MUBB, athletics and academics, etc.

[Dawson Rental]

I don't see this as bad news for MU hoops, and probably isn't bad for Jamail in long run, either.

I didn't say that you did.  Evidently, Marquette released it so that it would have less of an opportunity to be noticed, so MU must view it as something that puts in university in a negative light.

[Lennys Tap]

Don't tell murobrob or madtown that, they've already decided that these are the new standards, and we should be happy to lose the numskulls who can't make them.

Maybe MadtownWarrior should change his handle to MadtownBadger.

[Dawson Rental]

huh?    shoot the dog dude....shoot the dog.

LOL.  It took years, but finally someone said it.

[Da 'Lanche]

LOL.  It took years, but finally someone said it.

I notice the details, brother, I notice

have a good night....I don't post much but appreciate the discussions...it is all good as we all do have a passion for MU and MU Hoops.

[Lennys Tap]

I'll tell you what will (and should) start a shytstorm around here. If Vander and/or others are stytcanned but can tranfer to other D1 programs because they are meeting UW, Indiana and N Carolina type standards we all should be up in arms. It would mean a death knell for the program in addition to being retroactively unfair to the student athletes we recruited, accepted and allegedly gave a shyte about.

[Dawson Rental]

I'll tell you what will (and should) start a shytstorm around here. If Vander and/or others are stytcanned but can tranfer to other D1 programs because they are meeting UW, Indiana and N Carolina type standards we all should be up in arms. It would mean a death knell for the program in addition to being retroactively unfair to the student athletes we recruited, accepted and allegedly gave a shyte about.

IMO, it would be nothing less than the BOT using student athletes to try and score a PR coup.

[TallTitan34]

I am stuck in a foreign country with many dollars. I can only get out if you send $1000 to me.  I will share my fortune with you for your trouble.

I'm fairly certain this will work as people here seem to believe everything they hear, no matter how insane.

[seakm4]

I'm sad to see him go, bit I can't say it was much of a surprise.  I hope he sees time at a school that is a good fit for him.  He always had a great attitude considering his high h.s. ranking and getting stuck with a bench role here.  Best of luck to you jamailman.

[brewcity77]

I am stuck in a foreign country with many dollars. I can only get out if you send $1000 to me.  I will share my fortune with you for your trouble.

I'm fairly certain this will work as people here seem to believe everything they hear, no matter how insane.

Please message me your address, is it okay if I make the check out to "Cash"?

[GGGG]

Good idea. Wait till later and then I'll tell you if what I'm hinting at is accurate or not.

I mentioned the name to four Scoopers in PM.  When it is announced, I am sure they will be able to verify if I was correct.

[4everwarriors]

I don't have an issue with the raising of academic standards for the athletes as long as the academic standards are raised for all students as well. Hell, who can argue against that? However, what I suspect has happened, particularly under Buzz' watch, is the caliper of student athlete recruited, has been dummied down. All select academic institutions have athletes who don't match the profile of the university. Happens at Duke, Stanford, Northwestern, etc. Its all relative.
Marquette is a middle of the road school. Nothing wrong with that. But, if the vision of Pilarz and BOT is to rise the school's profile in the eyes of U.S. News, then the new student athlete standards must follow in lockstep. Obviously, this makes Buzz' job that must tougher. Something's gonna give. Wishing both MU and Buzz the best of luck.

[brewcity77]

Marquette is a middle of the road school. Nothing wrong with that. But, if the vision of Pilarz and BOT is to rise the school's profile in the eyes of U.S. News, then the new student athlete standards must follow in lockstep. Obviously, this makes Buzz' job that must tougher. Something's gonna give. Wishing both MU and Buzz the best of luck.

I don't know...it's hard to argue against tougher academic standards, but we graduate 91% of our basketball players and 80% of African-American basketball players. I can't imagine 10-13 scholarship athletes that are graduating at that rate are going to have any measureable negative impact on our overall academic statistics.

It's a drop in the bucket and we're already doing very well in regards to the academic success of our basketball team. Really not sure tougher standards are needed there.

[avid1010]

again - if anyone cant make a 1.9, does not deserve a scholarship...

it's never that easy...which is why i hate black and white rules. 

[Blackhat]

some kids do have learning disabilities....higher rate from low socio-economic background.

[GGGG]

again - if anyone cant make a 1.9, does not deserve a scholarship...

They are getting an athletic-grant-in-aid to play basketball....not a scholarship based on their academic performance.

[ATWizJr]

Got a feeling that this is not going to end well.  We are going to lose player(s) and maybe our coach.  

[jsglow]

some kids do have learning disabilities....higher rate from low socio-economic background.

Really going there?  So this is now a program for the learning disabled (so long as they're a Top 60 prospect)?

There is balance in everything.  I take pride in all that is MU.  Hoops and academics.  I'm believe in the notion that acceptable grades and real progress toward one's degree is a prerequisite to athletic participation. Trust me, acceptable grades and progress toward one's degree is a constant refrain in my household where I now write two tuition checks to our beloved institution.  If MU leadership felt that academic standards had slipped and therefore needed to bump (or more vigorously enforce) the threshold a bit, I fully understand.  But I do agree with the notion that individual student athletes should be given some time to meet the new standards.

[madtownwarrior]

i thought they were "student-athletes" or are you saying it's just now "athletes"

you suggest I should become a badger fan - I don't like the badgers but I think I now understand where badger fans get their material for academic jokes about MU basketball now...

They are getting an athletic-grant-in-aid to play basketball....not a scholarship based on their academic performance.

[jsglow]

Got a feeling that this is not going to end well.  We are going to lose player(s) and maybe our coach.  

I suppose that depends on the definition of 'ends well'.

Look.  Back in the day, Glen went to class, studied for and passed his exams and ultimately earned his degree after making the choice to head for the NBA one year early.  This year he was named MU alumni of the year.  More recently, Wes was featured in the annual hardcover basketball publication proudly holding his diploma.  Jimmy and Joe walked across the stage in December.  Jimmy's making a mint playing for the Bulls and just as importantly Joe has landed his first professional job down in Texas.  Those stories ought to be the norm, not the exception.

[cheebs09]

First to the topic of the thread, I'm sad to see Jamail go. I've always been optimistic about him and thought he had the body, athleticism, and game to be a pretty good player. He just didn't seem to get it defensively and that may have hurt his confidence. Hopefully wherever he goes, he can put it together. I'll be rooting for him.

As far as the current topic of the thread, I'm pretty angry if true. The academic standards seem to be pretty low, but that's consistent with everywhere as shown earlier in the thread. With all the help the players get, unless they have a learning disability, they should be able to meet those with no problems. However, the part I'm really mad about is if it is true that they changed these mid-year and you have to get there by the end of the semester. It isn't always easy to drastically change a GPA in one semester.

I don't think it is any secret that many of the basketball players probably wouldn't be admitted as normal students. However, I can't help but think of Al's quote, "Use basketball, don't let it use you." A lot of these kids come from pretty tough childhoods. They also don't necessarily get a great education growing up and may be behind. For a lot of kids (not just at Marquette), basketball is a means of getting a great education and bettering their life. It may allow them the exposure to go pro, but most importantly, they get a degree. Look at Joe Fulce's quotes in that article from CNN. He was able to get a job in Dallas due to his Marquette education.

Now the increased academic standards may be a way to do an even better job of the above, but to kind of pull the rug out from under kids as it seems, is just wrong and seems to go against what I thought MU was about.

[NersEllenson]

I don't have an issue with the raising of academic standards for the athletes as long as the academic standards are raised for all students as well. Hell, who can argue against that? However, what I suspect has happened, particularly under Buzz' watch, is the caliper of student athlete recruited, has been dummied down. All select academic institutions have athletes who don't match the profile of the university. Happens at Duke, Stanford, Northwestern, etc. Its all relative.
Marquette is a middle of the road school. Nothing wrong with that. But, if the vision of Pilarz and BOT is to rise the school's profile in the eyes of U.S. News, then the new student athlete standards must follow in lockstep. Obviously, this makes Buzz' job that must tougher. Something's gonna give. Wishing both MU and Buzz the best of luck.

Agree with a lot of what you write here - but the irony is that Marquette's profile nationally will slide if the hoops team goes to crap.  Most Americans can't place Marquette in Milwaukee as it is, and the way most Americans know Marquette is - Oh, they always have a good basketball team, right?  Same with Gonzaga.  BOT and Pilarz better realize MU is never going to be Duke, Stanford, Notre Dame, Northwestern - and reducing the profile of the basketball team/national awareness through the tightening of academic standards for athletes/basketball players - is only going reduce the number of applications of interested students coming to MU.  The fewer applications, the fewer bright minds enrolling at MU (to an extent).

[Dr. Blackheart]

you suggest I should become a badger fan - I don't like the badgers but I think I now understand where badger fans get their material for academic jokes about MU basketball now...

From the the Badgers 50% basketball graduation rate?  This is not just a MU problem.  In fact MU is better than most.  I doubt that anyone is questioning the move to raise the bar...just when they are moving it.  First generation college students have a higher hill to climb as is known and has been published.  Many schools are adding in special programs to help these kids and their families adjust...it usually takes a couple of years to assimilate.  Saw Mrs. DJO at NCAA's walking up the stands after a MU win and fans were congratulating her on her son's win.  She was patting the young kids on their head as she went telling them to study in school.  She will be proud in a couple of weeks and so will I.

[Blackhat]

I suppose that depends on the definition of 'ends well'.

Look.  Back in the day, Glen went to class, studied for and passed his exams and ultimately earned his degree after making the choice to head for the NBA one year early.  This year he was named MU alumni of the year.  More recently, Wes was featured in the annual hardcover basketball publication proudly holding his diploma.  Jimmy and Joe walked across the stage in December.  Jimmy's making a mint playing for the Bulls and just as importantly Joe has landed his first professional job down in Texas.  Those stories ought to be the norm, not the exception.

our players are graduating at a high clip though.   Would jimmy and joe have graduated with these new standards?

[brewcity77]

you suggest I should become a badger fan - I don't like the badgers but I think I now understand where badger fans get their material for academic jokes about MU basketball now...

You do? Is it from their 50% basketball graduation rate (MU is at 91%) or the 29% black basketball student-athlete graduation rate (MU is at 80%). Or maybe the laughable assertion that their curriculum is "harder", hence why they are rated better academically (when the actual reason is their research programs that have zero bearing on the average undergrad)?

The Badger fans get their material from being ignorant and uninformed. Their academic jokes about MU are just that -- a joke that shows how idiotic they are.

[MUBurrow]

FWIW, graduation rate and thew new academic standards are a somewhat apples to oranges comparison.  The new standards would make it harder to graduate, but (I'm sure the idea is that) those new, tougher standards would raise the reputation of MU and the value of the degree. Now I certainly don't see this coming to fruition as the BoT, Pilarz, etc might. But to reference the high graduation rate is question begging, when the implicit accusation from the higher ups is that MU is just pushing these kids through. Their counterargument to the conversation here will undoubtedly be that while the grad rate is high, that doesnt mean anything when the standards are so low that kids are graduating without ever having to rise to the level of knowledge that should be requisite for their degree.

Not sure I agree with the above, but its important to recognize that the grad rates don't speak to the issue at hand.