any golfers-U.S. open thread

[GGGG]

  if the PGA wants to reach out and capture more fans and participation, it's rulings like this that will give people the perception that golf is too stuffy and too complicated

I don't see how this impacts the popularity or viewership of golf in any way.  Golf has lost popularity because it is stuffy, complicated...and expensive.  Rules like this don't impact this at all.

[Spaniel with a Short Tail]

if he is turning his life around, i'm becoming a real fan. he is absolutely torching the ball and chit you can hang your clothes on!  after getting shafted at whistling in 2010, the 3 putt blunder last year, and then maybe we'll think about it and tell ya later depending on how much of a lead you have...that was complete bull plop(hole 5 penalty) and i'm so glad it didn't have a bearing on the outcome.

as for the penalty-
  if johnson touched the ball, why did it fall backward?
  if he would have touched the ball, he would have called it himself-that's how golfers roll
  if the PGA wants to reach out and capture more fans and participation, it's rulings like this that will give people the perception that golf is too stuffy and too complicated

i had an incident saturday where i chipped up, past the hole by about 2 feet on an up-slope. i marked my ball.  when my turn came to putt, i placed my ball on the green and before i could remove my marker,  the ball would start rolling toward the hole.  this happened like 5-6 times.  now that i could see the line, thank you, i finally got my ball to stay long enough to putt it. what was i supposed to do, pound it into the green?  one of my golf partners told me that if the ball had moved after i removed my mark while i was addressing it, it would have been a penalty?  what if i hadn't even grounded my club?  i need to talk to the golf pro about this one

Inside the leather...PICK IT UP!!!

[MU82]

Those Oakmont greens were very difficult and the putts he missed were always close, it wasn't like he was missing 3 footers, they were 15-20 footers. He had a great recovery from the loose shot on 9 and made par on a very tough hole. The announcers said one of his  birdies was one of the toughest in the tournament. I think the distinction I am making is when the wheels came off the wagon, he was actually trying to  contend and win it, a small miss of a few feet here and there on those greens puts you in a crappy position to make par. When you watched the shot tracker you could see the lines he was taking were aggressive.  At the end of the day the guy shot a 70 for the final round of a US Open which I just don't call choking. He played well, but  didn't play well enough to win, that is what I think happened. I think what happens with Garcia is in these majors sometimes you only need to play for par and avoid mistakes and that just does not seem to be in his constitution. It may be that because he is a weak putter he feels he must rely on his strong irons to get him close. Net result is the same he is not getting the job done but this event I did not put in the choke category for him.

Shane Lowrey shot a 76 going into the final round with a -7 and decent leader. That was a very clear choker if there was someone you wanted to label as a choker.

All right ... I'll compromise and say Sergio only kind of choked.

I guess when a pattern has been established over many years, it makes it easier to label 'em all as chokes, which as you say probably isn't fair.

I was at Medinah in '99 to witness that amazing duel between Sergio and Tiger. Many of us thought it was the start of an incredible rivalry that would include 20 or more majors between them. Tiger lived up to his half of the bargain.

[rocket surgeon]

I don't see how this impacts the popularity or viewership of golf in any way.  Golf has lost popularity because it is stuffy, complicated...and expensive.  Rules like this don't impact this at all.

that's your opinion-fine, but i disagree, no big deal.  people who don't golf or are just taking it up or are thinking about taking a passing interest in either participation or just as a spectator get turned off by these types of rulings.  golf is trying to make a distinction between casual players and "ready golf" to speed up the game for joe golf bag while reverting back to the "symphony" crowd with rulings like this.  ask most club house pros and if they aren't caught up in all the rules 22.8 section 2c with the 14 addendums and blah blah blah, the ruling was petty at least.  they aren't splitting hairs here, they aren't splitting atoms, hell, they are splitting neutrons, electrons and protons

[GGGG]

that's your opinion-fine, but i disagree, no big deal.  people who don't golf or are just taking it up or are thinking about taking a passing interest in either participation or just as a spectator get turned off by these types of rulings.  golf is trying to make a distinction between casual players and "ready golf" to speed up the game for joe golf bag while reverting back to the "symphony" crowd with rulings like this.  ask most club house pros and if they aren't caught up in all the rules 22.8 section 2c with the 14 addendums and blah blah blah, the ruling was petty at least.  they aren't splitting hairs here, they aren't splitting atoms, hell, they are splitting neutrons, electrons and protons

People out on the munis aren't worrying about 22.8 section 2c.  It never enters their mind.  The reason people aren't playing is because the game is too expensive for most people to play very often.  And unless you play often you aren't going to be very good at it.

[mu03eng]

People out on the munis aren't worrying about 22.8 section 2c.  It never enters their mind.  The reason people aren't playing is because the game is too expensive for most people to play very often.  And unless you play often you aren't going to be very good at it.

I think you are both correct to an extent. The expense, difficulty of the game, and time commitment prevent people from coming to the game.....but TV viewership is critical to getting people, especially the young interested in the sport in the first place.

If you get casual fans turning off the television because it seems unfair or because they don't get it, the young and impressionable never get exposed to take up the game, and learning it young is critical. Very few people learn to play golf in their 20s or 30s and stick with it.

The USGA is very very lucky that DJ won comfortably and that Game 7 was crazy close/topical....no one will pay attention to this idiocy that could have ruined a major

[Benny B]

It's a "gentlemen's game" played on the honor system.... yet there's nothing like golf that takes the honor and gentleness out of a man.

Maybe that's why I prefer women's golf.

[rocket surgeon]

I think you are both correct to an extent. The expense, difficulty of the game, and time commitment prevent people from coming to the game.....but TV viewership is critical to getting people, especially the young interested in the sport in the first place.

If you get casual fans turning off the television because it seems unfair or because they don't get it, the young and impressionable never get exposed to take up the game, and learning it young is critical. Very few people learn to play golf in their 20s or 30s and stick with it.

The USGA is very very lucky that DJ won comfortably and that Game 7 was crazy close/topical....no one will pay attention to this idiocy that could have ruined a major

thanks for your analysis-well done

my dad has never swung a golf club in his life and he was disgusted by the call, non-call, call.  if it's a game of honor, and it is, the first official at the hole handled it correctly.  then the other chefs stuck their spoons in the soup.  if it's a game of honor, the USGA just stuck up the "swear finger" to him and called him a liar-brutal! 

not one player, past or present nor caddie agreed with the call

loved the comment that nick faldo used, i'm not sure in what reference, but luke donald repeated it and said that dustin should "thank the USGA from the heart of his bottom"

[tower912]

Nick Faldo struggle for years before he finally broke through and started winning majors.   The British press labeled him 'Nick Fold-o' and took great delight in skewering him until he finally broke through and won a major.    During his press conference, he dropped that bomb on them.   

[rocket surgeon]

Nick Faldo struggle for years before he finally broke through and started winning majors.   The British press labeled him 'Nick Fold-o' and took great delight in skewering him until he finally broke through and won a major.    During his press conference, he dropped that bomb on them.

the other weird thing about faldo is while he was winning, he decides it would be a great idea to completely overhaul his swing...what?  that was the end

[Goose]

For 90% of my life I was an extremely avid golfer, playing over a hundred rounds a year for many years. After having some health issues, getting older and game going to hell I lost my excitement big time. I now find myself missing playing a great deal but truthfully cannot justify the cost to play on regular basis. Quickly learned that not playing that my game went south which only added to my frustration.

I have come to the realization that the game is way, way to expensive to play the courses I want to play. In addition, the pace of play is crazy long and I find myself getting more and more pissed as the round progresses when I do play. A couple of weeks ago I took two of my boys to Brown Deer and the round took almost five hours. 

For me, as much as I love the game, I can live without far easier than I ever dreamt possible. Nothing worse than spending a couple hundred bucks and going home frustrated. They have to find a way to speed play and make it more affordable or they will lose more players like me.

[MU82]

the other weird thing about faldo is while he was winning, he decides it would be a great idea to completely overhaul his swing...what?  that was the end

Well, Tiger probably has overhauled his swing a half-dozen times -- even during stretches when he was winning over and over.

Many of the great ones are never satisfied.

[tower912]

the other weird thing about faldo is while he was winning, he decides it would be a great idea to completely overhaul his swing...what?  that was the end

You have the sequence wrong.  He won with his original swing.  Not a lot, but enough for the British press to start raising expectations.  Faldo came to the conclusion that his game wasn't good enough to win majors.  He teamed up with David Leadbetter and spent a couple of years struggling and getting raked over the coals by the BP until the changes clicked and took hold.   Then he went on his run of winning majors.   He stayed near the top until the Masters he won over Greg Norman.  His career ebbed after that, as he entered his 40's.

[rocket surgeon]

You have the sequence wrong.  He won with his original swing.  Not a lot, but enough for the British press to start raising expectations.  Faldo came to the conclusion that his game wasn't good enough to win majors.  He teamed up with David Leadbetter and spent a couple of years struggling and getting raked over the coals by the BP until the changes clicked and took hold.   Then he went on his run of winning majors.   He stayed near the top until the Masters he won over Greg Norman.  His career ebbed after that, as he entered his 40's.

you are right.  i just seem to remember soon after he had just completed a remarkable run and then seemed to be on a downturn, i recall the announcers talking about re-working his swing and i thought, why?  now there could have been a lot more to that story as well.  injuries, age, whatever, but you are correct. after ledbetter worked with him in 1985, he won the open 3 times, the masters 3 times, along with an assortment of other tournaments thru 1996

[GGGG]

For 90% of my life I was an extremely avid golfer, playing over a hundred rounds a year for many years. After having some health issues, getting older and game going to hell I lost my excitement big time. I now find myself missing playing a great deal but truthfully cannot justify the cost to play on regular basis. Quickly learned that not playing that my game went south which only added to my frustration.

I have come to the realization that the game is way, way to expensive to play the courses I want to play. In addition, the pace of play is crazy long and I find myself getting more and more pissed as the round progresses when I do play. A couple of weeks ago I took two of my boys to Brown Deer and the round took almost five hours. 

For me, as much as I love the game, I can live without far easier than I ever dreamt possible. Nothing worse than spending a couple hundred bucks and going home frustrated. They have to find a way to speed play and make it more affordable or they will lose more players like me.

+1

[MUsoxfan]

you are right.  i just seem to remember soon after he had just completed a remarkable run and then seemed to be on a downturn, i recall the announcers talking about re-working his swing and i thought, why?  now there could have been a lot more to that story as well.  injuries, age, whatever, but you are correct. after ledbetter worked with him in 1985, he won the open 3 times, the masters 3 times, along with an assortment of other tournaments thru 1996

I think the older we all get, the more we have to adjust our swings to help keep a step ahead of our backs and knees.

[Sheriff]

For 90% of my life I was an extremely avid golfer, playing over a hundred rounds a year for many years. After having some health issues, getting older and game going to hell I lost my excitement big time. I now find myself missing playing a great deal but truthfully cannot justify the cost to play on regular basis. Quickly learned that not playing that my game went south which only added to my frustration.

I have come to the realization that the game is way, way to expensive to play the courses I want to play. In addition, the pace of play is crazy long and I find myself getting more and more pissed as the round progresses when I do play. A couple of weeks ago I took two of my boys to Brown Deer and the round took almost five hours. 

For me, as much as I love the game, I can live without far easier than I ever dreamt possible. Nothing worse than spending a couple hundred bucks and going home frustrated. They have to find a way to speed play and make it more affordable or they will lose more players like me.

I don't know where you play or would like to play but the stark reality is that many clubs, private and muni, are in survival mode.  Green fees have become much more reasonable and tee times more available.  I am a member at two clubs and it is not unusual to be able to walk up and complete a round in three hours on weekend afternoons.  Rates have not increased appreciably over the last ten years and reduced rates are available for rounds starting in early afternoon.

I've played and watched golf for over 45 years.  My humble opinion is that the popularity of golf isn't related to cost of playing or the time required.  Most clubs go out of their way to make the experience more casual and relaxed, especially for the young or more novice players.

I think popularity has waned for two reasons.  First, the departure of Tiger from the limelight.  His arrival on the scene sparked a level of interest in the game not seen since Arnie appeared on TV in the 1960s.  It has waned since his demise.  Secondly, I think younger players lost interest in the post-Tiger era because golf doesn't provide the instant gratification of other "sports,"  particularly those played indoors with a control in hand.  It's a difficult game that take immense patience and concentration in addition to the physical skills that time time to refine,  regardless of the evolution of equipment has improved the playability and foregiveness of shotmaking.

[Herman Cain]

I don't know where you play or would like to play but the stark reality is that many clubs, private and muni, are in survival mode.  Green fees have become much more reasonable and tee times more available.  I am a member at two clubs and it is not unusual to be able to walk up and complete a round in three hours on weekend afternoons.  Rates have not increased appreciably over the last ten years and reduced rates are available for rounds starting in early afternoon.

I've played and watched golf for over 45 years.  My humble opinion is that the popularity of golf isn't related to cost of playing or the time required.  Most clubs go out of their way to make the experience more casual and relaxed, especially for the young or more novice players.

I think popularity has waned for two reasons.  First, the departure of Tiger from the limelight.  His arrival on the scene sparked a level of interest in the game not seen since Arnie appeared on TV in the 1960s.  It has waned since his demise.  Secondly, I think younger players lost interest in the post-Tiger era because golf doesn't provide the instant gratification of other "sports,"  particularly those played indoors with a control in hand.  It's a difficult game that take immense patience and concentration in addition to the physical skills that time time to refine,  regardless of the evolution of equipment has improved the playability and foregiveness of shotmaking.

You are a member of two clubs which is nice. Most people have to play at the Muni or a public course. There is a big difference. Playing at a club has always been a fast pace of play and is enjoyable. The other options have various issues that take the joy out of golf. It is also very expensive for the average person who is nothing more than a hacker.

Golf is a hard sport to master and takes lots of time. In todays instant feed back world that is out of vogue.

[Sheriff]

thanks for your analysis-well done

my dad has never swung a golf club in his life and he was disgusted by the call, non-call, call.  if it's a game of honor, and it is, the first official at the hole handled it correctly.  then the other chefs stuck their spoons in the soup.  if it's a game of honor, the USGA just stuck up the "swear finger" to him and called him a liar-brutal! 

not one player, past or present nor caddie agreed with the call

loved the comment that nick faldo used, i'm not sure in what reference, but luke donald repeated it and said that dustin should "thank the USGA from the heart of his bottom"

Congratulations, USGA.  You have attained NCAA level of authoritative incompetency

[Sheriff]

You are a member of two clubs which is nice. Most people have to play at the Muni or a public course. There is a big difference. Playing at a club has always been a fast pace of play and is enjoyable. The other options have various issues that take the joy out of golf. It is also very expensive for the average person who is nothing more than a hacker.

Golf is a hard sport to master and takes lots of time. In todays instant feed back world that is out of vogue.

Agreed, and a point I made in my post.

I also agree with your view on clubs but I need to point out that at one of my clubs, the annual fee is $250 and the 18 hole green fee is $25 on weekends.  Similar to what one would pay at the muni across the street which also offers incentives to younger players and village residents.

[MUsoxfan]

You are a member of two clubs which is nice. Most people have to play at the Muni or a public course. There is a big difference. Playing at a club has always been a fast pace of play and is enjoyable. The other options have various issues that take the joy out of golf. It is also very expensive for the average person who is nothing more than a hacker.

Golf is a hard sport to master and takes lots of time. In todays instant feed back world that is out of vogue.

Also, most people have to work too much these days to play much golf, especially on the weekdays.

I play 2-3 times a month. Ideally, I'd play 10 times per month, but can't get away from work even for twilight.

[Sheriff]

I'm envious. You play nore than I.

[Blackhat]

DJ showed some internal fortitude...I think that would have shook me knowing a penalty "might" be coming from those putzes. 

I like how they were saying there just has to be a doubt to enforce the penalty.  Official said there was more than a 50% chance he caused it.  What percentage did he grab from his a$$, 68.5%?  They should fix that to actual evidence.  The ball never moved when he made the actual practice swings but later.   Big reach by the officials, imo.  Plus even if you want to pull that they've got to enforce that within a reasonable amount of time, so guys know where they stand.    Made the final round more enticing, if a f-ed up way.

[rocket surgeon]

DJ showed some internal fortitude...I think that would have shook me knowing a penalty "might" be coming from those putzes. 

I like how they were saying there just has to be a doubt to enforce the penalty.  Official said there was more than a 50% chance he caused it.  What percentage did he grab from his a$$, 68.5%?  They should fix that to actual evidence.  The ball never moved when he made the actual practice swings but later.   Big reach by the officials, imo.  Plus even if you want to pull that they've got to enforce that within a reasonable amount of time, so guys know where they stand.    Made the final round more enticing, if a f-ed up way.

judging from the outcry, there were some(all) big names in the sport very very critical of the USGA.  if no one their took any of that to heart, they ain't gonna be around much longer, or the chit for brains that made the decision anyway

the sheriff had some great points-golf doesn't have to be expensive.  time consuming-yes.  i buy a lot of my clubs on ebay or other 2nd hand alternatives.  we can sometimes go thru 2-3 putters per year because we all know, when in doubt, it's the clubs fault .  seriously though, for a wedge(s) or a putter-people go thru those like hanes undies.  i will not spend $150-200 for a putter or wedge that i may not have next week. you can buy these things with barely a scratch for $20-30-40 w/free shipping.  i'll spend a little more on my irons, but i bought a 2nd set of big bertha irons to leave in lake havasu for $150.  the callaway FT-9 for another$100 and $change for the rest of them.  the web site-golf now constantly has great deals online for tee times anywhere in the country.  off season, you can golf some fantastic, country club level courses for dirt cheap.

golf is a time consuming, challenging sport regardless of your skill level.  it is also a real revelation of the true character of the person(s) you are golfing with.  playing video games and collecting stamps are time consuming also.  i choose golf whenever i can

we've joined a very modest golf club that has 36 holes, for the past 6 years for roughly $3200, unlimited gold with a cart 7 days per week.  my wife will get out at least 3-4 times per week and i will get out 2-3.  let's just say that's 5-6 rounds per week between us.  to be fair, let's figure may thru september even though many times we are out there sporadically in march, april and october.  5-6 rounds per week for 6 mos.~24 x 6=144.  that's roughly $22/round.  the nice thing about this club is it's annual fee isn't prohibitive to we disallow us from going to other clubs and we do. we have a golf gang, husband/wife where we spend weekends at the dells, castle rock, sentry world, wisco rapids, green bay, the genevas, etc.   

you can golf the same course 15 times in a row and have a different experience and/or challenge each time.  weather, pin and tee box changes, are enough to change anyone's approach. 

did you know that even if your game is right around 95-100 you are in the top 20%?  yes i know, all of us shoot 80's right?  nope.  you can shoot an 82 and follow it up with 102 the next day.  or vice versa-that's one of the beauties of golf. 

then of course you hear the stories-coming off the  course more pissed off than when you went on, how relaxing can it be when ya wanna just scream...it happens.  but it should reach in to your inner humility at some point or it isn't for you.  love the commercial of the 4-some with one of the dudes just frustrated, pissed, ready to chuck the clubs into the pond...they finish, all get into his ? car and the one turns to the other and asks-same time tomorrow? yup, yup and they drive off-that's golf

the game of golf-it's all on you.  hit 'em long and straight, eyN'a

[tower912]

I am blessed to live in an area with primarily public courses, to have a schedule that allows me to play on weekdays during the day, to love to walk 18 carrying my bag, and a couple of golf retailers/pro shops that really go out of their way to give great deals.  I played 3 times during the week of June 5-9.    Walked 18 all three times.  3 different courses.   $17, $20, $20, and walked 18 in under 3 hours all three times.   Nearly had my 10,000 steps in by 11:30.