Vote: Should Buzz Leave MU?

[Windyplayer]

See, I have no problem with this poll, but can we please choose better titles?  No wonder people come here and think everyone is negative.  How about just "Buzz Poll", or "Is buzz the shiznit?".

Now we have two threads, by well intentioned folks, that give the immediate impression that MU hates Buzz.  *sigh*

Couldn't agree any more.

[Henry Sugar]

now, what really is the point of this poll?!? 

If nothing else, it helps establish that the vast majority of fans on this board want Buzz to stick around and think MU is better off with him around.

It's useful to keep that in context when people are critical of Buzz.

Title of the poll should have been better, though.

[Mr. Nielsen]

In Buzz we trust!

[Lighthouse 84]

To paraphrase Gomer Pyle when talking to Barney, "What a dumb poll. Barney, don't you ever call me dumb again."

I voted no.

[Spaniel with a Short Tail]

I agree with Rocky.  This is a horrendous poll title.  The whole idea that this season is a failure and Buzz should consider leaving - or MU consider canning him - because of it is preposterous.  Votes other than "No" should be disregarded.

[willie warrior]

I have seen you say "likely 9-9 this year" in a couple different threads.  Out of curiousity, which teams are the three losses against?  @UConn, @ Seton Hall?  Who do you think we lose to at home?

St. John's, UCONN and @SH. I am not saying this will happen, but that is my feeling. And even if we beat SH both games, what about Cinncy. I will be very happy if we go 4-2, and beyond that would be gravy. But look how we have played the last two games. Defensively, FT's, etc.

[willie warrior]

Good news! We've already seen improvement! Checked the records and we now are 12-6 in 2008-09 and 11-7 in 2009-10. If we can get 2010-11 to 10-8 you'll be calling for a raise and an extention.

Sorry Lenny, my bad. You were right on the records. How quickly we forget. Point is, if we go 9-9, that would be even more of a drop off. No, I am not yet calling for a raise and extension---let's see how this season and next play out.

[chren21]

I would like to know who voted for him to leave.  As stated earlier if you voted for him to leave then you dont know big time bball...  And honestly I feel bad for you.

[Lighthouse 84]

I would like to know who voted for him to leave.  As stated earlier if you voted for him to leave then you dont know big time bball...  And honestly I feel bad for you.

Marquette65, Warriors1965, nomorebuycks would be three. Or is that one?

[avid1010]

It is not way too early. I voted no, and believe that he should get one more year. But we better see a significant improvement. Buzz in conference:
2008-09: 11-7 mostly with Crean's guys
2009-10: 10-8 a mixture of recruits
This year: Likely 9-9 with all Buzz recruits
And I do not mean pad the non conference with cupcakes.

In addition, we continue to fall behind the top BEAst teams in recruiting.

If we do not improve to compete for a conference title next year, then the jury should be in.

This is classic, Willie.  Rips Buzz and the team all the time, but then wants to give Buzz another year.  I've asked many times, if not Buzz, then who.  You've never offered any solutions on the topic, just that MU should compete for a conference title every year, and land every big time recruit that we go after.  If we're in the tourney most years, and every now and then we string together a team that can make a run at the BEAST championship (which would also mean the NCAA championship), and the coach has class, I'm happy. 

[willie warrior]

This is classic, Willie.  Rips Buzz and the team all the time, but then wants to give Buzz another year.  I've asked many times, if not Buzz, then who.  You've never offered any solutions on the topic, just that MU should compete for a conference title every year, and land every big time recruit that we go after.  If we're in the tourney most years, and every now and then we string together a team that can make a run at the BEAST championship (which would also mean the NCAA championship), and the coach has class, I'm happy. 

This is ridiculous to answer a question if not Buzz, who? Buzz has not left. It would depend on the time and who might be available and who would be interested. And there would be candidates out there. I do have problems that MU picks guys that have to learn on the job--Crean and Buzz. Yes I have ripped Buzz--because of games we lost that we should have won, and because of some of his recruiting blunders. This is an opinion board and he deserves criticism when there are screw ups, and he deserves praise when he does well. He has a lot of areas to improve upon on game coaching, player rotation, choice of starters, scheduling cupcakes, etc. He has been a fairly good recruiter, but there are concerns there also. I believe that next year should be final evaluation year. He must improve the down ward trend.

What is wrong with wanting us to make the dance every year, occasionally go deep, and competing for Beast titles? The guy is making a lot of money--a hell of a lot more than me so he should perform well.

I have never said that he should land every big time recruit out there as you alledge, but he should be landing some. What big time recruit has he landed? You could argue Crowder and possibly DJO who have been fine additions, but we really have not landed one big time recruit. And please do not count Vander as a big time recruit.

And by the way, our expectations are fairly similar, except I would like us to do better than "make a run  at the BEast championship" by occasionally wining one--either regular season or the tourney.

[reinko]

You realize William that winning Beast titles would mean we are are a top-5 program with all but sure #1 seed in the NCAA tourney.

[Steve Buscemi]

You realize William that winning Beast titles would mean we are are a top-5 program with all but sure #1 seed in the NCAA tourney.

Only on occasion.

[willie warrior]

Only on occasion.

That's right, I said occasionally. I would like to see us repeatedly be in the hunt for a title, but this is a great BB conference, and nobody is going to win it frequently, although it seems like several teams are almost always in the hunt the past several years: Pitt, Villanova, Loserville, UConn, Syracuse. We should be in that class. I don't care who their Coach is, those are the teams we should be beating/competing with for titles.

[akmarq]

We're playing one of the most important games of our season today and THIS is the top thread right now?

This is probably why people are critical of the quality of this board right now.

[chren21]

I love this board and enjoy reading it... I even thought nmb was a loser but really enjoyed his posts...  God bless the internet.  I think that those who think this has gone downhill need to open up thier mind.


edit... open up thier mind dosent make sense....  how about wake up to the year 2011

[Marquette84]

And please do not count Vander as a big time recruit.

I think its funny how both you and Lenny have made this point today.

Until today, I would have thought that such a comment would have been instantly opposed by Buzz's staunchest supporters.  Based on his top 30 ranking by some services, very positive comments in the press from Rosiak and Mac, and his selection to the U18 team with guys like Kyrie Irving and Austin Rivers.

But as Lenny pointed out, Vander did lose the POY in Wisconsin to Josh Gasser, and Lenny also claims that Vander peaked as a junior in HS, was dropping sigificantly in the rankings, and that everyone on this board (and Dodds board) were disappointed with him as early as last summer:

I followed Vander's recruiting fairly closely. His consensus ranking fell significantly from his junior to senior year, and his final ranking was close to DJ's and Diener's (with an arrow pointing down) and nowhere near Doc River's (top 10, maybe top 5). He was not the Wisconsin POY and he failed to lead his heavily favored team to the state title. His play in the summer league disappointed all of the posters here and at Dodds whom I saw comment. Sure there was euphoria on message boards - he was still top 50 (barely) and an in state recruit and some may have "mentioned" him with Butler, Wolf, etc - but he had a lot of work to do when he arrived at MU. Still does.

Lenny stopped short of calling him a recruting fail, but he certainly made the case  that Blue wasn't big-time recruit.

The funny thing is even though you're both making the same point--Lenny is doing it in order to support Buzz, and you're doing it to be critical.

[Stretchdeltsig]

What a terrible question to pose as a blog headline.  Can't be more negative.  MU84, you need to retire quietly.

[ChicosBailBonds]

But as Lenny pointed out, Vander did lose the POY in Wisconsin to Josh Gasser, and Lenny also claims that Vander peaked as a junior in HS, was dropping sigificantly in the rankings, and that everyone on this board (and Dodds board) were disappointed with him as early as last summer:

I thought T.J. Bray was Mr. Basketball for Wisconsin?  Or is there a POY and a Mr. Basketball in Wisconsin?

[Silkk the Shaka]

Didn't Cracked Sidewalks have a post about 5 star recruits? Something along the lines of that they rarely have the kind of instant impact that the 3 Amigos did, but that by their junior year (if they're still in college) they flat out dominate?  Blue's not even done with his freshman year, much less his junior.  Everyone writing Blue, Cadougan, Williams, Jones, even Fab Melo off because they aren't dominating as underclassmen couldn't possibly be dumber.

[GoldenWarrior]

He should not leave unless we can land an all time great type of a coach, which won't happen.  Therefore, Buzz should stay because I think he's the best we can get currently.

[GGGG]

I thought T.J. Bray was Mr. Basketball for Wisconsin?  Or is there a POY and a Mr. Basketball in Wisconsin?

I think there is a difference, but Bray won the award. 

[Lennys Tap]

I think its funny how both you and Lenny have made this point today.

Until today, I would have thought that such a comment would have been instantly opposed by Buzz's staunchest supporters.  Based on his top 30 ranking by some services, very positive comments in the press from Rosiak and Mac, and his selection to the U18 team with guys like Kyrie Irving and Austin Rivers.

But as Lenny pointed out, Vander did lose the POY in Wisconsin to Josh Gasser, and Lenny also claims that Vander peaked as a junior in HS, was dropping sigificantly in the rankings, and that everyone on this board (and Dodds board) were disappointed with him as early as last summer:

Lenny stopped short of calling him a recruting fail, but he certainly made the case  that Blue wasn't big-time recruit.

The funny thing is even though you're both making the same point--Lenny is doing it in order to support Buzz, and you're doing it to be critical.

My post was not to "support Buzz" and I never said that Blue wasn't a "big time recruit" (he was). And I never said that he peaked in his junior year. I just shared some facts that should have warned MU fans not to expect him to be a game changer as a freshman.  

[willie warrior]

I think its funny how both you and Lenny have made this point today.

Until today, I would have thought that such a comment would have been instantly opposed by Buzz's staunchest supporters.  Based on his top 30 ranking by some services, very positive comments in the press from Rosiak and Mac, and his selection to the U18 team with guys like Kyrie Irving and Austin Rivers.

But as Lenny pointed out, Vander did lose the POY in Wisconsin to Josh Gasser, and Lenny also claims that Vander peaked as a junior in HS, was dropping sigificantly in the rankings, and that everyone on this board (and Dodds board) were disappointed with him as early as last summer:

Lenny stopped short of calling him a recruting fail, but he certainly made the case  that Blue wasn't big-time recruit.

The funny thing is even though you're both making the same point--Lenny is doing it in order to support Buzz, and you're doing it to be critical.

he certainly is not a recruiting fail, and should turn out to be a fine player, but he is not a big time recruit.

[willie warrior]

He should not leave unless we can land an all time great type of a coach, which won't happen.  Therefore, Buzz should stay because I think he's the best we can get currently.

Be careful--there will be a day when "Its Indiana (ditto)" opens up.