2012 MLB Thread

[ChicosBailBonds]

I love when people say that.  Historically speaking, it just isn't true.  RBIs are a good judge of offensive production.  It is also typically accompanied by someone championing the merits of some bogus stat like park adjusted OPS. 

The guys that get RBIs are typically hitting in a particular spot in the order.  The reason they are there, is because they are the best hitters.  They also typically hit for power and extra base hits and thrive with runners on base. 

For example Cabrera hit .356 with RISP, he had an OBP of .424 and slugged .580.

Compared with Trout's line of .324/.393/.559

Cabrera was better across the board with runners on base. 

Cabrera also led Trout in SLG% and OPS.  Trout had a very slim lead in OBP.

At the same time, you don't put Trout in the 3 spot when he can run like he does.  As such, his RBI opportunities are going to be far less for two reasons.  First, his first at bat no one is on ahead of him = less RBI.  Second, in subsequent at bats he follows the 7, 8 , 9 hitters = less RBI potential.

Putting Trout at the 3 spot would take away a tremendous amount of run producing opportunities for the rest of the team because of OBP and what he does when he's already on base...stealing bases, going from 1st to 3rd, stretching singles into doubles.   

But again, I thought MVP was more about just hitting but the argument for keeps coming back to one thing...hitting. It's as if he was DH that wouldn't hurt him at all because the other stuff apparently doesn't count. 

[buckchuckler]

At the same time, you don't put Trout in the 3 spot when he can run like he does.  As such, his RBI opportunities are going to be far less for two reasons.  First, his first at bat no one is on ahead of him = less RBI.  Second, in subsequent at bats he follows the 7, 8 , 9 hitters = less RBI potential.

Putting Trout at the 3 spot would take away a tremendous amount of run producing opportunities for the rest of the team because of OBP and what he does when he's already on base...stealing bases, going from 1st to 3rd, stretching singles into doubles.  

But again, I thought MVP was more about just hitting but the argument for keeps coming back to one thing...hitting. It's as if he was DH that wouldn't hurt him at all because the other stuff apparently doesn't count.  

Obviously he had less RBI opportunities, that is certainly true.  That is when the ratio stats come in handy.  In their opportunities with runners in scoring position, and with men on base, Cabrera had a higher BA, OBP, and SLG.  So it isn't just that he had more opportunities.  He was better when he had the opportunities.

And just because a guy can run doesn't mean he shouldn't hit in the middle of the order.  See Mickey Mantle, Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Matt Kemp, Ryan Braun, Alex Rodriguez, Barry (and Bobby) Bonds, Jose Canseco, Jeff Bagwell, Vlad, Beltran, David Wright, and a whole bunch of other guys.

He didn't hit in the middle of the order because they had other more proven guys to hit there. More accurately, there were guys being paid a crap load to hit in those spots.

[CTWarrior]

The year that Ted Williams won the triple crown but finished second (by one point) to DiMaggio, one of the NY beat writers failed to put Williams in his top 10, as he thought Ted was a jerk.  

Ted Williams won the triple crown TWICE and didn't win the MVP either time.  He also didn't win the MVP the year he hit .406, despite leading the league in AVG, OBP, SLG, OPS, OPS+, R, HR and BB.  In both his triple crown years he also led the league in OBP, SLG, OPS, OPS+ (not that anyone knew what OPS or OPS+ was), TB, BB and R.

[jesmu84]

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121129&content_id=40462424&vkey=pr_chc&c_id=chc

a 25 year old director of operations? 25?! f***! i'm 28. what am i doing with my life?

[Benny B]

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121129&content_id=40462424&vkey=pr_chc&c_id=chc

a 25 year old director of operations? 25?! f***! i'm 28. what am i doing with my life?

The only job in MLB that's worse than any job with the Cubs is Season Ticket Sales Rep for the Marlins.

[wadesworld]

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121129&content_id=40462424&vkey=pr_chc&c_id=chc

a 25 year old director of operations? 25?! f***! i'm 28. what am i doing with my life?

You're more than likely more qualified than this guy is for the job.

[MerrittsMustache]

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121129&content_id=40462424&vkey=pr_chc&c_id=chc

a 25 year old director of operations? 25?! f***! i'm 28. what am i doing with my life?

I assume he's related to Crane Kenney.

[🏀]

You think he's getting Howard or Fielder money?

It ain't happening without team friendly opt-outs when it comes to substances and injuries.

Wow I couldn't have been more wrong.

Hamilton gets $125m for 5 years.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Wow I couldn't have been more wrong.

Hamilton gets $125m for 5 years.

You and me both...I'm in shock and I follow the Halos very closely.  Absolutely shocked.  Not sure I like the deal.  Another outfielder, we have no pitching other than Weaver, we play in a pitcher's ballpark where power hitters come to die.  Interesting times.  The only thing I can think of is the Doyers nonsense down the road with their $6 billion tv deal has Arte feeling nervous so he wants to make sure the Halos are still a topic of conversation.  That's the only thing I can think of at this point.

[🏀]

You and me both...I'm in shock and I follow the Halos very closely.  Absolutely shocked.  Not sure I like the deal.  Another outfielder, we have no pitching other than Weaver, we play in a pitcher's ballpark where power hitters come to die.  Interesting times.  The only thing I can think of is the Doyers nonsense down the road with their $6 billion tv deal has Arte feeling nervous so he wants to make sure the Halos are still a topic of conversation.  That's the only thing I can think of at this point.

I still think they get Dickey as well, which is okay, right? I just fail to get excited about him.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Looks like $25M for 5 for Hamilton.

Wasn't there a debate about this earlier this summer?

[jmayer1]

You and me both...I'm in shock and I follow the Halos very closely.  Absolutely shocked.  Not sure I like the deal.  Another outfielder, we have no pitching other than Weaver, we play in a pitcher's ballpark where power hitters come to die.  Interesting times.  The only thing I can think of is the Doyers nonsense down the road with their $6 billion tv deal has Arte feeling nervous so he wants to make sure the Halos are still a topic of conversation.  That's the only thing I can think of at this point.

Still think the Angels only invest in homegrown talent?

[ChicosBailBonds]

I still think they get Dickey as well, which is okay, right? I just fail to get excited about him.

Dickey does not excite me.   

[ChicosBailBonds]

Still think the Angels only invest in homegrown talent?

Did I say that or did I say most of their talent was homegrown...which at the time it was.

Even looking at this team

Weaver...All Star...home grown
Richards...starting pitcher...home grown
Trumbo..All Star...home grown
Trout...All Star...home grown
Kendrick..2B...home grown
Aybar...SS...home grown
Bourjos...OF...home grown...of course now he or Trumbo aren't going to start so who knows.
Morales...DH...home grown

Unfortunately we got rid of Napoli, Lackey, Santana in the past few seasons or it would be even more so. 

In the past it was even more so, but when half your team of starters are home grown that isn't too shabby.  At one point a few years ago 7 of the 9 players out there were home grown.

That's one of the reasons I don't like some of these free agency moves.  Our best players over time have always been home grown.

Molina, Joyner, Trout, Morales, Finley, Percival, Glaus, Remy, Salmon, Edmonds, Erstad, Witt, Tanana, Shields, etc. 

[buckchuckler]

Wow I couldn't have been more wrong.

Hamilton gets $125m for 5 years.

Told you 

[🏀]

Told you 

You sir were correct. Hats off.

Everyone wins in a LA arms race!

[buckchuckler]

You sir were correct. Hats off.

Everyone wins in a LA arms race!

It has to turn out better for the baseball teams than it did for the Lakers, right?

[ChicosBailBonds]

It has to turn out better for the baseball teams than it did for the Lakers, right?

I'm loving the Lakers implosion with every game, but I wouldn't be surprised if they don't make a turnaround as well.

[tower912]

Anibal Sanchez stays with the Tigers.   Top 4 in the rotation will be Verlander, Scherzer, Fister, Sanchez.    If they stay healthy, they will be very good. 

[buckchuckler]

Does that seem like preposterous money for Sanchez?  Yikes. 

[tower912]

It is ridiculous money for everybody.   The Dodgers overpaid for Greinke and set the bar for this year's class of pitchers.   Can you imagine what Verlander gets when he becomes a free agent after '14?

[MerrittsMustache]

There's not a lot of quality pitching out there, especially in free agency. Sanchez is only 28, has a career ERA of 3.75, has good control, keeps the ball in the ballpark and has averaged 196 IP the last 3 seasons. In today's market, that's worth $15M/season.

[tower912]

I want to see the Tigers package Porcello, Peralta, and Boesch for a shortstop with range.   I don't care if the guy is a .240 hitter.   

[MUBurrow]

I want to see the Tigers package Porcello, Peralta, and Boesch for a shortstop with range.   I don't care if the guy is a .240 hitter.   

would they have any interest in Trumbo? seems to be some sort of match between the two teams that just spent huge with the Angels needing to fill in their rotation.

[ChicosBailBonds]

would they have any interest in Trumbo? seems to be some sort of match between the two teams that just spent huge with the Angels needing to fill in their rotation.

No interest in giving up Trumbo.  Bourjes yes, not Trumbo.  I think a deal with the Mets is in the works which doesn't make me happy, but one of our outfielders is going.  Trumbo has a hole in his swing but when he is on he is really on.  Peter is an insane outfielder, arguably one of the 3 best defensively there is.  Great speed, but light on the stick.

Last thing I want to do is give Trumbo to a team that has Miggy and Fielder.