MLB Offseason

[jesmu84]

Lackey to the Cubs. 2 years. ~32mil

[jesmu84]

Greinke to D-backs. Wow

[buckchuckler]

Lackey to the Cubs. 2 years. ~32mil

Will it be worth watching to see what the cards do with the cubs draft pick?  Could be interesting.   Lackey looks like a hreat fit at what actually seems to be a cheap rate.  Which is crazy to say about 16 mil per year. 

Greinke, wow.  Every report was dodgers or giants.  I think this puts some serious parity in that division.  Just crazy money though

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Will it be worth watching to see what the cards do with the cubs draft pick?  Could be interesting.   Lackey looks like a hreat fit at what actually seems to be a cheap rate.  Which is crazy to say about 16 mil per year. 

Greinke, wow.  Every report was dodgers or giants.  I think this puts some serious parity in that division.  Just crazy money though

I assumed the Cubs wouldn't be in on guys like Greinke and Price one year after signing Lester and after seeing both of those contracts I have no issue with that.  Lackey will probably regress a bit but hopefully can be an effective #3.  I do love that it is only for two years, which should give them some flexibility. 

The Cubs lose their first round pick but the Cards don't actually get the Cubs pick at that spot - they just got a compensation pick, which they would have gotten anyway regardless of where Lackey signed.  Plus the Cubs will recoup a pick when Fowler likely signs elsewhere. 

I am stunned that Greinke signed with the DBacks.  LA, SF, and St. Louis all need pitching - very interested to see how it plays out. 

[buckchuckler]

I assumed the Cubs wouldn't be in on guys like Greinke and Price one year after signing Lester and after seeing both of those contracts I have no issue with that.  Lackey will probably regress a bit but hopefully can be an effective #3.  I do love that it is only for two years, which should give them some flexibility. 

The Cubs lose their first round pick but the Cards don't actually get the Cubs pick at that spot - they just got a compensation pick, which they would have gotten anyway regardless of where Lackey signed.  Plus the Cubs will recoup a pick when Fowler likely signs elsewhere. 

I am stunned that Greinke signed with the DBacks.  LA, SF, and St. Louis all need pitching - very interested to see how it plays out.

I know they don't actually get the Cubs pick, but I still think it will add some intrigue to the situation.  This works out very well for some mid tier pitchers that will be in very  high demand and make an absurd amount of money. 

[buckchuckler]

Samardzija to the Giants 5/90. 

[buckchuckler]

Cubs get Zobrist 4/56.  They also trade castro, who apparently didn't have much trade value;  Adam warren and Brendan Ryan.

[buckchuckler]

And now the DBacks get Shelby Miller.  They have a pretty great rotation. 

[buckchuckler]

Wow, Ender Incairte, Aaron Blair and Dansby Swanson going back to the Braves.  That's a pretty nice return. 

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Cubs get Zobrist 4/56.  They also trade castro, who apparently didn't have much trade value;  Adam warren and Brendan Ryan.

Castro traded to make room for Zobrist and save $ to allow for other moves.  Warren is an underrated piece, IMO. 

[tower912]

Very active offseason. 

[buckchuckler]

Castro traded to make room for Zobrist and save $ to allow for other moves.  Warren is an underrated piece, IMO.

He has value sure, but he is a swingman reliever.  Maybe he breaks out at 29 and fits into the rotation or the back of a bullpen, but swingman is where he has flourished. 

Trading Castro (26) at 8 mil per year for Zobrist (35) at 14 mil per year is a bit of an interesting challenge trade.  Obviously the Cubs think Castro's best days are behind him. 

Zobrist has averaged .274/.356/.413 (35 2b, 2 3b, and 12 hr) the last 3 seasons.  It isn't hard to imagine Castro surpassing those XBH numbers.  Castro is .265/.305/.383 (30/2/12) over the same period.  But one player is leaving his prime behind, as the other is approaching his.  Zobrist obviously brings better D, and better intangibles.  It will be interesting to see it play out.  You can count me in the camp that believes this makes the Cubs better next year and the year after.  Not sure after that.  They are attacking that playoff window, which is all you can ask.  Though, I can't believe more Cub fans aren't really ticked.  I can't even tell you how many times heard talk about how Castro is destined for the HOF. 

[Vander Blue Man Group]

He has value sure, but he is a swingman reliever.  Maybe he breaks out at 29 and fits into the rotation or the back of a bullpen, but swingman is where he has flourished. 

Trading Castro (26) at 8 mil per year for Zobrist (35) at 14 mil per year is a bit of an interesting challenge trade.  Obviously the Cubs think Castro's best days are behind him. 

Zobrist has averaged .274/.356/.413 (35 2b, 2 3b, and 12 hr) the last 3 seasons.  It isn't hard to imagine Castro surpassing those XBH numbers.  Castro is .265/.305/.383 (30/2/12) over the same period.  But one player is leaving his prime behind, as the other is approaching his.  Zobrist obviously brings better D, and better intangibles.  It will be interesting to see it play out.  You can count me in the camp that believes this makes the Cubs better next year and the year after.  Not sure after that.  They are attacking that playoff window, which is all you can ask.  Though, I can't believe more Cub fans aren't really ticked.  I can't even tell you how many times heard talk about how Castro is destined for the HOF.

Look at the difference in OPS and more specifically OBP. Zobrist is a switch-hitter who will likely be the lead off hitter next year. He brings contact ability to a team that Ks a lot. Castro certainly has more long-term value but he's superfluous on the team and shedding his salary will allow for other moves.

The are looking at a smaller window within a larger window, with Arrieta being under control for 2 more years and Lester being productive for 2 more years.

I don't love the moves but I completely understand them.

[🏀]

Castro is a sheer money and player dump. The guy was unmovable and on waivers last season.

[buckchuckler]

I don't love the moves but I completely understand them.

Completely agree, with everything in your post basically. 

[buckchuckler]

So remember when everyone called me basically a blind homer when I said I'd ask for the moon for Sale?  Including asking for  Urias, Seager and Pederson from the Dodgers?  Well, the Marlins reportedly asked for those 3 along with 2 other prospects for Jose Fernandez. 

[NavinRJohnson]

Castro is a sheer money and player dump. The guy was unmovable and on waivers last season.

Sort of...the money doesn't matter. they needed to clear space for Zobrist, and got some needed bullpen help,in return. More about Zobrist though. Needed him to provide some desperately needed defensive help and lineup flexibility. He'll play everyday and help minimize the defensive shortcomings that lineup was facing by having the likes of Bryant, Schwarber, Soler all in there together.

Theyre still likley to sign a FA OFer, and trade for a SP. I still think a good chance Soler or Baez are moved for an upper half of the rotation SP. lackey helps, but rotation depth is still lacking.

[jesmu84]

Sort of...the money doesn't matter. they needed to clear space for Zobrist, and got some needed bullpen help,in return. More about Zobrist though. Needed him to provide some desperately needed defensive help and lineup flexibility. He'll play everyday and help minimize the defensive shortcomings that lineup was facing by having the likes of Bryant, Schwarber, Soler all in there together.

Theyre still likley to sign a FA OFer, and trade for a SP. I still think a good chance Soler or Baez are moved for an upper half of the rotation SP. lackey helps, but rotation depth is still lacking.

Rumors this morning of pretty in-depth talks between Cubs/Rays. Players involved: Cobb, McGee, Baez, Szczur, Villanueva, Vogelbach

[wadesworld]

Lucroy and Lind being discussed with the Mariners?  Can we send Braun along and pay half of his salary please?  Maybe throw in Segura while we're at it?

[JWags85]

Though, I can't believe more Cub fans aren't really ticked.  I can't even tell you how many times heard talk about how Castro is destined for the HOF.

Who the hell has thought that?  Castro is what he is, a talented hitter who gets hot and makes up for his lazy deficiencies elsewhere.  I loved this year when he'd get on a run just when everyone was getting sick of his lack of production, but he's superflous as people have said.  I know more people that hated Castro than thought he was the second coming.  Maybe when he came up.  He showed so much promise.

I will miss his walk up music.  Not enough fire emojis to accurately describe it.

[WI inferiority Complexes]

Though, I can't believe more Cub fans aren't really ticked.  I can't even tell you how many times heard talk about how Castro is destined for the HOF.

For me, number of times I have heard that Castro was destined for the HOF is zero.

The rest of the post makes a lot of good points. Castro is still young, and can be a solid player for years after Zobrist is ineffective. One thing Zobrist brings is leadoff ability, meaning the Cubs can search for a CF who doesn't have to bat first.

[buckchuckler]

Who the hell has thought that?  Castro is what he is, a talented hitter who gets hot and makes up for his lazy deficiencies elsewhere.  I loved this year when he'd get on a run just when everyone was getting sick of his lack of production, but he's superflous as people have said.  I know more people that hated Castro than thought he was the second coming.  Maybe when he came up.  He showed so much promise.

I will miss his walk up music.  Not enough fire emojis to accurately describe it.

Were you around after his 200 hit season (age 21)?  It was all the rage to talk about him as a future HOFer.  I believe B&B spent a great deal of time talking about it on the Score.  I remember the conversation well because that is just about when I decided that I was done listening to those clowns. 

[JWags85]

Were you around after his 200 hit season (age 21)?  It was all the rage to talk about him as a future HOFer.  I believe B&B spent a great deal of time talking about it on the Score.  I remember the conversation well because that is just about when I decided that I was done listening to those clowns.

Well there we go, as I said, there was excitement about his promise early, but I don't listen to much Chicago sports radio, cause I can't stand Chicago meatball sports fans, and I say that as a fan.  Just more referring to the years since.  Same as the idiots who were slobbering over Soriano when he was first signed but weren't sad to see him go.

[🏀]

Were you around after his 200 hit season (age 21)?  It was all the rage to talk about him as a future HOFer.  I believe B&B spent a great deal of time talking about it on the Score.  I remember the conversation well because that is just about when I decided that I was done listening to those clowns. 

So you're saying it was incorrect to project a 21 year-old, who in his first full major league season had 207 hits, made the all-star team and got MVP votes as a potential hall of famer? His downfalls were defense and personal life, things you thought could have been cleaned up, but weren't.

I'd say that it certainty should have been the rage to talk about Castro as a HOFer.

Most similar players through the age of 25:
Jim Fregosi (945)
Edgar Renteria (939)
Zoilo Versalles (927)
Alan Trammell (922)
Robin Yount (917) *
Travis Jackson (912) *
Jose Reyes (911)
Bill Mazeroski (909) *
Dick Bartell (906)
Jimmy Rollins (906)

There's three HOFers and Fregosi would have been one if not for injuries.

I wasn't talking Starlin would be a HOFer, but to say a conversation at that point wasn't warranted isn't correct. Same thing everyone wanted to do with Abreu last season.

[Lennys Tap]

Were you around after his 200 hit season (age 21)?  It was all the rage to talk about him as a future HOFer.  I believe B&B spent a great deal of time talking about it on the Score.  I remember the conversation well because that is just about when I decided that I was done listening to those clowns.

Young guys that can hit (even undisciplined young guys who can hit) are rare and really coveted. Castro could hit. If only, the logic went, he can learn the strike zone - he'll be a superstar. Not only didn't he learn plate discipline, he still doesn't even know how many outs there are a good deal of the time. He's the antithesis of a guy like Zobrist, where the whole is substantially greater than the sum of the parts. Theo has been trying to dump him for some time.