 'hardship' cases.  Also understand that his family was welfare poor, like no food poor.

[jsglow]

Has any NCAA coach - with a real shot at a Final Four/National Championship - ever encouraged their star player to leave school early, before or since? It's almost mind-boggling to think about, with how high the stakes are for these coaches today.

Leave school early BEFORE THE SEASON ENDED to the detriment of his own National Championship aspirations.  Al knew that some things were more important than basketball.  Stuff that's just unimaginable today.  But is was the late 60's/early 70's and we're blessed that he had vision well beyond the cultural limitations of the day.

[Warrior Code]

Leave school early BEFORE THE SEASON ENDED to the detriment of his own National Championship aspirations.  Al knew that some things were more important than basketball.  Stuff that's just unimaginable today.  But is was the late 60's/early 70's and we're blessed that he had vision well beyond the cultural limitations of the day.

Exactly, I should have been more clear about that.

[The Lens]

Glow, you don't need to tell me how good Jimmy was at MU.  I am acutely aware that he may have been the best ever. 

[oldwarrior81]

pretty dominant numbers.  952 points (19.0) and 583 rebounds (11.7) in 50 games.   
And like mentioned earlier, the only loss was in the NCAA's to Ohio State.

Points per game rank third behind Thompson (20.4) and Wade (19.7)

[Earl Tatum]

What numbers are retired? Favor 22, 20 Lucas and 14 Dean "the dream".

[Earl Tatum]

Found the answer to my question and 22 belongs with them

[GGGG]

Thanks. So who gets their 22 retired first: Chones or McNeal?  Do they join Ellis and Rivers to become the second duo to have their number retired?

Marquette went 50-1 with Chones.  I'd have no problem if his number is retired. But I also see the point about him leaving early and not quite meeting the threshold for number retirement.

I don't think McNeal's should be retired - certainly not before Chones.  But if Chones is retired, you might as well put McNeal's name up there.