P.C. Wins Again--Fighting Sioux Retired

[MUBurrow]

It sounds like there was widespread support among the Sioux for keeping the name & log, but the leaders of one tribe were opposed and refused to hold a referendum. That sealed the deal. Minority rules these days. 

For what its worth, when it comes to race issues, Minority does (and should) rule.  That is the essence of examining racial classifications/distinctions - that they are not up for majority vote or debate.  It undermines the whole process and value of examining racial issues to use majority opinions and votes, since that majority perspective is what causes racially discriminatory practices to be so pervasive in the first place.  In that way, eliciting majority vs. minority arguments sort of begs the question of the whole issue.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

So you have tyranny by the Minority.  A few misguided souls should not cause the rest to suffer. Sometime common sense and decency must prevail.(but I fear it will not)

[reinko]

So you have tyranny by the Minority.  A few misguided souls should not cause the rest to suffer. Sometime common sense and decency must prevail.(but I fear it will not)

Please explain how you are suffering because a college nickname change. 

[ATWizJr]

Since you're such an accomplished reader, never misinterpreting anything to make a silly point, maybe you can show me where I indicated reading books is a bad thing.

Uh, probably from where you indicated your disdain for people who form their opinion as a result of reading.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Chicos... for the past few years, I have basically agreed on every stance that you have... except for this one.

Now I am not stating that we need to trash all the names that have some sort of a derogatory term, but I guess I will state my opinion on the matter.

In my History class that I teach (U.S. History), we take a look at how history was, not how it was printed in a very American-Centered Thinking textbook (one of the main reasons why my class uses no text book.  We take a look at our history as a nation from the accounts themselves, primary sources, etc.

Having individuals dress up as Indians and dance around at halftime of a game, does that really tell the newer generation WHO the Sioux were, or Apache, etc.  Does it really show the newer generation the real side of the Sioux(I will use this one as this group is the one that is at the center of discussion)... I would find it hard to believe that many individuals who go to UND truly don't know the story of the Sioux, who they are, their customs, etc.  What does a mascot dancing at halftime, or tshirts with a logo of an indian headdress really do for the Sioux nation?

Call me a P.C. Liberal whatever, but if your argument is if we take away Indian names from sports, our newer generation won't know the Native Americans, then maybe we should give them the dignity they deserve, and explain how the Europeans slaughtered Native tribes, took their land, put them on showcase, put them in Circus shows and Buffalo Bill shows, and make a mockery of their lifestyle, because its not like "us".

Great post.

Also, in your last paragraph, I know none of us really want to admit that those things are true... but let's face it, they are.

The Natives were not all innocent, peaceful tribes like Hollywood sometimes portrays them... but that doesn't mean they were treated fairly or with any discretion.

EDIT: to be more specific, I think general names like "warriors" are obviously fine, but names like "redskins" is not really helping the cause. I'm not actively protesting against any or these names, but I'm not going to shed a tear when they get replaced.

[GGGG]

Great post.

Also, in your last paragraph, I know none of us really want to admit that those things are true... but let's face it, they are.

The Natives were not all innocent, peaceful tribes like Hollywood sometimes portrays them... but that doesn't mean they were treated fairly or with any discretion.

EDIT: to be more specific, I think general names like "warriors" are obviously fine, but names like "redskins" is not really helping the cause. I'm not actively protesting against any or these names, but I'm not going to shed a tear when they get replaced.

That is pretty much where I stand as well.  If people would have been respectful from the beginning, this would never have been an issue.  But instead, schools used obviously disrespectful imagery such as Willie Wampum, the dancing Illini, etc.  And now they are told to "get over it....it's just a name."  Give me a break.

[M@RQUETTEW@RRIORS]

The Mich st.  Spartan looks like a cartoon character.  he makes a mochery of the spartans
The eagle MU uses is especially close to one of our nations symbols.  how dare we use it
LSU has a tiger caged, the PETA people must be in outrage
Texas parades a long horn on the field for football games
the Duke Blue Devil deeply offends the Christian in me and makes a mochery or religion

All of these offend me

[brewcity77]

Since it's a Marquette forum, I'll center on us. I think that taking the Indian Head logo away would have been enough. There's plenty of Warriors icons that could have been perfectly acceptable. Personally, I always dreamed of a day that we would re-mold our sports imagery to the legendary Warriors movie from the 1970s. Imagine the BC going dark, then hearing the clink of glass bottles, slowly building, until the blood-curdling shout "Warriors, come out to play-yay!" as the team takes the court. Never happen at a Catholic school, but I still tried sending in a letter to the committee during the whole Gold fiasco.

I'd love to see Golden Warriors. Don't know what they'd go with as a mascot, but it would be a nice compromise between the recent history and the storied past of the university.