Big East may sell name to C-7

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Honestly, the BoT could have come up with the most brilliant and unique nickname ever, and it would have never been given a fair chance.  I think everyone thought that they would cave and bring back "Warriors," and when they didn't, all hell broke loose.

This is why they should have just gone back to "hilltoppers" and hid behind "It's the original name." It's hard to argue with that logic.

The opportunity is lost now, but it seems painfully simple to me.

[GGGG]

This is why they should have just gone back to "hilltoppers" and hid behind "It's the original name." It's hard to argue with that logic.

The opportunity is lost now, but it seems painfully simple to me.

Yes.  Good call.  I would have preferred that, or Golden Avalanche, any day.  (And yeah, I know that Golden Avalanche was not an official nickname.)

[Classof83]

My suggestion: "The Big Priest"

[Benny B]

This is why they should have just gone back to "hilltoppers" and hid behind "It's the original name." It's hard to argue with that logic.

Big Red would-na ain't-n been too happy 'bout that.

[akmarq]

Big Red would-na ain't-n been too happy 'bout that.

Any day where I see Big Red is a good day.

[muhoosier260]

Uh, you may want to rephrase that...if you know what I mean

hahaha good call

[wiscwarrior]

Yes.  Good call.  I would have preferred that, or Golden Avalanche, any day.  (And yeah, I know that Golden Avalanche was not an official nickname.)

Isn't that "yellow snow"?

[mu03eng]

Correct.  But that is money they use to advertise, etc.  The BE does something similar, but again, that is something they would do anyway regardless if they have a new name or an old one.  The fact is that a conference isn't like a consumer product.

Let me put it this way, the C7 pull off this deal if:

Amount BE wants for name < new branding costs + current BE brand equity

The amount the BE wants will be known by all parties.  The new branding costs are likely going to be obvious as the C7 does more research, but I think you are throwing figures out there that are not apples and oranges comparisons.

The real issue is how much brand equity does the current BE brand have?  That is more of an unknown.

The brand equity of BE is absolutely the lynch pin in all this.  IMHO, over the last 12 months the brand has been dragged through the mud, with teams slashing their own wrists to get out, bringing sub-par teams, being referred to by ESPN(who has the media contract no less) as a shell of it's former self.

Keefe, I can't go through a refute all your numbers, but keep in mind things like advertising costs are already baked into the C7+ spending so largely the brand starting expense that is new spending is creating the name, logo, and associated collateral(mission statement, graphics, etc).  I think you could do this for $10mil pretty handily.

Put me squarely in the camp of I don't care if they offer to pay us to take the BE name, I don't want it.  Just call it something like Heartland Atheletic Conference and get it over with.  The Fox contract/promotion will handle the majority of the brand development and recognition.

[Coleman]

Put me squarely in the camp of I don't care if they offer to pay us to take the BE name, I don't want it.  Just call it something like Heartland Atheletic Conference and get it over with. The Fox contract/promotion will handle the majority of the brand development and recognition.

Wow. Really? I don't think people realize the value of the conference brand. This is going to be on our jerseys, our court, and all of our merchandise.  Our coaches and players will be honored with "Coach of the Year" and "MVP" and "1st team" with the conference label attached to each. I'd actually argue that the conference brand we collectively maintain is just as important, if not more important than our individual mascots and nicknames.  

Heartland Athletic Conference sounds like a D2 conference.

People who say the brand doesn't matter, its the product.... Its not a logical argument. Then we might as well have kept the Gold, as long as our basketball team was still good. Obviously, the brand matters.  

[mu03eng]

Wow. Really? I don't think people realize the value of the conference brand. This is going to be on our jerseys, our court, and all of our merchandise. I'd actually argue that the conference brand we collectively maintain is just as important, if not more important than our individual mascots and nicknames.  

Heartland Athletic Conference sounds like a D2 conference.

I agree that the brand is critical, but I just don't think the Big East has any real value to it anymore.  Especially if the remaining Big East teams are willing to sell it.  Now they might be trying to fleece us, but I think they would just as soon start over with a new conference definition as keep Big East.

I will spend more than 30 seconds coming up with my next suggestion Vic 

[Tugg Speedman]

Heartland Athletic Conference sounds like a D2 conference.

That is the problem with a new name ... any name invented, no matter how well research, will SOUND LIKE a mid-major (or worse D2) conference.  The conference name matters.  Even Big Priest sounds mid-major.

When scrolling through your list of basketball games on you TV's guide, how many actually go beyond the ESPN channels?  And if you do, and you're you are not a direct fan of C7 schools, and you see way over on channel 692, miles from ESPN is "Heartland Athletic Basketball" you are going to think this is an equal version of Missouri Valley Basketball?  Are you going to care?  Now if it says "Big East Basketball" will that get the casual fan's attention?  I say yes.

If we have the chance to get and established name like the Big East, take it.  I cannot believe Fox does not care.

[Tugg Speedman]

I agree that the brand is critical, but I just don't think the Big East has any real value to it anymore.  Especially if the remaining Big East teams are willing to sell it.  Now they might be trying to fleece us, but I think they would just as soon start over with a new conference definition as keep Big East.

I will spend more than 30 seconds coming up with my next suggestion Vic 

The remaining Big East schools are trying to crate a Football Conference.  The Big East name has little value for football.

[Coleman]

Fair fair.

I do think they should keep the Big East and rebrand it. New logo. Redesign it to give it an urban/hoops feel.

Or even better...go back to the old school logo from the basketball only days: http://marquette.scout.com/2/735993.html

[Warrior_2002]

I'd rather they spend money puffing up a new conference name then pay for the Big East name.  But do understand that the Big East has a lot of clout. I guess I'd be more in favor of paying for the Big East name if the Madison Square Garden conference tourney rights came with it.  MSG = Big East and without it, it just seems strange.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

Using the Big East name only invites discussion of how it was once the best conference and is not anymore.

The NIT was once the best tournament in basketball. What is their brand worth today?

If we keep "Big East" we might as well start playing with red, white and blue basketballs.

[Silkk the Shaka]

Using the Big East name only invites discussion of how it was once the best conference and is not anymore.

The NIT was once the best tournament in basketball. What is their brand worth today?

If we keep "Big East" we might as well start playing with red, white and blue basketballs.

I get the argument, just not sure I agree.  I think college basketball media will spin it as a return to the Big East's basketball-only roots.  And while the name has been tarnished on the football side, I think it still has a lot of value on the basketball side.  We're still looked at as one of the top 2 or 3 conferences.  Plus, with Georgetown & MU potentially coming in at 1 & 2 in the last year of the conference, and MU positioned to be REALLY good in the future, we will have the high-end teams needed to sustain the reputation.



Frankly, I can't see why the new football teams would even WANT the Big East name it's so toxic for football.

[mu03eng]

Fair fair.

I do think they should keep the Big East and rebrand it. New logo. Redesign it to give it an urban/hoops feel.

Or even better...go back to the old school logo from the basketball only days: http://marquette.scout.com/2/735993.html

I'm perfectly fine with this, assuming its a relatively low price.  And if we do take Big East, I think going old school and "back to the roots" is a must.  IMO, MUCH MUCH MUCH more critical is having the tourney at MSG than the Big East name.

[Pakuni]

I agree that the brand is critical, but I just don't think the Big East has any real value to it anymore.  Especially if the remaining Big East teams are willing to sell it.  Now they might be trying to fleece us, but I think they would just as soon start over with a new conference definition as keep Big East.

I will spend more than 30 seconds coming up with my next suggestion Vic  

This.
I'm not necessarily opposed to keeping the name, but I think its value is being overstated. While the Big East is known for its glory days as a hoops conference, it's also known today as a bloated league of competing and varied interests that was picked apart and left to die by superior conferences. As much as we'd be attaching ourselves to the glory days, we'd also be attaching ourselves to the present day reality.
Also, no matter how good the new conference is, it'll always fall short of what the BE was in its glory days, so we're setting ourselves up to perpetually fail in comparison. You can bet that during many broadcasts of new BE games would we hear some variation of "I remember when the Big East included powerhouse programs like Syracuse and Connecticut."

[mu03eng]

This.
I'm not necessarily opposed to keeping the name, but I think its value is being overstated. While the Big East is known for its glory days as a hoops conference, it's also known today as a bloated league of competing and varied interests that was picked apart and left to die by superior conferences. As much as we'd be attaching ourselves the the glory days, we'd also be attaching ourselves to the present day reality of the conference.
Also, no matter how good the new conference is, it'll always fall short of what the BE was in its glory days, so we're setting ourselves up to perpetually fail in comparison.

Agree, never compete with your own brand....see coke and new coke.

[kmwtrucks]

When you talk to people from other Conf's they see the Big East as a power in Basketball.  I think if we can move quickly and add 3-5 strong teams we can keep it as a stong BBALL idenity.  Any new name will have no identity.

Also what are people's thoughts of having Gonzaga as a 13 member in men's basketball only? I'm starting to think it might be a good idea if they are willing to do it. 

[GGGG]

When you talk to people from other Conf's they see the Big East as a power in Basketball.  I think if we can move quickly and add 3-5 strong teams we can keep it as a stong BBALL idenity.  Any new name will have no identity.

Also what are people's thoughts of having Gonzaga as a 13 member in men's basketball only? I'm starting to think it might be a good idea if they are willing to do it. 

It's been discussed here repeatedly.  Who is going to take their non-basketball sports, and why would they take them?

[warriorchick]

Yes.  Good call.  I would have preferred that, or Golden Avalanche, any day.  (And yeah, I know that Golden Avalanche was not an official nickname.)

Hey......

If Golden Avalanche was never our official nickname, who can say we can't bring it back as an unofficial nickname?

After all, The Georgia Institute of Technology's official nickname is the Yellowjackets, but most people know them as the Rambling Wreck of Georgia Tech.

[kmwtrucks]

Boise state and SD state found someone to take them.  I'm sure for the right $ amount a Conf would take them or let them stay. 

Lets say Zags get 1 MIL now from TV, and they would get 3 mil from Fox's. Maybe they pay the Conf 750K to take there other sports?  and 250K more in travel. They are still 1 MIL up.

That would mean 9 of the 11 or 12 other schools would have to make 1 trip out west per year.

I think if we really want to compete with ACC, BIG TEN, SEC, BIG 12, PAC 12, Bringing in ZAGS would help Bridge the gap way more then Dayton or Richmond. 

[MUMountin]

Anyone have any info about the creation/development of the Mountain West brand--that has to be the closest comparator that we have in recent history of the creation of a new brand.  Any case studies out there on it?  What is it worth?

In my opinion, I'd say it is only in recent years that the MWC has been able to raise its brand to the point of being recognized as probably the top conference outside of the power 6.  And that is a good decade after the conference was created--and in conference that benefitted from brand recognition during both the basketball and football seasons.

[Warrior_2002]

I'm perfectly fine with this, assuming its a relatively low price.  And if we do take Big East, I think going old school and "back to the roots" is a must.  IMO, MUCH MUCH MUCH more critical is having the tourney at MSG than the Big East name.

I completely agree whole-heartedly.  Only bad thing is that it doesn't look like you will see Jay Bilas on the sidelines announcing the tourney.  And he loves Marquette.  He's been big on Marquette since Tom Crean first came there.  Also hope that Bill Raftery will be able to get the color commentating job for a few "Catholic 7" games...tourney or regular season.