This is progress

[CTWarrior]

Villanova a C. They did as expected.

So if you are the preseason number 1 and you win the national championship you get a C because you did as expected?

There are two ways of looking at grades (though you could take a combination of the two in some manner), I suppose, and I understand both ways.

1.  What you are/did.
2.  What you are/did compared to expectations.

I think leaning toward number 1 makes more sense.  A kid who was expected to get 100 on a math test and got a 99 still really did better than a kid who expected to get a 65 and got a 72.

[MU82]

I would agree that there was some progress made in 2016 and even say beyond baby steps. Overall my grade for this season moved up to C+ based on the heart shown over last couple of weeks. I will add, several times last night our half court offense looked extremely good.

Curious to know what grade you would have given K.O. after his third season, during which the Warriors went 16-13. After a promising 11-4 start, they went 5-9, including a 1-7 stretch that effectively eliminated any postseason chances.

Yes, I admit I'm goading you a little here because I know how much you revere K.O. But seriously, if this is only a C+, what would that have been?

BTW ... I'm giving Wojo a solid B. We have one of the best offenses in the country, we are entertaining to watch, he has been willing to change and adjust on the fly, our D is slowly improving (not enough, but it is), winning is expected again and we seemingly are headed back to the Dance.

Get to the Sweet 16, and it's an A.

[Marcus92]

After graduation, I found grades to be absolutely the least relevant result of my Marquette education. I graduated with honors, but not one interviewer ever brought up or asked questions about my GPA. They wanted to know more about me and my experience.

What's the point of "grading" a season or a player? The number of wins a team earns — non-conference, in conference and postseason — is apparent to anybody who cares. Seems more like an exercise in self-importance; if you're a tough grader, you must hold the program to a higher standard than other fans.

If, instead, a grade speaks to your appreciation and enjoyment of Marquette college basketball, I suspect anyone who gives this season a C+ must be generally unhappy. This has been one of the most exciting, unpredictable seasons I've witnessed in the past 25 years. Ups and downs, highs and lows, it's truly been a roller coaster. And roller coasters are hella fun. What's not to enjoy?

[Goose]

MU82

Have said it many times, anyone and everyone around the program was excited about direction program was going in KO's 3rd year. Attendance was up, he was engaged in community and overall excitement level. It was more the atmosphere surrounding the program than anything else. I remember sitting at Elsa's with KO numerous times and saying who cares if you lose every game in first couple of years as long as upgrading program for long haul.

[MU82]

MU82

Have said it many times, anyone and everyone around the program was excited about direction program was going in KO's 3rd year. Attendance was up, he was engaged in community and overall excitement level. It was more the atmosphere surrounding the program than anything else. I remember sitting at Elsa's with KO numerous times and saying who cares if you lose every game in first couple of years as long as upgrading program for long haul.

That's cool. I liked K.O. a lot and I believe he helped the program tremendously.

I don't know Wojo but I also like how he's grown as a coach and I believe he has helped the program tremendously.

You very skillfully didn't answer the question, but that's OK.

[BM1090]

MU82

Have said it many times, anyone and everyone around the program was excited about direction program was going in KO's 3rd year. Attendance was up, he was engaged in community and overall excitement level. It was more the atmosphere surrounding the program than anything else. I remember sitting at Elsa's with KO numerous times and saying who cares if you lose every game in first couple of years as long as upgrading program for long haul.

How is that any different than what Wojo is trying to do/in the process of doing?

Cleaned up the program, got his guys in, progressed each year to a point we are now most likely a tournament team in year three.

[muwarrior69]

Agree with everything, there is progress. Consider:

1) The Hillbilly left us in the worst condition Marquette basketball had been in, at least since Dukiet and possibly EVER. The number of scholarship athletes we had in Wojo's first year was debilitating and it showed. The fact we won as many as we did was a testament to Wojo.

2) Last year we had a top 5 recruit and won 20 games, arguably on a weak schedule.  We had a lot of freshmen and it showed. The weaknesses on our team were largely due to inexperience.

3) We have a good team this year that's probably tournament bound. We did this despite losing our Top 5 recruit and knowing rebounding and power inside play would be a struggle. Our defense is much better and our guys are buying in.

4) Our recruits for next year fix the biggest single weakness on our team -- inside play. I'm thinking we may be one of the better teams in the conference if our freshmen gel next year.

Yeah, there are always things that we can do better. But I give Wojo credit because we're going where we are supposed to go. They just are.

...and we still have two scholies to fill. Let's see what happens during the spring signing.

[Goose]

MU82

Grade for KO for year 3 (?) probably F on the court and an A for everything else. There was no one close to the KO situation that cared about instant on court success if the end game was winning at a high level. I can assure you I told him to his face (after too many beers) the on court was an F.

I do not have any confidence, AT THIS POINT, that Wojo will win at a high level at MU. Note--I do not believe it is not possible, just far for confident on it.

[frozena pizza]

Looking at win-loss results alone oversimplifies things.  We lost Ellenson from last year and Wojo was able to cobble together a roster that included Howard, Hauser, Reinhardt and Rowsey, none of whom played a single minute for us last year.  He built an identity around that group and has done a pretty good job of mitigating some fairly pronounced weaknesses in defense and rebounding.  Yes, we've had some tough losses but I don't completely blame Wojo for that.  It's pretty impressive that we are where we are now.

[Loose Cannon]

MU82

Grade for KO for year 3 (?) probably F on the court and an A for everything else. There was no one close to the KO situation that cared about instant on court success if the end game was winning at a high level. I can assure you I told him to his face (after too many beers) the on court was an F.

I do not have any confidence, AT THIS POINT, that Wojo will win at a high level at MU. Note--I do not believe it is not possible, just far for confident on it.

I respect your opinion, But I think you're in the Minority on this one.

[Goose]

Loose Cannon

I would not be so sure on my being in the minority on that one. There might have been a number of folks in town a couple of weeks that are not certain that Wojo will win big here.

[Uncertain]

Wow.  Tough grader.

So only one student can get an A+, even if there are 351 kids in the class?

As it should be. The days of everyone being made to feel good are over.

I had a bud at MU who majored in sociology or literature or some such thing who took pride in the fact that he n get took one note in class. Instead, he sat back and absorbed the professor's brilliance, reflecting on the proferred wisdom.

And while he managed mostly C's with the occasional bonus B he felt that he was receiving a true liberal arts education - similar to Plato nestled at the feet of Socrates.

The Gentleman's C is nothing to be ashamed of.

[warriorchick]

As it should be. The days of everyone being made to feel good are over.

I had a bud at MU who majored in sociology or literature or some such thing who took pride in the fact that he n get took one note in class. Instead, he sat back and absorbed the professor's brilliance, reflecting on the proferred wisdom.

And while he managed mostly C's with the occasional bonus B he felt that he was receiving a true liberal arts education - similar to Plato nestled at the feet of Socrates.

The Gentleman's C is nothing to be ashamed of.

Yeah, say that last line in a job interview and see what happens.

[hairy worthen]

Loose Cannon

I would not be so sure on my being in the minority on that one. There might have been a number of folks in town a couple of weeks that are not certain that Wojo will win big here.

Disappointed to read your comments, you have always been the positive one and voice of reason. I think one of the biggest mistakes a program can make is to live in the past. Getting back to the Al days may be a pipe dream in today's landscape. I think Wojo can turn the program around to be a perineal winner. I see Villanova as more of a model than Duke.  This is only year 3 and the trajectory has been going consistently up year over year. If it goes down in year 4 or 5 then we should be concerned.

[Uncertain]

Yeah, say that last line in a job interview and see what happens.

As if anyone is actually themselves in an interview. Personally, I would find such candor refreshing and should wish to hire such a man into a position of authority.

The world is filled with yes men. Organizations that seek out and reward those who embrace blind adherence to dogma get what they deserve.

[Goose]

Hairy

I have my fingers crossed on Wojo getting the job done. Far from jumping ship. You can still count me in the glass half full . I agree on the Al era be repeated is a pipe dream. That said, I think Buzz was the closest to getting us there than any coach post Al. I liked the edge his teams played with and their toughness.

Again, I want Wojo to succeed.

[Uncertain]

Hairy

I have my fingers crossed on Wojo getting the job done. Far from jumping ship. You can still count me in the glass half full glass. I agree on the Al era be repeated is a pipe dream. That said, I think Buzz was the closest to getting us there than any coach post Al. I liked the edge his teams played with and their toughness.

Again, I want Wojo to succeed.

Goose

Were you a note taker at MU, prepared to regurgitate the instructor's polemic back verbatim?

Or were you an enlightened one, a man who craved knowledge for the wisdom it contained, rather than a lemming seeking passage to a law school?

[BallBoy]

Here is my scale
A - Any recognition above just making the Tournament like BE Tournament/Regular Season Champions, Sweet 16 or Beyond
B - Make Tournament
C - Make NIT
D - Do Not Make the Tournament
F - Do Not Make the Tournament, bad recognition above just not making the tournament.

You get a plus or minus to indicate
+ You exceeded Expectation
- You didn't meet expectations

For example, if we make the tournament this year it is a B+.  We weren't expected to do so we exceeded expectation but just made the tournament.  If we were expected to easily make the tournament but backed into it then it would be a B-.  A+ would be not expecting to compete yet we won the BE Tournament and made the NCAA tournament or made Sweet 16 or Elite 8. 

[GB Warrior]

As if anyone is actually themselves in an interview. Personally, I would find such candor refreshing and should wish to hire such a man into a position of authority.

The world is filled with yes men. Organizations that seek out and reward those who embrace blind adherence to dogma get what they deserve.

And to clarify, they should be scrapping the bottom of the barrel to get those people? You should go into politics.

[Golden Avalanche]

Hairy

I have my fingers crossed on Wojo getting the job done. Far from jumping ship. You can still count me in the glass half full. I agree on the Al era be repeated is a pipe dream. That said, I think Buzz was the closest to getting us there than any coach post Al. I liked the edge his teams played with and their toughness.

Again, I want Wojo to succeed.

Alternative facts. You very clearly bailed on this squad weeks ago when you proudly boasted that you turned down free tickets to a game based on the malaise you feel regarding Wojo.

Move on.

[fjm]

Alternative facts. You very clearly bailed on this squad weeks ago when you proudly boasted that you turned down free tickets to a game based on the malaise you feel regarding Wojo.

Move on.

Not wrong.

[JD]

Or when he stated long time season ticket holders were thinking about getting bucks tickets instead of Marquette tickets for the first time.

[Goose]

Golden and JD

I do hope both of you have invested as much time and money as I have over the years. If so, feel free to continue any bashing you care to throw at me. If not, your posts hold little water.
Again, appreciate your comments and advice to leave the board.

[Galway Eagle]

Golden and JD

I do hope both of you have invested as much time and money as I have over the years. If so, feel free to continue any bashing you care to throw at me. If not, your posts hold little water.
Again, appreciate your comments and advice to leave the board.

While they said it a little more uncooth. You have to admit there is some irony in you referring to yourself as glasses half full when you weren't exactly mr positive nor long ago. Mind you this isn't a question of your investment in MU, nor passion as a fan it is only questioning your self evaluation as a glasses half full fan about wojo. 

[Loose Cannon]

Loose Cannon

I would not be so sure on my being in the minority on that one. There might have been a number of folks in town a couple of weeks that are not certain that Wojo will win big here.

Well we disagree, so I'll leave it at that. Thanks for the reply.