why can't vander finish?!

[NivBerkowitz]

Nice to finally see some fans realize what I've been saying for a year and half.  Just because you're athletic doesn't mean you can play basketball.  Dodd, why haven't you banned all these fans comments like a 5 year old taking away his toy because he doesn't agree with you like you did earlier this year?  If Vander Bust scores more than Mayo in Big East play I'll treat you to an all you can drink of your choice at any bar of your choice.  TGIF's has Appletini's, right?  There's a difference in being a true fan and being a homer with blinders on.  Leave the basement once in awhile and actually watch the games with partial fans, you might learn something.  Sure I'll be banned again after this post because freedom of speech doesn't exist on this site so won't read the follow up comments but regardless of how much blue blows, Go MU!

[GGGG]

I have been a pretty staunch supporter of vander the last two years asking for patience as he is still young and has so much upside because of his athleticism.   He also, usually, does the unnoticed things well like defense, rebounding and not turning the ball over.  I thought he really showed progress at the Kohl hole this year and then the last few games he has really had miserable overall performances.   He is back to a lack of confidence in his offense and that carries over to his teammates who just do not look for him to contribute from the outside.  I know he was highly recruited.....but, the dude was ranked really high coming out of high school (which is weak in Wisconsin) and the AAU circuit where he thrived.   Take his name out of the equation....a top 25 (or so) recruit hitting his sophomore stride should be doing a LOT more for a team as a starter than being a liability on offense.  I still have hope, but, c'mon man....start showing something out there!  Even if it mimmicked his progress earlier in the year, I would take it.

+1.  He actually had a decent game against LSU, but UWM and Vandy were all around terrible.

[GGGG]

Nice to finally see some fans realize what I've been saying for a year and half.  Just because you're athletic doesn't mean you can play basketball.  Dodd, why haven't you banned all these fans comments like a 5 year old taking away his toy because he doesn't agree with you like you did earlier this year?  If Vander Bust scores more than Mayo in Big East play I'll treat you to an all you can drink of your choice at any bar of your choice.  TGIF's has Appletini's, right?  There's a difference in being a true fan and being a homer with blinders on.  Leave the basement once in awhile and actually watch the games with partial fans, you might learn something.  Sure I'll be banned again after this post because freedom of speech doesn't exist on this site so won't read the follow up comments but regardless of how much blue blows, Go MU!

What board do you think you are posting to?

[GGGG]

2-17 in his last 3 games.  I think a lot of people are expecting too much from him based on some good games against cupcakes.....exactly like last year.  I think Mayo needs to be seriously considered to start.  The only reason I would think about NOT starting Mayo is that he gives needed offensive punch off the bench with DG now starting,  but I have no doubt that Mayo is a more effective player.

Mayo played more minutes than Vander yesterday so Buzz might be agreeing with you.

[esotericmindguy]

Mayo played more minutes than Vander yesterday so Buzz might be agreeing with you.

Buzz must not know basketball if he's playing Mayo more then Blue....right Sultan? He's obviously focusing on one side of the court.

[godzilla]

It's pretty evident that Blue just can't cut it at the wing, so PG is the only place he may be effective.  I could see him doing a decent job penetrating and dishing off.

[GGGG]

Buzz must not know basketball if he's playing Mayo more then Blue....right Sultan? He's obviously focusing on one side of the court.

No...Mayo can defend.  Nice try though.

[Stretchdeltsig]

It seems that Vander has lost his confidence again.  He plays very tentative against good competition.  It's sad to watch him on a layup and not finish.  Vander was a negative factor last night.  We need him to be a positive contributing factor for MU to be successful this year. 

[esotericmindguy]

No...Mayo can defend.  Nice try though.

Comical.

[Nukem2]

When Vander goes to the hoop, he needs to lay the ball off the glass authoritatively.  He tends to lob the ball rather than getting it firmly and squarely off the glass.

[Goose]

He needs to focus on the basics. I love hos potential and still a believer, but too much fancy stuff and not enough getting the job done. I'll take a two handed bounce pass over a one handed pass 30 feet from the basket.

[GGGG]

Comical.

What are you talking about?  Your entire basis for evaluating Vander is his inefficiencies on the offensive end without addressing what else he does on the defensive end.  Mayo might has well get increased minutes.  He brings some offense to the table without a serious drop off on the other side (except rebounding) *IF* Vander isn't defending as well or turning the ball over...which he hasn't the last two games.

So like a Vander drive, your point started with such promise, but you finished weak.  Work on your game some more and maybe someday you will be able to finish strong.

[MerrittsMustache]

It seems that Vander has lost his confidence again.  He plays very tentative against good competition.  It's sad to watch him on a layup and not finish.  Vander was a negative factor last night.  We need him to be a positive contributing factor for MU to be successful this year. 

Others have said this as well but I just don't see it. Vander doesn't look tentative to me and he certainly wasn't against Wisconsin (who would be considered "good competition"). Most of Vander's points come in transition. However, in these last few games, MU hasn't had very many transition opportunities, therefore Vander hasn't scored many points. He still looks to drive in the half court offense, but against athletic teams, he has a much harder time because they can play off of him due to his lack of an outside shot and there's really no place for him to go on drives because MU doesn't have many shooters to spread the floor and defenses can simply clog the lane.

[esotericmindguy]

What are you talking about?  Your entire basis for evaluating Vander is his inefficiencies on the offensive end without addressing what else he does on the defensive end.  Mayo might has well get increased minutes.  He brings some offense to the table without a serious drop off on the other side (except rebounding) *IF* Vander isn't defending as well or turning the ball over...which he hasn't the last two games.

So like a Vander drive, your point started with such promise, but you finished weak.  Work on your game some more and maybe someday you will be able to finish strong.

Its ok to be wrong once in a while Sultan, my point was he wasn't injured and that he's just a "marginal player". I also stated that don't expect much from him in the conference because he's not there yet. You and Mac jumped down my throat claiming I didn't understand basketball and that he does so much on the court on that stats can't provide. Yet he's losing minutes to a freshman.

Apparently Buzz doesn't know basketball.

[GGGG]

Its ok to be wrong once in a while Sultan, my point was he wasn't injured and that he's just a "marginal player". I also stated that don't expect much from him in the conference because he's not there yet. You and Mac jumped down my throat claiming I didn't understand basketball and that he does so much on the court on that stats can't provide. Yet he's losing minutes to a freshman.

Apparently Buzz doesn't know basketball.

I am not wrong.  He has not been doing those things on the court the last two games.

[esotericmindguy]

I am not wrong.  He has not been doing those things on the court the last two games.

K.

[We R Final Four]

VB was the co-leader in turnovers last night, and several missed layups without a possibility of an offen. board essentially is a turnover.  His defensive can't continue to hide 1-7 from the floor, including 0-2 from 3 pt land.  This can't be the great jump you expected between his Frosh and Soph year, is it?

[ErickJD08]

Confidence.  How the heck can he be confident?  Every time he drives, its a miss, blocked layup into the third row, or a turnover.  What is there to be confident about?  But this last loss is not on Vander, it is on the team leaders.  If you are a leader on the court, you can't score 6 points in the first 10 minutes of the game on your home court.  Just as critical a leader is at crunch time, the leader is critical to make some plays during that drought in the beginning.

The team needs a third scorer.  People can try and look to JC but the problem is that he came in as a pass first PG and forcing him to be third scorer is not going to work.  Unfortunately, this team is looking at a freshmen to be that guy.  As much as guys like to twist stats, Blue was brought in to be a 5 star player.  A player that can be a top player on the team.  He is not so now we are looking for that third guy and right now, its Mayo.  Thank goodness we have that kid and he looks ready to contribute.  I just think it is asking alot from a freshmen to be the number 3 scorer.

I hate the BS on this board where you pipe in some criticism and people jump all over you.  Facts are facts.  Blue was recruited to be a certain type of player.  Butler and Buycks left this year.  Crowder and DJO leave this year.  Blue was recruited to be that next player in line.  He is so far from being that player.

[ErickJD08]

VB was the co-leader in turnovers last night, and several missed layups without a possibility of an offen. board essentially is a turnover.  His defensive can't continue to hide 1-7 from the floor, including 0-2 from 3 pt land.  This can't be the great jump you expected between his Frosh and Soph year, is it?

Can we compare sophomore stats between Blue, Wade, and McNeal again?  That would be fun.

[RJax55]

Unfortunately, Vander is a product of very poor youth coaching, and it is now coming back to bite him big time.

The reason why he struggles so much against quality (high-major) competition is that he can't drive the basketball. And he can't drive it because he plays too upright. That's why he gets cut off going baseline so much. His defender beats him to the spot.

It takes more than just quickness to drive the basketball. You need proper body technique. Guys that are good at penetrating get lower to the floor and have their bodies learning towards the basket. They can get on the defenders hip and then turn/position themselves by them. Similar to an outside pass rusher in football.

Vander is unable to make that turn because he is so high. Instead he relies on his natural quickness and using his off arm to shield the defender. This works against lower competition, but not against athletic guys who can move their feet. Unless his technique changes, he will struggle driving past guys, especially on the wing.

[Les Nessman]

Are you really Robert Jackson?

[Doctor J]

Why is Vander getting so many minutes when playing so poorly?  Was he promised minutes?

[GGGG]

Why is Vander getting so many minutes when playing so poorly?  Was he promised minutes?

He has really only played poorly the last two games.

[MerrittsMustache]

He has really only played poorly the last two games.

Not true. Vander only plays well when he scores in double-figures. If he doesn't do that then he's useless, has obviously been promised playing time and will likely transfer at season's end.

[Stretchdeltsig]

Tomorrow's game against Villanova will tell a lot.