[PaintTouches]Sources: Blue considering NBA draft

[dwaderoy2004]

Totally wrong.  He would have been a first rounder had he declared.  Dom James is the perfect example of a kid who should have declared when his stock was high.  He didn't and he paid for it.

IN what way am I totally wrong?  It is of my opinion that had he actually declared, his stock would have dropped considerably once scouts had a chance to work him out and measure his actual height.  Where's your proof that he would have absolutely, positively been a first rounder?

[Rockmic87]

Totally wrong.  He would have been a first rounder had he declared.  Dom James is the perfect example of a kid who should have declared when his stock was high.  He didn't and he paid for it.

Actually your wrong. He was smart to listen to the scouts and return!

http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2007/02/nbadraftnet-to-dominic-james-stay-in.html

[jesmu84]

+1

He should be able to head back to school unless he signs a contract.  So can get drafted (or not), workout with the team, get invited as a free-agent to camp, and still go back as long as you do not sign a pro-contract.

I think the NBA/NCAA put a stop to this. Now players have to declare/sign an agent the day before the spring signing period begins (april 16?). They can't go through anything before giving up amateur status.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I expected this.

If he is projected in the first round, he should go.

Second round? He should stay.

I suspect he'll be at MU next year... but I'm not an NBA scout.

[LAZER]

While I would agree that his stock is currently at an all time high, that all time high status is currently fringe first rounder.  He could certainly come back and hit a new all time high next year of guaranteed first rounder.  I guess I just disagree that he could only hurt his draft stock by coming back.  I concur that if he's hearing definitively that he will be drafted, he should strongly consider declaring.  

I don't think he's close to being a fringe first rounder, I think he's much closer to a fringe second rounder.  I think it's too big of a risk for him to go.  If he continues to improve his shot, he can have a real nice shot at being a first round pick.

[jesmu84]

Actually your wrong. He was smart to listen to the scouts and return!

http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2007/02/nbadraftnet-to-dominic-james-stay-in.html

Please note, this crackedsidewalks article is based on James declaring after his sophomore year. I believe the poster was saying James would have been drafted after his freshman year. Which is also what I thought was true.

[Ellenson Guerrero]

I think the NBA/NCAA put a stop to this. Now players have to declare/sign an agent the day before the spring signing period begins (april 16?). They can't go through anything before giving up amateur status.

The comment you quoted was a normative one rather than a positive one.

[dwaderoy2004]

As you'll see here, James was not projected to be drafted after his freshman year, otherwise he would have a 2006 draft mock history.  He was, however, projected to go in the first round during and after his sophomore year.  Until, of course, he declared, was exposed, and his stock dropped considerably, thus forcing him to withdraw from the draft.

If he was exposed after his sophomore year, he would have been exposed after his freshman year, too.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Dominic-James-595/mock-draft-history/

[warriorchick]

+1

He should be able to head back to school unless he signs a contract.  So can get drafted (or not), workout with the team, get invited as a free-agent to camp, and still go back as long as you do not sign a pro-contract.

Not sure how much influence the NBA owners have in determining the rules, but they would not go for this at all.  It would make it very risky to draft anyone who still has eligibilty left.  The high picks would use it as a bargaining chip ("You don't want to pay me what I want?  Fine. I will just go back to school and get drafted by someone else next year").  And the further down in the draft your picks are, the less likely you are to get a non-senior to sign a contract for any amount.

[avid1010]

IN what way am I totally wrong?  It is of my opinion that had he actually declared, his stock would have dropped considerably once scouts had a chance to work him out and measure his actual height.  Where's your proof that he would have absolutely, positively been a first rounder?

i don't know that i disagree with you, but the reason for him to leave early would have been what he did in his freshman year AND the potential for him to get better.  he played great as a freshman, and had great strength and athleticism.  he essentially would have forced NBA teams to decide if they felt he could develop an outside shot and maximize his potential.  in staying at MU for three more year, and really not improving on his outside shot, NBA teams felt that he had reached his peak.  

in some ways Vander is in the same situation.  if he can come back and hit the three next year, he's in great shape...if he can't, he's in a worse spot then he is in now.  

[buckchuckler]

As you'll see here, James was not projected to be drafted after his freshman year, otherwise he would have a 2006 draft mock history.  He was, however, projected to go in the first round during and after his sophomore year.  Until, of course, he declared, was exposed, and his stock dropped considerably, thus forcing him to withdraw from the draft.

If he was exposed after his sophomore year, he would have been exposed after his freshman year, too.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Dominic-James-595/mock-draft-history/

Oh yay.  Another thread turned into a pissing match about something the thread wasn't about.  

[muwarrior69]

If he goes it solves our 1 over scholarship issue. Rather see this than some kid transfers and all the speculation he got "Buzzed". Seems like a win win, especially if he gets drafted by the 2nd round.

[dwaderoy2004]

i don't know that i disagree with you, but the reason for him to leave early would have been what he did in his freshman year AND the potential for him to get better.  he played great as a freshman, and had great strength and athleticism.  he essentially would have forced NBA teams to decide if they felt he could develop an outside shot and maximize his potential.  in staying at MU for three more year, and really not improving on his outside shot, NBA teams felt that he had reached his peak.  

in some ways Vander is in the same situation.  if he can come back and hit the three next year, he's in great shape...if he can't, he's in a worse spot then he is in now.  

I agree with the first part.  But teams don't usually use first round picks on sub-6 foot PG's that can't shoot.  If they drafted him on potential, it would have been as a 2nd round pick.

And yes, I agree that Vander and James' situation are similar, which is why it was brought up in the first place.

[Tugg Speedman]

Not sure how much influence the NBA owners have in determining the rules, but they would not go for this at all.  It would make it very risky to draft anyone who still has eligibilty left.  The high picks would use it as a bargaining chip ("You don't want to pay me what I want?  Fine. I will just go back to school and get drafted by someone else next year").  And the further down in the draft your picks are, the less likely you are to get a non-senior to sign a contract for any amount.

I agree the owners would not want this as you explain.  But the NCAA should do what's best for the kids, not the billionaire owners.

[jesmu84]

I agree the owners would not want this as you explain.  But the NCAA should do what's best for the kids, not the billionaire owners.

When was the last time the NCAA did what's best for the kids?

[MerrittsMustache]

Not sure how much influence the NBA owners have in determining the rules, but they would not go for this at all.  It would make it very risky to draft anyone who still has eligibilty left.  The high picks would use it as a bargaining chip ("You don't want to pay me what I want?  Fine. I will just go back to school and get drafted by someone else next year").  And the further down in the draft your picks are, the less likely you are to get a non-senior to sign a contract for any amount.

The MLB Draft works somewhat similarly. Although, that draft has about 200 rounds.

[MUCrew]

Go if you're a lock in the first round.  Come back, otherwise.

Blue is really REALLY close to being a shoe-in for the first round, imo.  He's also really young for his class and his maturity relative to the game was showing more and more as the season progressed.  I personally think he should come back because he still has the ability to show tremendous improvement.  

But someone here said it right: one freak injury or a senior season that shows no improvement will cost his chances.  

[4everwarriors]

He gone

[Groin_pull]

Blue can do what he wants, but he's fooling himself if he thinks he's a first round pick...even in a weak draft.

[Groin_pull]

Go if you're a lock in the first round.  Come back, otherwise.

Blue is really REALLY close to being a shoe-in for the first round, imo.  He's also really young for his class and his maturity relative to the game was showing more and more as the season progressed.  I personally think he should come back because he still has the ability to show tremendous improvement.  

But someone here said it right: one freak injury or a senior season that shows no improvement will cost his chances.  

Yeah, NBA teams are dying for a 6'3" two-guard without a consistent jumper.

[Dawson Rental]

As you'll see here, James was not projected to be drafted after his freshman year, otherwise he would have a 2006 draft mock history.  He was, however, projected to go in the first round during and after his sophomore year.  Until, of course, he declared, was exposed, and his stock dropped considerably, thus forcing him to withdraw from the draft.

If he was exposed after his sophomore year, he would have been exposed after his freshman year, too.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Dominic-James-595/mock-draft-history/

He wasn't projected after his freshman year because he didn't declare after his freshman year.  His best year statistically at MU was his freshman year and he had the Big East newcomers of the year award.  Maybe he wouldn't have been a first rounder, but it was they year in which without a doubt he would have been drafted highest.

[LAZER]

Go if you're a lock in the first round.  Come back, otherwise.

Blue is really REALLY close to being a shoe-in for the first round, imo.  He's also really young for his class and his maturity relative to the game was showing more and more as the season progressed.  I personally think he should come back because he still has the ability to show tremendous improvement.   

Is the really that close to being a first rounder?  Is really even that close to be being drafted?  I don't think I've seen one mock draft anywhere that has Blue being drafted this year, let alone the first round.

[Rockmic87]

He' staying. He may test the waters to get feedback. But he will be overseas if he declares. He would be smart to get his degree from MU before he left. I think Vander recognizes that going in the 2nd round does not guarantee a roster spot in the NBA, and that its likely he'd join DJO overseas.

[MDMU04]

There are 30 picks in the first round. Assuming all positions will be drafted in equal numbers (not likely, but close enough for discussion purposes) that leaves 6 draft slots for each guard position.

I love VB, but even in this draft class I don't believe he's in the top 6 at either guard position.

If you come out early and don't get the guaranteed contract, probably a bad decision.

[MU82]

Speculation is fun, and it's what these sites are for. However ...

Whether projecting Vander as a first-round shoo-in or a fringe second-rounder, nobody here has enough information to make such a call with any accuracy at all.

We don't know yet how many U.S. underclassmen will go pro. We have no clue about which international players will be available, what positions they play or how good they are. We have no idea whether NBA teams are looking more for backcourt or frontcourt help this season.

So while it's easy for us to put on our Marquette-vision goggles and say, "Hey, Vander is good," we have little sense of context. Right now, there are too many unknowns even for the experts.

Selfishly, I hope Vander stays. I think returning to MU and improving would benefit him most. But I certainly wouldn't blame him for leaving if he gets solid intel that he'll be a first-rounder.

And I agree with the many folks here: Obviously, neither the NCAA nor the NBA gives a rat's rump about the kids. They should be ashamed of themselves for the rule change that prevents athletes from getting a true read of what NBA teams think of them before they have to declare for the draft. But since when do NCAA and NBA honchos feel any shame?