[Paint Touches] The art of passing: Derrick Wilson

[real chili 83]

bilsu, I cant wait to see MU beat UW again but my point was that we cant put so much weight on that one game. Its the overall pattern of derricks game. My opinion is that he needs to have a few more assists a game to make his teammates better and needs to be more of a scoring threat. As for teamdee, you may be right but then again a talent like duane is hard to keep on the bench.

I'm with bilsu.

[raul]

What are you in agreement with bilsu, realichili ? That the only game that matters is the UW game?

[bilsu]

What are you in agreement with bilsu, realichili ? That the only game that matters is the UW game?

No one said that was the only game that matters. The post that I said "I do" to started out " Who cares about the UW game" I think every MU fan does.

[MU82]

A point guard scoring zero in a win is great. A point guard scoring 15 in a loss is not. the only thing that matters is whether the team wins or not. It is not that I have high hopes for Derrick's game taking a significant jump, it is that I thing you guys are expecting to much out of a freshmen.

Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson and Doug Williams won Super Bowls.

Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and Dan Fouts did not.

Ipso fatso, Dilfer, Johnson and Williams were better quarterbacks than Marino, Kelly and Fouts.

[brewcity77]

I think Derrick could make a jump this year. He'll likely have more opportunity and confidence from the staff. Somewhat sink or swim time. At the end of the day, winning is what matters. Sometimes it's not about being the best player, it's about being the best player for the team. If Gardner, Jamil, Mayo, McKay, Taylor, and others can score, Derrick won't have to be a high-scoring player to be effective. I'd rather have Derrick start, average 4.0 ppg, and help MU to a Final Four or even NC than have Duane start, average 14.0 ppg, and go out the first weekend.

[raul]

Bilsu, you did notice that I said  " I looked forward to MU beating UW again"? My point is very simple. One game doesn't make a player. The fact that MU won vs UW  with Derrick who had zero points and zero assists doesn't mean that MU won because of him. Maybe just maybe MU won despite of him. Zero points and zero assists for a point g. in a program that prides itself on its guards is not a good sign for future success. Sure De. can improve and I hope he does but the fact is other players that are coming up are waiting for their chance.

[MarquetteDano]

Lot of focus on his assists and points but not a lot of mention that Synergy had him as our best man-to-man defender.  That goes a long way with Buzz.  I think De. Wilson averages at least 20+ minutes per game.

I agree that he has to show he scan score some just to keep the defenses honest.  I am most worried about that free throw shooting.  That will kill us in end of game scenarios.  I hope he spent a lot of time on the charity stripe during the off-season.

[bilsu]

I do not think it is imprortant for Derrick to score. However, he needs to improve his distributing and make free throws.

[GGGG]

I do not think it is imprortant for Derrick to score. However, he needs to improve his distributing and make free throws.

He needs to score more to keep defenses honest....  He needs to set up other scorers more consistently...  He needs to keep defending like he has previously.

If he does all of that, he will be fine.  You don't need scoring from all five positions on the court.  You simply need him to create.

[willie warrior]

He needs to score more to keep defenses honest....  He needs to set up other scorers more consistently...  He needs to keep defending like he has previously.

If he does all of that, he will be fine.  You don't need scoring from all five positions on the court.  You simply need him to create.

For once I agree with you Skink. He needs to create, but it is not simple. If he can score 6 points pg and average 5 assists, and make 67%+ FT he will be a valuable contributor. I do believe that Du. Wilson will do significantly better though if given the minutes.

[bilsu]

For once I agree with you Skink. He needs to create, but it is not simple. If he can score 6 points pg and average 5 assists, and make 67%+ FT he will be a valuable contributor. I do believe that Du. Wilson will do significantly better though if given the minutes.

Diener average 6.8 (by memory) points as a freshmen and maybe Duane will score more, but I will not bet my life on it. My expectations are that if they each played 20 minutes Derrick would average 2 points and Duane would average 7, so in either case we are not going to get a lot of points out of the point guard position.  The two combined will probably average less than 10 per game. Last year Derrick average 1.1 points in 13 minutes, so 2 points in 20 is reasonable. Cadougon averaged 8.5, which means they combined by 9.6 points a game.

[GGGG]

Diener average 6.8 (by memory) points as a freshmen and maybe Duane will score more, but I will not bet my life on it. My expectations are that if they each  played 20 minutes Derrick would average 2 points and Duane would average 7, so in either case we are not going to get a lot of points out of the point guard position.  The two combined will probably average less than 10 per game.

That is a pretty safe bet.  The last time our PG combinations averaged > 10 PPG it was 2010-11 when Buycks and Cadougan averaged 12.8.

And we don't really even know yet who the second PG is going to be.

[MU82]

I'd rather have Derrick start, average 4.0 ppg, and help MU to a Final Four or even NC than have Duane start, average 14.0 ppg, and go out the first weekend.

Why is this the either-or choice? Can't Duane start, average 14 ppg and we go to the Final Four? Can't Derrick start, average 4 ppg and we not even make the NCAAs? Or something in between these two extremes?

[Lennys Tap]

For once I agree with you Skink. He needs to create, but it is not simple. If he can score 6 points pg and average 5 assists, and make 67%+ FT he will be a valuable contributor. I do believe that Du. Wilson will do significantly better though if given the minutes.

That's Junior Cadougan with great defense. Sign me up for that!

[brewcity77]

Why is this the either-or choice? Can't Duane start, average 14 ppg and we go to the Final Four? Can't Derrick start, average 4 ppg and we not even make the NCAAs? Or something in between these two extremes?

It's not automatic. But anyone that thinks Derrick's experience and defense doesn't have value is being silly. Buzz will almost certainly give Derrick a ton of rope as his starting PG.

It's funny that last year people were calling for Derrick to replace Junior, now people are calling for Duane to replace Derrick. Come to think of it, weren't people calling for Junior to replace Buycks too a few years back?

I wonder how long it will be before MU fans are calling for Sandy or Nick to replace Duane.

[GGGG]

It's not automatic. But anyone that thinks Derrick's experience and defense doesn't have value is being silly. Buzz will almost certainly give Derrick a ton of rope as his starting PG.

It's funny that last year people were calling for Derrick to replace Junior, now people are calling for Duane to replace Derrick. Come to think of it, weren't people calling for Junior to replace Buycks too a few years back?

I wonder how long it will be before MU fans are calling for Sandy or Nick to replace Duane.

I think Mike Flory should start at point right now.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

It's not automatic. But anyone that thinks Derrick's experience and defense doesn't have value is being silly. Buzz will almost certainly give Derrick a ton of rope as his starting PG.

It's funny that last year people were calling for Derrick to replace Junior, now people are calling for Duane to replace Derrick. Come to think of it, weren't people calling for Junior to replace Buycks too a few years back?

I wonder how long it will be before MU fans are calling for Sandy or Nick to replace Duane.

Fans are idiots.

Prior to last season, several people were saying that Mayo should get Vander's minutes.

I'm sure there is some sort of deep psychological reason, but fans just seem to love "new" because they assume it's "better".

Derrick has flaws, but he can be a solid rotation player for this team. Juan falls in the same category.

Also, I can see a situation where Derrick and Duane are complementary players, similar to Otule and Gardner. That seems to have worked out well for MU.

[willie warrior]

That's Junior Cadougan with great defense. Sign me up for that!

You are signed up--the question is can he do those things?

[Sunbelt15]

Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson and Doug Williams won Super Bowls.

Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and Dan Fouts did not.

Ipso fatso, Dilfer, Johnson and Williams were better quarterbacks than Marino, Kelly and Fouts.

Don't put Doug Williams in the same light as those guys. Williams was a monster that year, not just throwing five yard passes. Word was, Washington's owner did not want to sign a black quarterback long term.

[bilsu]

Fans only see the obvious, which tends to be measurables such as scoring, turnovers, rebounds, assists, block shots, etc. We often do not see the unmeasurable things that Buzz does. Knowing the plays, being in position, making the correct pass, directing teammates, etc. Buzz often said last year how important Lockett was and talked about his intelligence.
When he talked about Lockett's intelligence my thoughts always went back to Lockett fouling Wennington (Georgetown) on three point shot at end of game, which did not seem to intelligent to me. Now Lockett has an NBA contract and I did not see that coming.  Last year Buzz got real excited about Blue taking his first charge. I bet no one on this board knew that Blue had not taken a charge prior to that. We can see that Duane is quicker than Derrick and also a better scorer and passer. We generally will not know that Duane went left when Buzz wanted him to go right or chose to cover the wrong player.

[GGGG]

Don't put Doug Williams in the same light as those guys. Williams was a monster that year, not just throwing five yard passes. Word was, Washington's owner did not want to sign a black quarterback long term.

This is not accurate.

He only started two games in the regular season the year they won the Super Bowl.  He was the back up to Jay Schroeder and when Schroeder went out injured, he replaced him and caught fire.

Doug Williams was on the team the next two years, suffered injuries, didn't play very well, and was eventually replaced by Mark Rypien.

And the Skins at the time were owned by Jack Kent Cooke, who was far from a racist.  Probably one of the most decent men involved in sports ownership.  

[MU82]

It's not automatic. But anyone that thinks Derrick's experience and defense doesn't have value is being silly. Buzz will almost certainly give Derrick a ton of rope as his starting PG.

It's funny that last year people were calling for Derrick to replace Junior, now people are calling for Duane to replace Derrick. Come to think of it, weren't people calling for Junior to replace Buycks too a few years back?

I wonder how long it will be before MU fans are calling for Sandy or Nick to replace Duane.

For the record, I NEVER was calling for Derrick to replace Junior, and I don't believe I was alone among Marquette fans. Most of us know that the PG has to at least threaten to score a few times per game. The only guy who regularly talked about Derrick replacing Junior was Buzz, and he just did it to motivate Junior. If he actually thought Derrick would have given us a better chance to win, Buzz would have gone with Derrick.

But I do get your point ... fans like new and shiny. That's why the most popular player on many (usually losing) football teams is the backup quarterback. Fans love him ... until he actually has to play.

My problem with your post (and others like it) is that it presents a false choice, saying the only option is winning with Derrick not scoring vs. losing with Duane (or some other PG) scoring.

Fact is, there are many other ways for us to win or lose next season, brew, and I'm sure you know that.

Oh, and I'm quite confident we will be winning a lot of games if Duane Wilson has beaten out Derrick Wilson and is scoring 14 ppg.

[ATL MU Warrior]

For the record, I NEVER was calling for Derrick to replace Junior, and I don't believe I was alone among Marquette fans. Most of us know that the PG has to at least threaten to score a few times per game. The only guy who regularly talked about Derrick replacing Junior was Buzz, and he just did it to motivate Junior. If he actually thought Derrick would have given us a better chance to win, Buzz would have gone with Derrick.

But I do get your point ... fans like new and shiny. That's why the most popular player on many (usually losing) football teams is the backup quarterback. Fans love him ... until he actually has to play.

My problem with your post (and others like it) is that it presents a false choice, saying the only option is winning with Derrick not scoring vs. losing with Duane (or some other PG) scoring.

Fact is, there are many other ways for us to win or lose next season, brew, and I'm sure you know that.

Oh, and I'm quite confident we will be winning a lot of games if Duane Wilson has beaten out Derrick Wilson and is scoring 14 ppg.

And we'll be winning a lot of games if Derrick starts and averages 5 points a game.  This team is deep with multiple scoring options.  We don't need a PG that dominates the ball *not saying that Duane is that type of PG* we need a PG that distributes, can at least be a threat to score and plays solid D.  Personally, I think Derrick can be that guy.  But, whoever starts, I believe they will split time pretty evenly and that we are fine at the PG position.  Time will tell. 

[Lennys Tap]

You are signed up--the question is can he do those things?

I agree Willie - Derrick has done nothing yet to prove he can do any of that other than the great defense.