[Matt Velazquez] Marquette ranks 21st in 2015-'16 men's basketball attendance

[mu_hilltopper]

If attendance is based on tickets sold, then why would those who attend every game have done superior knowledge as to all "ticket discussions"?

There is not "zero chance" that there were 500 non-season tickets sold for the Grambling game. You're guessing without a logical basis.

Still waiting for your guess.   Or are you just a troll? 

[Jay Bee]

Still waiting for your guess.   Or are you just a troll?

Why would I need to provide a guess? I'm simply stating that your "methodology" is crap.

[Benny B]

Invalid analysis. Your opponent's RPI does not impact your own.

Your opponent's record impacts your RPI, and at some point a loss against a team with a mediocre record has a far more negative impact on your own RPI than several wins against teams with poor records.

[Marcus92]

Does anyone here think we'll ever see the demise of RPI?

For well over a decade, I've heard basketball experts say that it's a questionable (if not downright flawed) statistic. Many other models/systems available today are more accurate in predicting who wins a head-to-head matchup. But RPI is still widely cited and used when assessing the relative quality of teams.

What gives?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Does anyone here think we'll ever see the demise of RPI?

For well over a decade, I've heard basketball experts say that it's a questionable (if not downright flawed) statistic. Many other models/systems available today are more accurate in predicting who wins a head-to-head matchup. But RPI is still widely cited and used when assessing the relative quality of teams.

What gives?

RPI is less about ranking teams and more about ranking what they have done in a season.

[Jay Bee]

Your opponent's record impacts your RPI, and at some point a loss against a team with a mediocre record has a far more negative impact on your own RPI than several wins against teams with poor records.

Yes; however, a team with a 250 RPI can have a better record than a team with a 200 RPI and be more beneficial for you to play with regard to RPI impact.

Because, again, your opponent's RPI doesn't impact yours.

[mu_hilltopper]

Why would I need to provide a guess? I'm simply stating that your "methodology" is crap.

Methodology for an answer is different than methodology for a good guess, right?  I've made a good guess.  I think I'm pretty close, and am OK with its margin of error.

You think my "guessing methodology" isn't good, so .. share your better guess.

[Jay Bee]

Methodology for an answer is different than methodology for a good guess, right?  I've made a good guess.  I think I'm pretty close, and am OK with its margin of error.

You think my "guessing methodology" isn't good, so .. share your better guess.

I'm not attempting to guess the # of STH's. Your guess is approx 11,618. I believe it could be 500 or more than 500 less than that. You don't.

I don't know the answer, but I know how you got to your guess is blasphemous & tragic!!!

[mu_hilltopper]

I'm not attempting to guess the # of STH's. Your guess is approx 11,618. I believe it could be 500 or more than 500 less than that. You don't.

I don't know the answer, but I know how you got to your guess is blasphemous & tragic!!!

I don't know the answer, either.  I'm guessing.   So, what's your guess?

And how is this "blasphemous" or "tragic"?

[Benny B]

Yes; however, a team with a 250 RPI can have a better record than a team with a 200 RPI and be more beneficial for you to play with regard to RPI impact.

Because, again, your opponent's RPI doesn't impact yours.

I was simply using "RPI XXX" as a proxy to distinguish between cupcakes the likes of what MU has scheduled over the past few years and the mid-majors that some are crying out to see more of.

In other words, if MU schedules 10 games against mid-major teams that end up with decent records (and play a bunch of opponents with decent records), how many losses could MU withstand before RPI is worse than had they scheduled - and go 10-0 against - low-major cupcakes (that played a bunch of other low-major cupcakes)?

[warriorchick]

Can I just say that you guys argue about the stupidest crap?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Can I just say that you guys argue about the stupidest crap?

Amen.

Now let's get back to to arguing about things that matter, like the effectiveness of changing our user name's to include the name of a recruit!

[source?]

I'm not attempting to guess the # of STH's. Your guess is approx 11,618. I believe it could be 500 or more than 500 less than that. You don't.

I don't know the answer, but I know how you got to your guess is blasphemous & tragic!!!

That's some impressive hyperbole you got there.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

I'm not attempting to guess the # of STH's. Your guess is approx 11,618. I believe it could be 500 or more than 500 less than that. You don't.

I don't know the answer, but I know how you got to your guess is blasphemous & tragic!!!

We aren't putting someone into space.  95-96% of the actual number is pretty darn close.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I don't know how many walk ups there ended up being for the Grambling game, but Crystal Bowl was predicting 342.

[Jay Bee]

We aren't putting someone into space.  95-96% of the actual number is pretty darn close.

But it may be more like 90%.

That said, is 95% 'pretty darn close'?

That's like the guys who praise themselves because they got 66/68 of the NCAA tourney teams "correct" (despite all the autobids, and sure shots.. whooopty-do)

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

But it may be more like 90%.

That said, is 95% 'pretty darn close'?

That's like the guys who praise themselves because they got 66/68 of the NCAA tourney teams "correct" (despite all the autobids, and sure shots.. whooopty-do)

So what exactly was your guess of "500 or more than 500 less than that" based on then.  Now its 1000 - what changed?

[Benny B]

Can I just say that you guys argue about the stupidest crap?

Actually, to the extent that i) a school is in control of >67% of its OOC schedule and ii) your OOC schedule can make or break your chances of an at-large tourney bid, I would say the topic of scheduling and RPI is pretty much the complete opposite of "stupid crap."

[Jay Bee]

So what exactly was your guess of "500 or more than 500 less than that" based on then.  Now its 1000 - what changed?

Nothing at all has changed.

That wasn't my guess. Hilltopper said there was "zero chance" of there being 500 less. I disagreed. There is a chance.. and what if it's double that? Is there a chance it's 1,000? Yes.

Is it 500? Is it 1,000? Is it more? I don't know. Any of them are possible.

What I do not believe is that there is "zero chance" of there being 500 less.

[Dawson Rental]

Can I just say that you guys argue about the stupidest crap?

Disagreeing is one thing, but when it's accompanied by a slap down... well, the discussion tends to continue.

[warriorchick]

Actually, to the extent that i) a school is in control of >67% of its OOC schedule and ii) your OOC schedule can make or break your chances of an at-large tourney bid, I would say the topic of scheduling and RPI is pretty much the complete opposite of "stupid crap."

That's not the only argument happening in this thread -- or on this board.

So glad I am a chick; I never feel the need to assert that my Johnson is bigger than everyone else's.

[Benny B]

That's not the only argument happening in this thread -- or on this board.

So glad I am a chick; I never feel the need to assert that my Johnson is bigger than everyone else's.

We're glad, too.  When arguing, men throw a few punches and then it's over; women, however, grab, claw, scratch, pull, kick, gouge and bite... seven things that don't belong anywhere in the vicinity of a johnson-measuring contest.

[brewcity77]

I am completely confident walk-ups for Grambling were less than 200, and I feel fairly confident it was less than half that. My reasoning is because all the season tickets were sold and looking around the stadium, at least 90% of the fans were in the lower bowl and the vast majority of the pittance of people in the upper bowl seats were in the center sections.

All of the lower bowl seats are season ticket holders, so there weren't walk-ups in those seats, and the vast majority of center upper bowl seats are also STHs. The walk-up tickets are higher up in the corners and end zones. Quite simply, where the people were sitting to start the game were not in the seats that are available for walk-up purchase. Now some may have admittedly bought them and moved, but usually those moves are made after the tip and they at least start in the right section. Those sections were vacant, hence I am confident the number of walk-ups was minimal.

[Jay Bee]

I am completely confident walk-ups for Grambling were less than 200, and I feel fairly confident it was less than half that. My reasoning is because all the season tickets were sold and looking around the stadium, at least 90% of the fans were in the lower bowl and the vast majority of the pittance of people in the upper bowl seats were in the center sections.

All of the lower bowl seats are season ticket holders, so there weren't walk-ups in those seats, and the vast majority of center upper bowl seats are also STHs. The walk-up tickets are higher up in the corners and end zones. Quite simply, where the people were sitting to start the game were not in the seats that are available for walk-up purchase. Now some may have admittedly bought them and moved, but usually those moves are made after the tip and they at least start in the right section. Those sections were vacant, hence I am confident the number of walk-ups was minimal.

Let's be careful here with language. Are you saying you're "completely confident" that MU had at least 11,418 season tickets sold last season?

Your analysis has its faults. Big ones.

Could your conclusion - if it's "11,418 or more season tickets were sold for last season" - be correct? It's in play.

However, your analysis doesn't get me any closer to believing it.

[brewcity77]

Let's be careful here with language. Are you saying you're "completely confident" that MU had at least 11,418 season tickets sold last season?

Your analysis has its faults. Big ones.

Could your conclusion - if it's "11,418 or more season tickets were sold for last season" - be correct? It's in play.

However, your analysis doesn't get me any closer to believing it.

I could care less about the numbers. Someone pulled 11,418 from somewhere and I could not care less. There were not fans in the end zones or the corners. They simply weren't there. It was a terribly attended game. Between the opponent, the lousy weather, and the day of week coupled with timing, people didn't show up. STHs didn't show up and sure as hell there weren't many walking up.

You can quibble about language all you like, but you weren't there. The BC looked more sparsely populated than some of the vacant buildings we have in the 53206. If you want to say there were 500 walk-ups there, then you're asserting more than 10% of the total attendance was walk-up purchases, because no matter what number Marquette spits out for sold tickets, there weren't more than 5,000 in the building.