The redemptive power of a national championship

[tower912]

http://www.sbnation.com/college-basketball/2016/4/28/11393336/big-east-villanova-national-championship-college-basketball?_ga=1.51291629.578450420.1461936919

Another take that this legitimizes the Big East and its path.   Now, giddyup, Wojo. 

[muwarrior69]

http://www.sbnation.com/college-basketball/2016/4/28/11393336/big-east-villanova-national-championship-college-basketball?_ga=1.51291629.578450420.1461936919

Another take that this legitimizes the Big East and its path.   Now, giddyup, Wojo.

This coming season will tell us what kind of coach we have in Wojo; but I am willing to give him 2 more seasons to see if we are on the right track. Even Jay Wright started out at Nova not making the big dance his first 3 seasons.

http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/coaches/jay-wright-1.html

[Galway Eagle]

This coming season will tell us what kind of coach we have in Wojo; but I am willing to give him 2 more seasons to see if we are on the right track. Even Jay Wright started out at Nova not making the big dance his first 3 seasons.

http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/coaches/jay-wright-1.html

If he doesn't make it this year I'd be done.  Might be willing to let him try for a fourth year but even without Gill we return 4 double digit scorers and have two double digit scoring transfers coming, if we land Gill that's more than enough offense that there's no excuse. 

[brewcity77]

This article really captures my feelings from that night. The past few years of being viewed as the red-headed stepchild of college basketball despite mostly dominating non-con play and putting teams into the Dance was irritating, as were the dismissive comments from (locally) Big 10 fans who instantly felt our league had become a mid-major.

Well...we're a mid-major with more titles than them in the past 15 years, and that's only including our current members. What a bunch of pudwhacks...if the Big 10 should feel lucky that we were willing to play the Gavitt Games against them. They are the ones that need their conference to be legitimized.

[naginiF]

Thanks for sharing the article....

First comment (sort of the only one):
10 schools to 12
Saint Louis University and the University of Dayton should be invited both are like-minded universities.

by Boyee on Apr 28, 2016 | 1:23 PM reply

Which Scooper is trolling SB Nation under the name 'Boyee'?

[GoldenWarrior11]

Thanks for sharing the article....

First comment (sort of the only one):
10 schools to 12
Saint Louis University and the University of Dayton should be invited both are like-minded universities.

by Boyee on Apr 28, 2016 | 1:23 PM reply

Which Scooper is trolling SB Nation under the name 'Boyee'?

He's also poster on the Holy Land of Hoops site.  He's long been an advocate of those two schools.  He's not as bad as another poster who has, for over a year, argued that the best fit for the Big East to elevate their status is... St. Bonaventure.   

[MU82]

If he doesn't make it this year I'd be done.  Might be willing to let him try for a fourth year but even without Gill we return 4 double digit scorers and have two double digit scoring transfers coming, if we land Gill that's more than enough offense that there's no excuse.

Wojo should feel honored that you and muwarrior69 are so "patient" with him.

69 comes right out and shows how Wright did nothing for 3 seasons. It should be noted that Wright also did nothing for his 4 years at Hofstra.

Wright is proof that it takes time to build a program. Either that, or he's a lousy coach.

[Loose Cannon]

If he doesn't make it this year I'd be done.  Might be willing to let him try for a fourth year but even without Gill we return 4 double digit scorers and have two double digit scoring transfers coming, if we land Gill that's more than enough offense that there's no excuse.

Offense OK......How's the Defense Lookin'?

[GGGG]

If he doesn't make it this year I'd be done.  Might be willing to let him try for a fourth year but even without Gill we return 4 double digit scorers and have two double digit scoring transfers coming, if we land Gill that's more than enough offense that there's no excuse. 

That's nice.  But Wojo will be hear for year four unless next year is a complete disaster.

[Benny B]

So.... do we cheer for Kris Jenkins when he's introduced at the BMO next year?

[Galway Eagle]

Wojo should feel honored that you and muwarrior69 are so "patient" with him.

69 comes right out and shows how Wright did nothing for 3 seasons. It should be noted that Wright also did nothing for his 4 years at Hofstra.

Wright is proof that it takes time to build a program. Either that, or he's a lousy coach.

I'm confused are you saying it takes te same amount of time to build up Marquette as it does Hofstra? Somehow I think it should be a little easier. 

I hope he's honored I expect every coach to want to meet my personal expectations!

[GGGG]

I'm confused are you saying it takes te same amount of time to build up Marquette as it does Hofstra? Somehow I think it should be a little easier.

Competition is harder.  I don't think it is easier or harder.  It just takes time.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Respect the process.

[MU82]

I'm confused are you saying it takes te same amount of time to build up Marquette as it does Hofstra? Somehow I think it should be a little easier. 

I hope he's honored I expect every coach to want to meet my personal expectations!

Hofstra was a side note.

It is no easier or harder to build a winner there within the constraints of its conference, etc.

You know what I was saying. Wright, whom we'll all agree is a fine coach, didn't win in his first four seasons as a college coach at Hofstra. Nor did he do anything in his first three seasons after stepping up in competition at Nova, even though he had considerable experience as a college head coach.

There are few "boy wonders," especially at our level, and especially given the state of the program Wojo inherited.

I love the "I'll give him three years" or "He better do it this year" talk.

It suggests an "... or else."

Which makes me want to respond "Or else what?"

As Sultan said, unless the 2016-17 season is an unmitigated disaster, Wojo will be back for 2017-18.

[Galway Eagle]

Hofstra was a side note.

It is no easier or harder to build a winner there within the constraints of its conference, etc.

You know what I was saying. Wright, whom we'll all agree is a fine coach, didn't win in his first four seasons as a college coach at Hofstra. Nor did he do anything in his first three seasons after stepping up in competition at Nova, even though he had considerable experience as a college head coach.

There are few "boy wonders," especially at our level, and especially given the state of the program Wojo inherited.

I love the "I'll give him three years" or "He better do it this year" talk.

It suggests an "... or else."

Which makes me want to respond "Or else what?"

As Sultan said, unless the 2016-17 season is an unmitigated disaster, Wojo will be back for 2017-18.

Well I said the or else what, or else I'm done with Wojo and see y'all for the next coach whether that's the following year, or two years later. I don't know the state of Wrights rosters the first three years but I'm guessing he wasn't going after high level transfers like we are this season. If Rowsey, Reinhardt and possibly Gill weren't on the team then I'd be all for four or five years for Wojo to get his culture in the program but I think when you have as much offense as we might (particularly if we get Gill) then you don't have excuses. 

[brewcity77]

Pretty sure the "or else what" question is already be answered by the thousands of season ticket holders that are not renewing tickets and not attending games. The last thing Marquette wants to do is ask their fans what the "or else" is, because at this rate they won't be able to afford the answer. Especially when one of the people who has responded that way is Dick Strong.

[real chili 83]

Way to go Willie.

[MU82]

Pretty sure the "or else what" question is already be answered by the thousands of season ticket holders that are not renewing tickets and not attending games. The last thing Marquette wants to do is ask their fans what the "or else" is, because at this rate they won't be able to afford the answer. Especially when one of the people who has responded that way is Dick Strong.

Barring an epic collapse or some kind of scandal, Wojo ain't going anywhere after Season 3, so all of this talk is laughable. No matter how many "or else's" aren't sitting in the seats, he'll be back for Year 4.

Hopefully, we're a 24-win tourney team next season, but I really laugh at this crapola.

I mean, Coach K couldn't win at Duke in his first three years and Wright couldn't win at Nova (or Hofstra!) in his first three years, but Wojo is supposed to be Dean Smith.

Oh wait ... Dean went 66-47 with zero postseason tournament appearances in his first five years at UNC. He shoulda had his arse "or-else"-d the hell outta there!

[brewcity77]

Barring an epic collapse or some kind of scandal, Wojo ain't going anywhere after Season 3, so all of this talk is laughable. No matter how many "or else's" aren't sitting in the seats, he'll be back for Year 4.

Hopefully, we're a 24-win tourney team next season, but I really laugh at this crapola.

I mean, Coach K couldn't win at Duke in his first three years and Wright couldn't win at Nova (or Hofstra!) in his first three years, but Wojo is supposed to be Dean Smith.

Oh wait ... Dean went 66-47 with zero postseason tournament appearances in his first five years at UNC. He shoulda had his arse "or-else"-d the hell outta there!

I agree that Wojo won't be gone after this year. However if the fans continue to not attend, revenues continue to drop, and major donors continue to not show up for games and close their checkbooks, someone's going to end up losing their job and I have a feeling it won't be Lovell or Scholl.

If we get back to dancing, it's a moot point, but if we end up with another 13-20 win season like the last three and shut out of the postseason along with season tickets, attendance, and donor numbers continuing to decline, they'll have to do something sooner rather than later. It isn't just basketball that relies on the success of that program.

[Eldon]

So.... do we cheer for Kris Jenkins when he's introduced at the BMO next year?

I love it.

[MU82]

I agree that Wojo won't be gone after this year. However if the fans continue to not attend, revenues continue to drop, and major donors continue to not show up for games and close their checkbooks, someone's going to end up losing their job and I have a feeling it won't be Lovell or Scholl.

If we get back to dancing, it's a moot point, but if we end up with another 13-20 win season like the last three and shut out of the postseason along with season tickets, attendance, and donor numbers continuing to decline, they'll have to do something sooner rather than later. It isn't just basketball that relies on the success of that program.

Well of course there is a "breaking point." Don't know when that is and hope not to find out.

It's crazy to consider that in this day and age, Smith would have been fired and K either would have been gone or would have been on the extreme hot seat.

We are so disappointed when our coaches are "disloyal," but loyalty is only a one-way street to fans.

[brewcity77]

Well of course there is a "breaking point." Don't know when that is and hope not to find out.

It's crazy to consider that in this day and age, Smith would have been fired and K either would have been gone or would have been on the extreme hot seat.

We are so disappointed when our coaches are "disloyal," but loyalty is only a one-way street to fans.

For me, I didn't like the Wally thing. Now if he can graduate this summer, it will lessen my disappointment, but I'm not a fan of using a player like a human bargaining chip. Everyone can have their opinions on the matter, but that one didn't sit well with me. For anyone that has no problem with it, that's their prerogative, but in my personal opinion it reflects poorly on both Marquette and the coaching staff.

Because of that, I feel like we are in "win now" mode. I'm done respecting the process, and I've been as patient as anyone with this, and probably moreso than most. I don't like jettisoning a guy because he's outlived his usefulness. Nothing about Wally really changed. His other sport commitments didn't change, his value to the team didn't change, and I guarantee had Henry came back Wally would still be here.

I still have hope for Wojo, still want to see him turn it around, but as soon as he decided to hit the Ellenson Eject button, I got fed up with waiting. If he can't be patient enough to respect his own process, why should I? If we don't get a player in here to replace Wally who can start and lead us to the NCAA Tournament, what was the point of booting him in the first place?

Again...it's all down to opinion, but that action changed how I feel about the coaching staff and the direction of the program.

[naginiF]

For me, I didn't like the Wally thing. Now if he can graduate this summer, it will lessen my disappointment, but I'm not a fan of using a player like a human bargaining chip. Everyone can have their opinions on the matter, but that one didn't sit well with me. For anyone that has no problem with it, that's their prerogative, but in my personal opinion it reflects poorly on both Marquette and the coaching staff.

Because of that, I feel like we are in "win now" mode. I'm done respecting the process, and I've been as patient as anyone with this, and probably moreso than most. I don't like jettisoning a guy because he's outlived his usefulness. Nothing about Wally really changed. His other sport commitments didn't change, his value to the team didn't change, and I guarantee had Henry came back Wally would still be here.

I still have hope for Wojo, still want to see him turn it around, but as soon as he decided to hit the Ellenson Eject button, I got fed up with waiting. If he can't be patient enough to respect his own process, why should I? If we don't get a player in here to replace Wally who can start and lead us to the NCAA Tournament, what was the point of booting him in the first place?

Again...it's all down to opinion, but that action changed how I feel about the coaching staff and the direction of the program.

I may have missed something in regards to the bolded portions.  Do we know for sure that Wojo 'baited' Henry to MU by assuring Wally he would have a 2 year spot?  I've seen a lot of interpretation around: 1) "smoke and mirrors", 2) how scholarships are one year contracts, 3) Wally's desire to play vs. jump, 4) the recruiting tactics/acumen, 5) twitter unfollowing, and 6) etc., etc., ad nauseam.  But nothing of substance.

The "everyone does it"/"it's the way the game is played" perspective is completely wrong for the Marquette community and I'm in 100% agreement with you if we know something for sure.  however, if it is all conjecture and personal perspective (which i believe it is).......I choose to believe Wojo and the administration are true to their word and building a winner the right way.

Choose to believe the low road, I choose to believe the high....correct me if i'm wrong.

[brewcity77]

I was careful to state it was my opinion. You can interpret it however you like. I don't like how it went down.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

For me, I didn't like the Wally thing. Now if he can graduate this summer, it will lessen my disappointment, but I'm not a fan of using a player like a human bargaining chip. Everyone can have their opinions on the matter, but that one didn't sit well with me. For anyone that has no problem with it, that's their prerogative, but in my personal opinion it reflects poorly on both Marquette and the coaching staff.

Because of that, I feel like we are in "win now" mode. I'm done respecting the process, and I've been as patient as anyone with this, and probably moreso than most. I don't like jettisoning a guy because he's outlived his usefulness. Nothing about Wally really changed. His other sport commitments didn't change, his value to the team didn't change, and I guarantee had Henry came back Wally would still be here.

I still have hope for Wojo, still want to see him turn it around, but as soon as he decided to hit the Ellenson Eject button, I got fed up with waiting. If he can't be patient enough to respect his own process, why should I? If we don't get a player in here to replace Wally who can start and lead us to the NCAA Tournament, what was the point of booting him in the first place?

Again...it's all down to opinion, but that action changed how I feel about the coaching staff and the direction of the program.

But something did change. He got a year older and showed no improvement from year 1 to year 3. Wojo took a flier on a kid with elite athleticism hoping he could turn him into a basketball player. He wasn't able to do it. Same thing happened with Jamal Ferguson, Reggie Smith, Erik Williams, Yous Mbao, Jake Thomas (before Vander declared and we were desperate), Jamail Jones, Scott Christopherson (that was a mistake) and Patrick Hazel (well, he had other issue but would have been run off). And I don't have anything to base this on, but I don't think past coaches would have made sure that Wally had a scholarship to finish his degree and then transfer out.

I don't understand why Wally should get special treatment just because he has a famous brother. If someone is against anyone getting cut than I understand (don't agree because we cut players from teams as young as 5th grade). But there's no reason to be outraged about the Wally situation if all the previously cut players didn't deserve the same outrage.

The funniest thing about this situation to me, is that Wally is going to get the same amount of playing time for Marquette without a scholarship as he was going to get with one.